If you're still feeling lost, do a bit more homework with the help of Professor Google, on squish, quench, SCR and DCR etc.

Don't fixate on a mid 9 SCR as there's nothing wrong with low to mid 10's if the engine is built correctly.

The correct package creates an efficient fuel burn.

Tim's pistons had 30cc dishes because of the 1.71 compression height. Had he used your pistons with the 1.67 compression height, for example, then the dishes would have been smaller.

When you ask Tim, or whoever, what size dishes your pistons can be machined to, please post back the answer. (I'm curious.)

In addition to machining the pistons, your other area of concern will be the deck height.

I.E. The block surface will be machined.

The concern is how much can be machined without interfering with the intake manifold fitment.

The limit might be something like 0.02''.

To give the summit salesman benefit of the doubt, I'll say he probably tried his best, but simply didn't have the required knowledge.

 

it looks like I will be returning the Edelbrock cylinder heads and swapping them for Trick flow with 72cc combustion chamber.
Today I dropped off the block, crank, Flexplate and connecting rods in the machine shop and it will likely be that the 60cc Eddys will have to go back. The guy said they are not the best choice and that trick flow is the way to go so right now im just waiting till the guy gets everything inspected to see what wpould be the next step but most likely TF 72cc.
Ill keep you posted so others will find this helpful if trapped in my same quest.
Marry Christmas to all!

 

It's great that you can return the 60cc heads.

72cc heads will definitely make life easier. (Good call by kopfenjager)

Consider returning the cam package too !

The intake valve closure at 53 is too early.

Merry Christmas to you too.

 

wow, I almost feel like I know something! good deal, 72cc chambers will make the build easier with the available piston selection. I've never done a engine build that didn't have a least a few hiccups, so it seems your going along the right track. hang in there buddy, we will get this done.

 

Ok folks.
The build is on. Summit Racing is top notch all the way around. They sent ups to pick up the Edelbrock cylinder heads and only after getting the set of Trick Flow heads I could see the big difference in quality and finish. Now I have the 72cc heads and Tim Meyers sent me the 14cc Hyperutectic set of Pistons and rings. Timothy Meyers is not only a 400 Guru but also a great guy to deal with, Thumbs way up to him. CR should be around 9.7:1 and DC @ 7.5:1 according to a calculator based on cam specs. Will swap Ford Duraspark ignition system for the Summit Racing® Blueprinted HEI Distributors.
Life is Good!

 

awesome, sounds like its coming together.

 

Getting this build rapped up. Now waiting on the push rods to get everything bottom up. We are looking to fire this thing up by the end of the week and do the break in procedure to the cam/lifters using com cam braking oil. So here is a re-cap:
cylinders bored to 0.040
400 crankshaft 0.010
Re-using original connecting rods
Tmeyer Pistons set: The KB2347 hypereutectic pistons with a .975" wrist pin and 14cc
TFS 195 Cylinder Heads 72cc
Comp Cams Dual energy Cam and Lifter kits K32-206-3
Edelbrock Performer Intake Manifold 2171
Summit Racing Blueprint HEI Distributor SUM-850025
Original exhaust manifolds.
Quench distance is 0.048

 

Looking good, but I would not have used that cam.

I agree with the 9.71 SCR, but I calculate 8.40 for the DCR !!

Please post up if you get pinging or not once you're driving around.

Your total timing will need to drop from +/-36 degrees to +/-30 degrees.

That dizzy doesn't have a formal limiter adjustment, so you'll have to use a nut + bolt or a cable tie in one of the centre plate holes.

 

yeah, that cam seems small. A 8.4 DCR is pushing it for pump premium.

 

Static compression ratio of 9.725:1.
Effective stroke is 3.40 inches.
Dynamic compression ratio is 8.42:1 .
Dynamic cranking pressure is 170.84 PSI.
Effective boost compression ratio, reflecting static c.r., cam timing, altitude, and boost of 0 PSI is 8.42 :1.
V/P (Volume to Pressure Index) is 179
If cranking pressure were 200 and over for sure I will be on the high octane fuel diet. Aluminum heads and dual electric fan on a 180* thermostat and 4 core aluminum radiator will aid to keep it from rattling.
I will post results once is all done.

 

The good news is that your logic about a CP of 200 and octane is correct, and that you've reached the same conclusion about an 8.4 DCR.

The bad news is that it looks like you used the Wallace Racing Calculator, in which case you need to add about 20 to the CP of 170.
(And you need to ignore their 'overlap' statement coz it's wrong.)

I sincerely hope that I am wrong with my comments thus far, and that you get no detonation.

Clever move to ask Joel Cassell about his engine. (I'd hoped that he'd reply.)

 

Well here I am reporting back and feeling ashamed for not listening to your recommendation and not going with a bigger cam, you guys were right all along, I was pushing it with the dynamic compression of 8.4 and as a result I ended up with a pinging engine even at low rpm and a full tank of 93 octane. The shop that did the engine always ensured me that I can run 87 octane and will not have any problems and I believed what they said.
The shop Owner will come this coming Saturday to see whats going on, he said not to drive it until the pinging is resolved.They will work on the advance vacuum from the HEI to make sure it wont be pulling to much and that should take care of the pinging. At this point I lost credibility on them, but if what they are about to do works then great. I am sure that the 87 octane is out of the window but at least I want to get rid of the pinging to avoid any mayor damage in the future. Any comments. SORRY guys for not listening.

 

Hi Almor,

Thank you for the update, and hats off to you for being honest.

Personally I wouldn't let the shop owner near my truck ever again, and I'd tell him to f$$k off.

You already know what's going on, why does he want to see also ? LOL (Unless he's going to step up to the plate and change your cam, professionally, and free of charge.)

Yes, his tinkering with the vacuum advance could well work to stop the pinging, but that's simply putting a plaster on a broken arm !!

I will suggest this :

Plug the vacuum advance and test drive.

If no pinging, great, (Wishful thinking !) use the allen key to back off the vacuum advance, reconnect, test drive.

If yes to pinging, retard the static timing, test drive.

Guaranteed that retarding your timing will get rid of the pinging, but it will also get rid of power and fuel efficiency.

In a nutshell, retard your timing now to avoid pinging, drive your truck, and when you're ready, fit a proper cam.

Out of curiosity, is your cranking pressure 170, or closer to 190 ?

 

Thinking about it some more, check the springs inside the dizzy.

They might be the soft ones, which would accelerate the mechanical advance.

Stiffer springs would delay the advance and assist with preventing pinging.

When you're happy there's no pinging, check and set the timing curve.

A new dizzy doesn't guarantee a faultless timing curve, so it's best to check anyway !

When you fit the new cam, you'll have a benchmark to work from when dialing in a final curve.

 

I've seen many times that these heads like 28* for max timing in these engines before you add the vacuum advance for cruise. I'm at 8.27 DCR and have no problem running 91 octane, I'm running a 252H timed strait up (installed 4* retarded to get rid of the 4* advace ground in the cam). I'm still working on getting my timing nailed down, the fluidampner balancer I used seems to have the timing marks in the wrong place and I didn't mark the balancer when I degreed my cam, my bad. Since I'm using the timing pointer for a 351C I have a 351C specific balancer coming. It runs great and I have the timing set so it runs good, but the timing marks are useless. Using a screwdriver in the #1 sparkplug hole to find TDC, it appears the balancer is 10* off. So according to the balancer I'm running 2* advance at idle and with the screwdriver mark I'm running 12*. Plenty of power and she runs a lot cooler than what I suspect was 22*. This also got rid of the pinging I was getting when flooring it to merge on the freeway. Hopefully the new balancer will sort this out and give me a more accurate reading than a screwdriver in a sparkplug hole.