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Interesting thread.
3 years ago, on another site I was (for all practical purposes) burned at the stake for even suggesting an FBC was beneficial to the DPF and reduced regens.
I've been over here in my corner, adding Enerburn the whole time and have seen regens (when towing) only at the 500 mile marks.
Ferrocene based adds have been around a long time, and the science behind them is solid. There are a few other metal adds out there as well, but Enerburn is (was) an excellent product that just does what it does, which is lower the overall temperature at which soot burns off.
Here are a few links for discussion, or to satisfy curiosity.
BTW, yes you can buy Ferrocene by itself, but the I don't see the any advantage of buying the powder, going through dissolving it in a carrier, and dealing with the minimum quantity to buy the orange colored powder. Ferrocene in Diesel
Has anyone noticed increased iron in the oil of a stock 6.7 when using Enerburn or ferrocene?
How about quieter engine? Different exhaust smell?
Thanks for posting those articles carbonation. Very interesting. Potential cons of ferrocene would seem to include increased NOx and CO2, smaller soot particles (same overall amount of soot) possibly getting thru the dpf and hence less dpf clogging, and rouge covered engine parts - but I'm guessing some of these are minimized if you only use the recommended amount and dont go overboard.
Has anyone noticed increased iron in the oil of a stock 6.7 when using Enerburn or ferrocene?
How about quieter engine? Different exhaust smell?
Thanks for posting those articles carbonation. Very interesting. Potential cons of ferrocene would seem to include increased NOx and CO2, smaller soot particles (same overall amount of soot) possibly getting thru the dpf and hence less dpf clogging, and rouge covered engine parts - but I'm guessing some of these are minimized if you only use the recommended amount and dont go overboard.
A few things:
1) The negatives pointed out for native Ferrocene were by a company with a competing product with modified organo ferrics to increase mpg, & redux NOx, so caveat emptor. And we don't know that EB/FBC isn't also modified to give similar benefits (they do claim as such).
2) I couldn't give two hoots about CO2, it's food for plants; the rest is a political control scheme.
3) I have noticed that my engine idles very quietly.
4) Don't notice any different smell.
5) The smaller particles are getting burned up instead of passed through. I'm not seeing any soot coming out of the pipe.
6) Caution is given to not overdose the fuel or the DPF will clog with the Iron Oxide ('rouge'). I think the light coating in the chamber aids in the combustion process.
7) Yes, I did notice an increase in iron in my UOA that is likely attributable to the ferrocene reaction that creates free iron during the catalysis reaction (see pic from above linked scientific paper) and the iron oxide coating. It went up from 37ppm to 66ppm while other metals went down. Total insoluables was constant at 0.4; thus I think that soot in the oil was less and the iron was up a little both attributable to the product.
A few things:
1) The negatives pointed out for native Ferrocene were by a company with a competing product with modified organo ferrics to increase mpg, & redux NOx, so caveat emptor. And we don't know that EB/FBC isn't also modified to give similar benefits (they do claim as such).
2) I couldn't give two hoots about CO2, it's food for plants; the rest is a political control scheme.
3) I have noticed that my engine idles very quietly.
4) Don't notice any different smell.
5) The smaller particles are getting burned up instead of passed through. I'm not seeing any soot coming out of the pipe.
6) Caution is given to not overdose the fuel or the DPF will clog with the Iron Oxide ('rouge'). I think the light coating in the chamber aids in the combustion process.
7) Yes, I did notice an increase in iron in my UOA that is likely attributable to the ferrocene reaction that creates free iron during the catalysis reaction (see pic from above linked scientific paper) and the iron oxide coating. It went up from 37ppm to 66ppm while other metals went down. Total insoluables was constant at 0.4; thus I think that soot in the oil was less and the iron was up a little both attributable to the product.
Good info - thanks. Have many UOAs have you done with Enerburn? Just one? Interesting that the iron increase in oil doesn't seem to cause any wear of other metals? Do you think soot reduction in oil reduced other wear metals? Any effect on fuel dilution?
Any reason to use this if deleted? I'm deleted, and wondering if I'd have less added iron in the oil since deleted (delete essentially eliminated fuel dilution in my 6.7).
From the previously posted link on the study of sodium and lithium in fuel as compared to "ferrocene, which is, at present, the best studied additive for particulate filter regeneration." The study was done in 1992 using diesel particulate filters. 1) There is scientific basis for Enerburn and FBC. 2) Ferrocene is still apparently the champ.
From another study: "One of the most important applications for ferrocene is its use as an additive for promoting the smokeless combustion of fuels. Comparatively low concentrations of ferrocene have a marked effect upon carbon formation, and appear to catalyze the oxidation of soot."
One weird thing I've noticed while running FBC. While towing like light enclosed trailer it takes a long time to reach 100% on my screen. When it does and goes into regen I open my forscan lite app to monitor my soot levels during the regen. My soot levels are always between 1.07 and 1.15gpl. Ot will regen for roughly 60 - 70 miles and the percentage will only drop to 90% and my soot levels will go down to 1.02ish. I will never hit the 500 mile mark before my percentage gets back to 100% and it starts all over again doing the same thing. One time while I was on a work trip I was able to drop my trailer at the hotel while I made a 130 mile trip to another near by town in Montana. Truck hit 100% about 60 miles into my trip but never went into a regen for the remaining 70 miles. Once i got to the town i was in my truck idling while preparing my work and it gave me the drive to clean message even though my GPL was only at 1.2. Luckily I had my laptop and was able to do an OCR.
I have no idea what that's all about but that's what it does.
Now that is really weird. I've been using Enerburn and now Better Diesel and I never ever go more than 15 miles to get back down to 0 to -3% (that's right, minus 3%) on my for- scan lite. That's from 100% load. It could have a lot to do with the way the onboard computer reads your data, but 60 miles for a regen seems way excessive to me. When driving strictly around town, my regent usually start between 300 and 400 miles, but never happen before 500 on the highway wether I'm pulling my 16000 lb trailer, or running dry. My truck is a 2012 f250 Lariat. Oh and when the regen starts BEFORE I reach the factory set 500, they normally only take until 7 to 8 miles to get down to below 0%. Thats one of the biggest advantages I have seen with Better diesel AND Enerburn. The regent are much faster. I almost prefer them to happen below 500 miles as it goes faster and uses less fuel. Ford apparently has it set to go the full length even though all the soot is burned out..
It is odd how each truck reacts differently, even bone stock with plain diesel. My one disappointment with Enerburn is that my regens still often take close to 30 miles, but I've had one finish in 12 miles and another take 33 miles. The one constant is that, for my driving, the regen interval is at least 400 miles and usually 500 miles.
Yea Skismuggs.. it is weird. Like I said, if my regent happen BEFORE the factory set 500, it never takes more than 8 miles to complete (as per my forscan) and on board computer fuel economy gage) I almost prefer it happening at less than 500, but when on the highway, I don't get the choice lol.
It is odd how each truck reacts differently, even bone stock with plain diesel. My one disappointment with Enerburn is that my regens still often take close to 30 miles, but I've had one finish in 12 miles and another take 33 miles. The one constant is that, for my driving, the regen interval is at least 400 miles and usually 500 miles.
01-15-2019, 07:10 PM
