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Ford gone the route of VW?

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Old 01-10-2018, 02:11 PM
Wyldfire
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Old 01-10-2018, 02:17 PM
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Figures, just my luck. Bought a diesel VW Golf in 2013 and just got a new 6.7 a couple months ago...

Hopefully it's unfounded, I'd be much less likely to let go of this one.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 02:32 PM
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Seeing how well plaintiffs did in the VW TDI case, many lawyers are jumping on the bandwagon and testing diesels from almost every brand to see "if they are over the limit."

Frankly, while the TDI owners may have purchased their vehicles as part of a tree-hugging image, Ford Powerstroke owners are buying for raw towing power, of which the Powerstroke delivers. I've never heard any Ford marketing claims of "reduced real-world NOx" yet I've certainly heard the TDI "Clean Diesel" slogan.

Such claims are insanity, and a way to get a quick money grab by lawyers which end up costing the consumers in the end. The VW TDI was an excellent vehicle, and now VW no longer sells diesels. Instead, they are putting a lot of money into crappy electric cars. They were also fined by the EPA and had to spend billions on "universal electric vehicle charging infrastructure" that benefits anyone building crappy electric cars, not just VW. In my opinion, the consumer loses.

NOx measures are pretty silly. How much NOx is emitted by a vehicle that is older, or a gas engine? How much NOx is saved because the diesel uses less fuel? Nobody ever considered that the VW TDI cars could get 50mpg...and because people were getting 50mpg instead of 30mpg in a gas-powered sedan...how much NOx was reduced because we didn't need to pump as much oil from the ground, refine as much, transport as much, and burn as much? Very short sighted. The EPA got caught with its pants down and tried to make an example of VW while simultaneously promoting its liberal electric vehicle agenda. Shame.

Keep in mind there were similar claims made against the Duramax back some months ago, and nothing has come of it.

The "order of the catalytic" is meaningless. Ford's pickup trucks go DOC-SCR-DPF while chassis cabs go DOC-DPF-SCR. It does not matter, the DPF is a filter that catches all particles that pass through it, regardless of what position it is located in.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 02:47 PM
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Diesels produce more NOx than gas engine regardless of fuel economy. It's just the nature of the beast. And clean, lean burning diesels, create more NOx than dirty ones. All you can do to combat NOx is reduce cylinder temps with EGR. I don't know of any other way.

Last time I checked, diesels make more Nox per mile than the gas engines, even though the gas trucks have lesser economy.

I doubt Ford has done anything wonky. I blame the testers, and their test procedures. Surely the EPA has testing standards. And it's likely that the EPA are the ones who should be sued, they're the ones that certified this engine for sale.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 03:04 PM
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This is what they had to do with the buybacks though
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Buliwyf View Post
Diesels produce more NOx than gas engine regardless of fuel economy. It's just the nature of the beast. And clean, lean burning diesels, create more NOx than dirty ones. All you can do to combat NOx is reduce cylinder temps with EGR. I don't know of any other way.

Last time I checked, diesels make more Nox per mile than the gas engines, even though the gas trucks have lesser economy.

I doubt Ford has done anything wonky. I blame the testers, and their test procedures. Surely the EPA has testing standards. And it's likely that the EPA are the ones who should be sued, they're the ones that certified this engine for sale.
SCR is used to combat NOx. That's why trucks equipped with it don't have to use as much EGR as older trucks that did not come with the systems.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 03:45 PM
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I don't believe there is much truth to any of this crap. Just a bunch of ambulance chasing attorneys looking for a "settlement for an undisclosed amount".
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by roadpilot View Post
I don't believe there is much truth to any of this crap. Just a bunch of ambulance chasing attorneys looking for a "settlement for an undisclosed amount".
I agree considering they’re targeting GM and Fiat as well. It just seems like a money grab or extortion to me.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 05:06 PM
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I had one of the "offending" VW TDI vehicles. A 2.0 Golf that my wife drove.....great little car. Sure do miss only having to fill it every 2 or 3 weeks. Though VW did buy it back, we certainly didn't retire with a cash windfall. Did allow us to buy her a brand new Golf (gasser) because she loved the car enough to stick with VW. I received plenty of solicitations from lawyers but never bothered as I felt they were the only ones who would come out ahead, in the end.

I agree that this is likely just an attempted money grab.....
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 05:06 PM
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Posts 7 and 8 pretty much sum up my opinion as well.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by CRSFX4 View Post
I had one of the "offending" VW TDI vehicles. A 2.0 Golf that my wife drove.....great little car. Sure do miss only having to fill it every 2 or 3 weeks. Though VW did buy it back, we certainly didn't retire with a cash windfall. Did allow us to buy her a brand new Golf (gasser) because she loved the car enough to stick with VW. I received plenty of solicitations from lawyers but never bothered as I felt they were the only ones who would come out ahead, in the end.

I agree that this is likely just an attempted money grab.....
I had a 2012 GTI 6-speed 4 door and loved it; also got to frequently drive a 2011 Golf TDI 6-speed. Both were great cars.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 05:31 PM
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Some how I doubt a owner of a diesel is behind any of this. More than likely it is a lawyer thing.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by CRSFX4 View Post
I had one of the "offending" VW TDI vehicles. A 2.0 Golf that my wife drove.....great little car. Sure do miss only having to fill it every 2 or 3 weeks. Though VW did buy it back, we certainly didn't retire with a cash windfall. Did allow us to buy her a brand new Golf (gasser) because she loved the car enough to stick with VW. I received plenty of solicitations from lawyers but never bothered as I felt they were the only ones who would come out ahead, in the end.

I agree that this is likely just an attempted money grab.....
We just completed our Buyback on Monday night. Nice chunk of change we got that we turned around and put down on a new car for my wife, An Audi A3. She absolutely loves her new car. and loved her TDI Jetta. but she really likes this Audi.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 06:48 PM
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We just went thru this with a Gen 2 2014 Porsche Cayenne V6 diesel. Little info from 1st hand experience about the diesel SUVs. The Gen 1 Cayenne, and sibling Audi,s VWs were deemed not fixable and crushed in exchange for a check. Our Gen 2 diesel was updated with software and some hard part changes plus a check from VW group, a check from Bosch, a complete inside and outside detail with ceramic coat, full tank of fuel, and additional 1 yr of bumper to bumper warranty. We did the fix and traded our 2014 on a 2015 dealer leftover Cayenne diesel with no miles, depreciated and a great deal. They have been sitting on the new dealer lots since the "stop sale" in 2015/16. We were pre-emptive about picking up a new one with our dealer while this was all going on. After the fix the only difference we find is when the Cayenne is cold it holds the shifts very long compared to our old Cayenne before the fix and it uses a bit more DEF. Mpg is nearly the same. VW group should have just done it the right way from the beginning.
 
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Old 01-10-2018, 08:02 PM
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We had a 2014 Audi Q7 TDI and it was a towing beast and got 28 mpg(not towing). Dang shame you cannot get one now but did trade in on a gasser 2017 Q7 and a great vehicle as well. Also had a 2011 Golf TDI involved. Payback from VW was not bad but still miss the gas mileage on both.
 
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