T19 to ZF 5 speed for my 6.9 - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums

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T19 to ZF 5 speed for my 6.9

 
  #1  
Old 12-08-2017, 01:07 PM
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T19 to ZF 5 speed for my 6.9

Hi guys, (this is also posted in the Bullnose forum)

My clutch is chattering and can get overpowered in 4th until it's hot. I'll be a peckerwood if I'll spend good money pulling that 4spd to fix the clutch. Time for a ZF. Or GearVendor.

I searched the forum but found no threads of the same swap. They must be hiding.

Here's what I (think I) know:
1) I'll need to find a ZF trans and bellhousing assembly. The T19 has a separate bellhousing, but on the ZF it's integrated into the trans.

2) It has to be a ZF from a 7.3 IDI, not a gasser. It has to have the speedo drive gear on the tail.

3) I'll need the 7.3 dual-mass flywheel too, but might as well junk it like tofu and get a solid aftermarket flywheel.

What I don't know:
a) Can I run a stock 7.3 clutch and throwout?
b) Will my 6.9 master cylinder work?
c) Is the ZF even a hydraulic linkage??

Any more gotchas? Pilot bushings?

D) Would a GearVendor overdrive be a saner idea? It's a 2wd truck. I can see paying for a new 6.9 clutch if I'm keeping the T19. It does groan at low rpm but else makes no naughty noises and weeps no oil. 158k on the clock. Or maybe 258k

E) Does the ZF have a lower 1st? Or are its 1-4 ratios similar to the T19?
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 06:56 AM
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I did the swap a couple years ago due to my T19 bell housing cracking. I just bought everything from Napa for a na 7.3. smf flywheel, pilot bearing, clutch,to bearing,etc. Didnt touch the slave cylinder. Ive found, due to gear roll over in first, I usually just start out in 2nd. I wish I would,ve done the swap years before. The overdrive is really nice, 5 mpg better, and lower RPMsat hghway speed.
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 07:54 AM
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Now that Im thinking about it I did have to cut my exhaust pipe. The zf bell housing wouldnt squeeze in without cutting it. I just cut it, loosened the bolts from the frame and slid the exhaust aft and clamped it back together after the tranny was in.
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 08:47 AM
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Thank you Sir
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by SchaefferUSMC View Post
I did the swap a couple years ago due to my T19 bell housing cracking. I just bought everything from Napa for a na 7.3. smf flywheel, pilot bearing, clutch,to bearing,etc. Didnt touch the slave cylinder. Ive found, due to gear roll over in first, I usually just start out in 2nd. I wish I would,ve done the swap years before. The overdrive is really nice, 5 mpg better, and lower RPMsat hghway speed.

5MPG is a pretty good increase. Which rear end gear ratio do you have?
Iam not doubting you, just curious.


My 86 with the 4-spd and 3:55 gets in the 20MPG range if I keep it around 50 - 60 MPH.
Push it over that and it drops some. Lately in the 18 - 19 range, maybe winter fuel.


Charlie
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 12:56 PM
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I don't remember off the top of my head. My truck is sitting at the house in Tn, and Im working in Tx. All I know is when they switched to ulsd I went from 20 down to around 15. Now Im back up to 20.
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 06:29 PM
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A: Yes, but do not run a dual mass flywheel. I use the Luk 07-225 flywheel, clutch, throwout kit on my ZF5, behind a 6.9. It works fine.

B: The clutch master you have SHOULD work fine with a ZF5. I cannot confirm 100% but I'm almost certain it will work fine. Currently $250 on RockAuto

C: Yes, the ZF5 are all set up for a hydraulic clutch. Diesel and big block have a fork and external slave. Small block has an internal slave and no fork.

D: No, a GearVendors overdrive would be insane. They are insanely expensive, GV tightly controls inventory and marks up prices to burn their customers when they need service or parts (similar business model to Banks). Their units are also an inferior design to the previous competitor, US Gear, who made a similar but better overdrive unit. They are no longer in business and these units are pricey on the used makret whenever you can ever find one.
An alternative would be a Ranger overdrive unit. It's about 7" long direct/over gearbox that goes in front of the transmission. Cheaper, more versatile, and stronger than a GearVendors... If you wanted to keep the T19. A ZF5 will likely be cheaper than any other overdrive option though.

E: ZF5 gear ratios, nearly all S5-47 will be the "close" or inbetween ratio. I'm not sure what application the wide ratio was used for. The diesel S5-42 (most common ZF5 you'll find for an IDI/7.3 Powerstroke application) is close ratio. I do not like that ratio, but you can use a wide ratio gearset from a gas (big block or small block, though small block needs a different input shaft) S5-42 if you prefer. I'd imagine the wide ratio S5-42 is pretty close to a T-19, it certainly feels close to a NP435. I personally prefer the inbetween S5-47 gearset for my uses as a daily driver and a tow pig with 3.55:1 gears.

Type
1st
2nd
3rd
4th
5th
R
S5-42 Close Ratio
4.14 : 1
2.37 : 1
1.42 : 1
1.00 : 1
0.77 : 1
3.79 : 1
S5-47 Close Ratio
5.08 : 1
2.60 : 1
1.53 : 1
1.00 : 1
0.77 : 1
4.66 : 1
S5-42/S5-47 Wide Ratio
5.72 : 1
2.94 : 1
1.61 : 1
1.00 : 1
0.76 : 1
5.24 : 1
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 07:24 PM
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I did the same swap for my '85. The hydraulics are all the same on both transmissions and the first gen PS as well.
You'll also need to get the cross-member and drill a couple of holes.

Here's my thread, but all the good pictures are gone:


https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post13717581

Edit, you'll need the tunnel cover too or modify yours.
 
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Old 12-09-2017, 10:54 PM
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Ranger overdrive unit. It's about 7" long direct/over gearbox that goes in front of the transmission
Huzzat? Wut? In front of the tranny . Amazing, this thing.
http://www.advanceadapters.com/image...ER%20OD(1).pdf

And Advance Adapters has a killer good rep too, for years.
 
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Old 12-16-2017, 11:24 PM
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I'm launching the project. Stand by lads for a buttload of questions!
 
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Old 12-16-2017, 11:26 PM
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Got a ZF, now I need to ID it, and a BOOT

This tranny is labelled from a 1987. I don't think the ZF5 was offered until the Bricknose years, or maybe even the AeroNose. I bet it's an AeroNose tranny. It does have the speedo drive gear on tail...whew. $700 seems fair. It shifts OK.
UPDATE: Intro was late 1987. (Ford ZF Transmissions)

So, E9TA means 1989, Truck model, by Light Truck Engineering Division.
(Deciphering Ford Parts Date Codes - FORDification.com) but what's the rest of the code mean?

Any idea where I can buy this little boot? RockAuto remains impenetrable to me so far.



 
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Old 12-17-2017, 08:59 AM
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Yep, '87 was the first year. With an '89 date code though it must have been replaced at some time.

FWIW I re-uploaded the pictures on my thread, hope that helps some.
 
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Old 12-18-2017, 10:14 AM
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Anybody can help on that boot or tranny tag? Is the little boot a hard part only available at the stealer?

This thread is excellent...thank you! https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post13717581

RockAuto has a flywheel conversion kit from Brute Power. It looks complete, but I've never heard of that brand. Summit has only a flywheel and clutch from LUK, no conversion kit so it's missing some key parts. Has anybody used Brute Power clutches? OK quality?
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...=1124558&jsn=8
 
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Old 12-18-2017, 04:52 PM
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OK guys, I need some help. Brute Power says they don't think their 7.3 solid flywheel conversion kit will fit a 6.9 with a ZF transplant. They say the 7.3 is internally balanced, while the 6.9 is externally balanced.

I think the 7.3 and 6.9 are the same balancing, internal with huge weights on the crank. Perhaps they are confusing the 7.3 IDI with the PStroke.
 
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Old 12-18-2017, 08:19 PM
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There's been quite a bit of discussion in this forum reguarding the balance issue. IIRC some think it's a non-issue, others have stated if you use the harmonic balance from the 7.3 on the 6.9 you'll be fine.

This guy on ebay has a boot, but no pic so we don't know if it's what you're after or the floorboard boot:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/-/371719639958?
 

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