So I went to replace the points on my truck today, after Replacing them my truck stared turning over slower than normal. Eventually it would barely turn over. I connected jumper cables and after charging for a minute the engine finally started.
As I'm walking to disconnect the cables, my solenoid starts smoking and the starter engages. I turn the key off(starter still engaging) and pull the small wires off of the coil in hopes that will stop it (it didn't) and by the time I got my tools to disconnect the battery the starter had already slowed down enough to where the engine would not turn over.
I replaced the solenoid and am charging the battery now. My question: did I ruin my starter?
1973 F-100 with points ignition and a 302

 

Probably so. I've had that happen to me once with low voltage. My solenoid stuck too but luckily my dad got it stopped before I could get to it.

 

So you think I ruined my starter? Or it's a low battery problem

 

You'll probably just have to charge up the battery and see how the starter does.
Make sure you have a ground from your engine to the cab. That's the only thing I've ever seen stick a solenoid on my vehicles, saved for an incorrect Duraspark install on a '68 Cougar.
Regardless of what caused the malfunction, you need a good thick ground from the battery negative to the engine, and then a smaller ground wire will do, from the engine to the cab.

 

Didn't do it any good.. Maybe you've wondered how a small motor can crank over a big engine. The way they do that, is because normally a well tuned engine starts with a flick of the key, since it only has to run for just a second it won't get very hot. How long did it run? 30 seconds or 3 minutes? Eventually the insulation burns off the windings during extended crankfest. When you hear someone's starter grinding for 20 seconds or 30 seconds over and over... It may not fail right tomorrow but it is probably not long for this world. Duty cycle is probably 5 minute cool down for every 15 seconds cranking, something like that. I baby starters cuz' rolling around under the truck replacing starters sucks lol

Good solid grounds and hot battery help. Don't buy el-cheapo solenoids they don't last.

 

It might have just decided to take that very moment to die of old age (is it an old starter relay by the way?), or the hard cranking of the starter pulled way too many amps through it and caused the actual trouble. Sounds like no matter what it was, the relay overheated and melted internally. Which is what stuck it in the closed/on position.

Usually when this happens I try to pull both of the small wires off the starter relay/solenoid first. If the cranking is caused by a defective ignition switch, or a short in one of the circuits, or a short internally to the relay, pulling those will stop the cranking.
Unfortunately, in most cases the only thing you can do to stop a runaway cranky starter is to disconnect the main battery cables. Starting with the ground.
If you start with the positive, you typically get more sparks, but the main thing is that by the time the engine is cranking the alternator is also charging and as long as the ground wire is connected the alternator can keep things cranking.
Not always, but why waste a few extra precious seconds pulling the positive first, when you can grab the negative and almost certainly kill things then?

Lucky for us old-timers this crankiness was a rarity back when the starter relays were of a better quality. It sill happened of course, but it wasn't all that often. Nowadays, it seems we're lucky just to get two or three starts out of a cheap relay before you get either run-on or no-start at all! Pieces of crap!

In your case, it's hard to say if the relay started the problem, or if the heavy load from the weak starter AND/OR battery are what caused it.
Or... The new points installation advanced the timing so far it made the engine hard to crank. You have to consider this too.

Good luck. Hopefully the charged battery fixes things. But at the first sign of hard cranking, I would turn the distributor counter-clockwise a few degrees to be sure it's not advanced timing causing the trouble.

Paul

 

Thank you guys for all the help.. the relay is about a year old I guess. It ran for about 30 seconds to a minute before it went out. After thinking about it, I'm wondering if the starter could have shorted out and fried my relay. I guess the cranking would have stopped then though, it was supposed to be in a parade tomorrow but

 

As has been said, the changing of the points could have advanced the ignition timing so as to make the starting system's job more difficult. Obviously the solenoid needed to be changed. I hope you bought a quality part. Saving money is good, but not if you have to compromise on quality. The battery should be tested & recharged, if good. It's hard to say about the starter. They are not intended to run under load for extended periods. If it were mine, I'd try it when all else is normal & up to specs. If you want to go to the trouble, you can take it out and bring it to a starter shop for checking.

 

A re-manufactured starter for these trucks is ridiculously cheap. A pair of twenties cheap. Less if you're lucky.

 

Yeah gonna have to get a new starter. Just clicks when I tried to turn the key this morning

 

I like to pair a new solenoid with a new starter motor. It's not mandatory, but I like to keep things on the same sheet of music. Make sure the solenoid itself is well grounded, no paint or grime where it mounts to the firewall or wherever. Next, if the cables are original or old, they need replaced. Trust Me. They corrode internally under the crimp and insulation, get work hardened and stiff as a dead squirrel and act more like resistors.

Clean ALL the cable connection points on both ends to block, frame, and firewall, grind down to bright shiny metal and tighten securely. Then coat with grease, vaseline, NO-OX, to keep them from corroding again. If your truck is a '73 the connections have probably never been cleaned in over 40 years. Finally charge the battery externally overnight to 100%, if you're having trouble it's probably half dead by now.

 

On the solenoid change/install: be sure the solenoid has a good ground to the fenderwell...sometimes an old solenoid needs some persuasion (a few whacks) to un-seat the contacts inside....

Charge the battery up - for more than just a few minutes - and be sure you're reading at least 12.3 VDC on it.

Bench test the old starter.....you could rebuild it. Be sure to bench test the new starter, too.

 

You should write a book or something! I tried to give you reps but it wouldn't let me.

How about, a bad day with contact points is still better than a good day with HEI?

 

Thanks everyone, I will try all of this. The starter will turn over the engine but when it goes to fire, it just hits and starts turning over again

 

Everything has to be just so, as even a good starter hogs all the current - a couple hundred amperes - at that very instant the ignition too needs juice to fire the plugs with a good, hot spark.