Oil Sludge at 28K on my 3week old CPO 2015 Platinum...?!
#46
05-01-2017, 08:44 PM
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Harrisburg, PA
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5:15pm – I received a call from Assistant Service Manager at the local dealer. He told me not to get worried, but from what they found this motor is gunked…bad…It looks like this motor has only ever scene one oil change its entire life. I don’t even a flush is going to clean this thing out.” I said, “I figured. “ He said he is going to make a few calls tomorrow and see if he can get anything done through Ford. His concern is that they are going to kick it back because it’s an issue the NY dealer should be handling. But he was going to do everything he can to help me and get this fixed for me. He asked if I had gotten the inspection from NY dealer? and I said, “No, but I’m not surprised.” He said he didn’t understand how they haven’t been able to get it for me yet. I told him “Honestly, its because I don’t think they did it.” He said they can produce that paper in 5 mins. We keep them all here. I said “ My concern is that they are forging one right now.” He said, “I don’t want to say that they would do that, but from what you’ve told me and them not returning your calls. I would be concerned too. Anyone can date one of those inspections unfortunately” I said, “Yeah, that’s my concern” He said “The other thing that concerns me is that I have been working for Ford for 20 years and I have never been allowed to use anything except Ford Motor Company Genuine parts…This thing had an aftermarket filter on it.” I said, “Yeah, I saw that and I have the pictures of it.” He said “Hold on. Let me look at something. I’m looking at all the service records here from the NJ dealer who sold it. They never serviced this truck except for warranty work.” I said “Yeah, I called them and they told me they don’t have any record of ever servicing that truck”. I asked him what he would do and he told me to call Ford and explain to them my concerns about the NY dealer not returning my calls and that I am concerned this situation is going south and that the NY dealer isn’t providing me the documentation I am asking for. He said he would continue to work with Ford and try calling that NY dealer and do everything he can to help me. BTW…my local dealer is awesome! I WILL be using them for any Ford issues going forward.
So I called Ford and spoke to a representative and gave her my case number and let her familiarize herself with my case. I said, “I just had my truck looked at by the local dealer and the motor is gunked up…bad.” She seemed very surprised. I said, “I haven’t received any call back form the NY dealer providing the paper work I requested 3 days ago and I am going to be honest. I don’t think they did it and I am afraid that they are going to be forging and inspection for this truck” I said, “The local dealer said this truck has only probably ever seen one oil change its entire life” She said “Oh my gosh!” I asked her “Are you able to tell me if Ford allows their dealerships to use aftermarket parts to do Certified Warranty inspections and service?” She said, “I honestly don’t know sir” I said “Well this thing had an aftermarket filter on it. And I am afraid that the dealership is forging documents right now to try and pass this thing off.” She said “Oh my gosh! Can I put you on hold and try and call this dealer?” I said “yep”. She came back and said she couldn’t get ahold of the customer service at the dealer.” And I said “Shocker!” She said she is going to be following up with the dealer first thing in the morning about all of this and getting back with me before 5pm tomorrow. I asked her if she “was able to see if that dealer ever sent in the certification for this truck? I am assuming they have to send those inspections into Corporate?” She said, “I am not sure, but I would think so. I will be checking on this as well and let you know”
So I called NY Ford and asked for Matt. Finally got ahold of him “I said, Matt, got the assessment back on the truck…” He said “Yeah? What’d they say?” I said, “The motor is GUNKED…BAD! Like trashed…” SILENCE…. “So where is the 172 point inspection?” He said, “I’ll have it tomorrow morning” I said “We were supposed to have it today…” he said “No. I said I would CALL today to our corporate office and have them send it down. The ladies said they would pull it and get it to me tomorrow morning” I said, “ I want it first thing tomorrow morning! Matt, I honestly don’t think you guys did the inspection, which I am going to say is not your fault because I don’t think you have a part in that. But if you knew…I’m pissed! Let me tell you the reason I don’t think you did it…Does your Ford dealership use aftermarket parts on your vehicles??? Because mine had an aftermarket filter on it!” SILENCE… “Why does my truck that was CERTIFIED and serviced by your dealer have an aftermarket oil filter on it!?” SILENCE… then he replied, “I don’t know, but I am going to find out.” I said, “Listen, I know your busy and it’s the end of the month, but THIS is now number one priority! If I don’t hear from you in the morning then Ford will be calling looking for that inspection tomorrow. Call me back when you have it or figure out who didn’t do their job.” He said, “Were going to take care of this even if I have to get you another truck.”
So...now I am done playing nice with the NY dealer. Someone...or multiple people cheated this and they are going to pony up...They don't have a freaking leg to stand on and tomorrow things will get interesting for sure...but I haver a feeling they know they are in deep. Even if they provide some kind of inspection...it had an AFTERMARKET filter on it...thats never going to pass with Ford. Thanks again for all of your guys support and input. Ill keep you updated.
5:15pm – I received a call from Assistant Service Manager at the local dealer. He told me not to get worried, but from what they found this motor is gunked…bad…It looks like this motor has only ever scene one oil change its entire life. I don’t even a flush is going to clean this thing out.” I said, “I figured. “ He said he is going to make a few calls tomorrow and see if he can get anything done through Ford. His concern is that they are going to kick it back because it’s an issue the NY dealer should be handling. But he was going to do everything he can to help me and get this fixed for me. He asked if I had gotten the inspection from NY dealer? and I said, “No, but I’m not surprised.” He said he didn’t understand how they haven’t been able to get it for me yet. I told him “Honestly, its because I don’t think they did it.” He said they can produce that paper in 5 mins. We keep them all here. I said “ My concern is that they are forging one right now.” He said, “I don’t want to say that they would do that, but from what you’ve told me and them not returning your calls. I would be concerned too. Anyone can date one of those inspections unfortunately” I said, “Yeah, that’s my concern” He said “The other thing that concerns me is that I have been working for Ford for 20 years and I have never been allowed to use anything except Ford Motor Company Genuine parts…This thing had an aftermarket filter on it.” I said, “Yeah, I saw that and I have the pictures of it.” He said “Hold on. Let me look at something. I’m looking at all the service records here from the NJ dealer who sold it. They never serviced this truck except for warranty work.” I said “Yeah, I called them and they told me they don’t have any record of ever servicing that truck”. I asked him what he would do and he told me to call Ford and explain to them my concerns about the NY dealer not returning my calls and that I am concerned this situation is going south and that the NY dealer isn’t providing me the documentation I am asking for. He said he would continue to work with Ford and try calling that NY dealer and do everything he can to help me. BTW…my local dealer is awesome! I WILL be using them for any Ford issues going forward.
So I called Ford and spoke to a representative and gave her my case number and let her familiarize herself with my case. I said, “I just had my truck looked at by the local dealer and the motor is gunked up…bad.” She seemed very surprised. I said, “I haven’t received any call back form the NY dealer providing the paper work I requested 3 days ago and I am going to be honest. I don’t think they did it and I am afraid that they are going to be forging and inspection for this truck” I said, “The local dealer said this truck has only probably ever seen one oil change its entire life” She said “Oh my gosh!” I asked her “Are you able to tell me if Ford allows their dealerships to use aftermarket parts to do Certified Warranty inspections and service?” She said, “I honestly don’t know sir” I said “Well this thing had an aftermarket filter on it. And I am afraid that the dealership is forging documents right now to try and pass this thing off.” She said “Oh my gosh! Can I put you on hold and try and call this dealer?” I said “yep”. She came back and said she couldn’t get ahold of the customer service at the dealer.” And I said “Shocker!” She said she is going to be following up with the dealer first thing in the morning about all of this and getting back with me before 5pm tomorrow. I asked her if she “was able to see if that dealer ever sent in the certification for this truck? I am assuming they have to send those inspections into Corporate?” She said, “I am not sure, but I would think so. I will be checking on this as well and let you know”
So I called NY Ford and asked for Matt. Finally got ahold of him “I said, Matt, got the assessment back on the truck…” He said “Yeah? What’d they say?” I said, “The motor is GUNKED…BAD! Like trashed…” SILENCE…. “So where is the 172 point inspection?” He said, “I’ll have it tomorrow morning” I said “We were supposed to have it today…” he said “No. I said I would CALL today to our corporate office and have them send it down. The ladies said they would pull it and get it to me tomorrow morning” I said, “ I want it first thing tomorrow morning! Matt, I honestly don’t think you guys did the inspection, which I am going to say is not your fault because I don’t think you have a part in that. But if you knew…I’m pissed! Let me tell you the reason I don’t think you did it…Does your Ford dealership use aftermarket parts on your vehicles??? Because mine had an aftermarket filter on it!” SILENCE… “Why does my truck that was CERTIFIED and serviced by your dealer have an aftermarket oil filter on it!?” SILENCE… then he replied, “I don’t know, but I am going to find out.” I said, “Listen, I know your busy and it’s the end of the month, but THIS is now number one priority! If I don’t hear from you in the morning then Ford will be calling looking for that inspection tomorrow. Call me back when you have it or figure out who didn’t do their job.” He said, “Were going to take care of this even if I have to get you another truck.”
So...now I am done playing nice with the NY dealer. Someone...or multiple people cheated this and they are going to pony up...They don't have a freaking leg to stand on and tomorrow things will get interesting for sure...but I haver a feeling they know they are in deep. Even if they provide some kind of inspection...it had an AFTERMARKET filter on it...thats never going to pass with Ford. Thanks again for all of your guys support and input. Ill keep you updated.
#47
05-01-2017, 10:18 PM
I have a feeling that someone at that NY dealer will be losing their job for this, and rightfully so. The previous owner probably could not afford the truck and got rid of it, probably a reason for the lack of maintenance, at least that's a common denominator with diesel trucks. Glad you are making head way with your local dealer.
#48
05-02-2017, 01:00 AM
It costs the dealer money to certify a used car. The inspection and maintenance take a few solid hours of parts and labor. Then there is the cost of the extended warray. A dealer pays about $1500 of their money on this. It looks like they cut corners there and hope for the best in an effort to maximize profits.
#50
05-02-2017, 07:22 AM
I have been quiet for the last week on FTE because I had wrist surgery last week, and it's hard to type. Making an exception for this thread.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
#51
05-02-2017, 07:45 AM
Postmaster
Well, heres an update for today:
Dropped off the truck at Local dealer and went in and talked to the Service Agent and the Assistant Service Manager. I told them I just wanted to make sure they understood the situation and I’m just looking for them to figure out what the issue is, the severity, and what its going to take to get it fixed. the Assistant Service Manager asked me to kind of tell him what’s going on and I told him the story about the rattling, then the poor gas mileage and then how I found the filter. I showed him the pictures of the air filter and the oil sludge. I could tell by his facial expressions the surprise that this was a Certified Preown only 3 weeks old. He asked if I could send them and I did. I also showed him the tapping video I had and sent that to them as well. He asked if I changed the oil filter and I said “Nope” and he said “I wonder if it’s even a ford filter?” and I said “Its not, its solid black” (Which I have pictures of). Once again his facial expression said it all. I told him “I talked to a few other dealers and they wouldn’t touch it cause it was neglect by the previous owner and it wasn’t covered.” They said, “No, that’s not true, it’s certified”. He asked if they gave me a copy of the inspection and I said, “No, what I have is the Certified PreOwned Delivery Checklist. I asked that the selling dealer provide it to me and they said they would today, but I don’t think they did it.” I told them I called Ford for direction and they asked if I had a case open and I said “Yes” and they said they could look it up by my name. They said they would get it in as soon as possible and get it taken care of. They said they would work with Ford and figure out what needed to be done to get this resolved for me.
2:57pm - I called NY dealer and left another Voicemail fro the Used Car Sales Manager
3:45pm - Local Ford dealer called me to give me an update that they had the truck int he shop and were getting ready to start working on it. They are putting a senior tech on this because he has experience with this type of thing and can be very thorough with my vehicle. HE said once the tech has taken a look at everything they would contact Ford and work with them to figure out what needed to be done to fix this issue for me and reach out to me and keep me updated. I told them to let me know if I needed to do anything. I also told them I was still waiting for the Inspection from the NY dealer. I would send it over when and if I receive it.
Dropped off the truck at Local dealer and went in and talked to the Service Agent and the Assistant Service Manager. I told them I just wanted to make sure they understood the situation and I’m just looking for them to figure out what the issue is, the severity, and what its going to take to get it fixed. the Assistant Service Manager asked me to kind of tell him what’s going on and I told him the story about the rattling, then the poor gas mileage and then how I found the filter. I showed him the pictures of the air filter and the oil sludge. I could tell by his facial expressions the surprise that this was a Certified Preown only 3 weeks old. He asked if I could send them and I did. I also showed him the tapping video I had and sent that to them as well. He asked if I changed the oil filter and I said “Nope” and he said “I wonder if it’s even a ford filter?” and I said “Its not, its solid black” (Which I have pictures of). Once again his facial expression said it all. I told him “I talked to a few other dealers and they wouldn’t touch it cause it was neglect by the previous owner and it wasn’t covered.” They said, “No, that’s not true, it’s certified”. He asked if they gave me a copy of the inspection and I said, “No, what I have is the Certified PreOwned Delivery Checklist. I asked that the selling dealer provide it to me and they said they would today, but I don’t think they did it.” I told them I called Ford for direction and they asked if I had a case open and I said “Yes” and they said they could look it up by my name. They said they would get it in as soon as possible and get it taken care of. They said they would work with Ford and figure out what needed to be done to get this resolved for me.
2:57pm - I called NY dealer and left another Voicemail fro the Used Car Sales Manager
3:45pm - Local Ford dealer called me to give me an update that they had the truck int he shop and were getting ready to start working on it. They are putting a senior tech on this because he has experience with this type of thing and can be very thorough with my vehicle. HE said once the tech has taken a look at everything they would contact Ford and work with them to figure out what needed to be done to fix this issue for me and reach out to me and keep me updated. I told them to let me know if I needed to do anything. I also told them I was still waiting for the Inspection from the NY dealer. I would send it over when and if I receive it.
#52
05-02-2017, 08:03 AM
I have been quiet for the last week on FTE because I had wrist surgery last week, and it's hard to type. Making an exception for this thread.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
https://www.ford.com/resources/ford/...o/ford_cpo.pdf
section 6, check box 89, 102 and 103. He needs to get this from the original dealer(probably will be forged to cover their ***) and see what they put. If they didn't bother to check those what else was missed.
#53
05-02-2017, 08:15 AM
Really sorry to hear about your truck! Hopefully something is done about it!
Box 103 in that section is pretty interesting. Could the vehicle pass even if sludge was found?
Sorry if I'm asking a completely dumb question here, but wouldn't it be the responsibility of the dealer that certified and sold this truck to have taken any measure necessary to remove all sludge--and replace sludge-damaged components as needed--before selling the truck? Former owner neglect or not, it's still in the CPO inspection document, and even says at the top of the page that anything on the list that doesn't pass will be repaired before the truck is sold. It doesn't seem like it's assumed that the dealer will repair it, it seems like it's set in stone.
If it were bought from the dealer without being CPO, I don't think you would get anywhere, but the dealer was obligated to fix the problem, but it seems like they were lazy or lied and certified it anyway. It seems like they're still legally obligated to fix it, or at least make it right for the customer.
Box 103 in that section is pretty interesting. Could the vehicle pass even if sludge was found?
Sorry if I'm asking a completely dumb question here, but wouldn't it be the responsibility of the dealer that certified and sold this truck to have taken any measure necessary to remove all sludge--and replace sludge-damaged components as needed--before selling the truck? Former owner neglect or not, it's still in the CPO inspection document, and even says at the top of the page that anything on the list that doesn't pass will be repaired before the truck is sold. It doesn't seem like it's assumed that the dealer will repair it, it seems like it's set in stone.
If it were bought from the dealer without being CPO, I don't think you would get anywhere, but the dealer was obligated to fix the problem, but it seems like they were lazy or lied and certified it anyway. It seems like they're still legally obligated to fix it, or at least make it right for the customer.
#54
05-02-2017, 08:22 AM
i would hope to god not. Its not normal and indicates lack of maintenance or extreme running conditions. Same would go for finding "peanut butter" in the oil indicating high levels of moisture.
#55
05-02-2017, 08:26 AM
The sludge on the dipstick also means they didn't check the oil period, or just didn't care and passed it.
https://www.ford.com/resources/ford/...o/ford_cpo.pdf
section 6, check box 89, 102 and 103. He needs to get this from the original dealer(probably will be forged to cover their ***) and see what they put. If they didn't bother to check those what else was missed.
https://www.ford.com/resources/ford/...o/ford_cpo.pdf
section 6, check box 89, 102 and 103. He needs to get this from the original dealer(probably will be forged to cover their ***) and see what they put. If they didn't bother to check those what else was missed.
#56
05-02-2017, 08:28 AM
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Harrisburg, PA
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I have been quiet for the last week on FTE because I had wrist surgery last week, and it's hard to type. Making an exception for this thread.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
STOP and think about what you are doing. Seriously. The CARFAX suggests that the truck may have missed its first oil change interval, and a bit longer than recommended on the second one. Evidence through your oil cap suggests that was probably all the maintenance it received.
So what do you think they are going to do? Dealer #1 took the truck in trade in good faith from the previous owner, who is responsible for the neglect. He was under no legal obligation to anyone but the leasing bank to maintain the truck, and since it's no longer theirs they have no interest in the matter. Dealer #2 should have done a better job with their certification, but do you see "Check oil cap for sludge" on any of the certification docs? Just bought a certified Ford last month, and I would bet you a nice dinner that it's not on there. So the oil and air filters are likely the only bone you can pick with them.
I've been on FTE for nearly fourteen years now, and have owned over a dozen Fords in that time. Manufacturers routinely deny warranty claims because of evidence of prior neglect, and Ford is no different. The selling dealer IS NOT LIABLE for neglect of the previous owner; they are responsible for following the Ford checklist when they certify the truck. There is no recourse against them other than asking for a new filter. I'm more likely to become elected Governor of MN without running than having either the dealer or Ford replace your engine. It's not their fault, and there's no chance they will spend $10K on something an unknown third party did long before they ever saw the truck.
Your extraordinary steps to document the neglect may well cost you an engine in the future, because you are seeking to make the negligence clear as day without any possibility of a new engine. 'cause there isn't one, unless you are the one paying for it. STOP trying to convince Ford your truck was neglected, this will only encourage them to deny an engine replacement 50,000 miles down the road should it happen. Yes, you appear to be getting screwed, but there's no guarantee that anything will fail. IF something breaks as a result of this negligence, your best bet is warranty covering it. A warranty you are bound and determined to have completely cancelled. My recommendation would be to STOP trying to get your warranty voided, you will not come out ahead here.
Done typing, my wrist hurts.
IF they did and this all was missed then, if I was Ford, I would want some answers to why... This type of behavior, if acceptable by Ford, makes there CPO program worthless and I will be spreading that word...
Rigth now I am not jumping to conclusions and playing it out day by day. Will I get screwed on this...maybe...but Im getting screwed even if I dont try so...here we are...
#57
05-02-2017, 08:31 AM
Postmaster
Just curious, but after having to add as much oil to the crankcase just to get it on the stick, have you noticed any residual oil or splatter under the truck? Any seals, pan gasket, plug or filter leak?
Just me, but with that amount of sludge and lack of oil, you'd think you get some "smoke" when its first started and definitely when you mash the go pedal. I know at this point any of the above is prolly irrelevant, but this kind of thing would drive me insane, I'd be poking around everywhere under the truck, would look like an episode of CSI
(Yeah, I have OCD)!
Just me, but with that amount of sludge and lack of oil, you'd think you get some "smoke" when its first started and definitely when you mash the go pedal. I know at this point any of the above is prolly irrelevant, but this kind of thing would drive me insane, I'd be poking around everywhere under the truck, would look like an episode of CSI
(Yeah, I have OCD)!
#58
05-02-2017, 08:37 AM
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Harrisburg, PA
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Just curious, but after having to add as much oil to the crankcase just to get it on the stick, have you noticed any residual oil or splatter under the truck? Any seals, pan gasket, plug or filter leak?
Just me, but with that amount of sludge and lack of oil, you'd think you get some "smoke" when its first started and definitely when you mash the go pedal. I know at this point any of the above is prolly irrelevant, but this kind of thing would drive me insane, I'd be poking around everywhere under the truck, would look like an episode of CSI
(Yeah, I have OCD)!
Just me, but with that amount of sludge and lack of oil, you'd think you get some "smoke" when its first started and definitely when you mash the go pedal. I know at this point any of the above is prolly irrelevant, but this kind of thing would drive me insane, I'd be poking around everywhere under the truck, would look like an episode of CSI
(Yeah, I have OCD)!
#59
05-02-2017, 08:42 AM
Yes, but what is the remedy? Revocation of the certified warranty? Or an out-of-state legal battle that would likely exceed the cost of a new engine in effort to cancel the sale because of false pretenses? Many states embrace the principle of caveat emptor, or buyer beware, so this may be an expensive effort in futility.
Remedy? I would push for a buy back. The truck is not as it was advertised. They failed to complete the required inspection for CPO, and the truck was sold as a CPO vehicle. Like you said getting them to stick a crate motor is probably a long shot(unless the CPO does have some leagle recourse) but there is not a good way to "Fix" it. Sure flush it a few times, but where is all that sludge going? It's going everywhere in that engine. If it was a traditional engine, no cam phasers or turbos i would say a flush may work but its not, and that remaining sludge is a recipe for disaster.
Even with buyer beware, if you knowling withhold information, try to hide an issue or misrepresent what you're selling you are opening up a can of worms. We had a local dealer get in trouble for selling used vehicles with "new zero mile" tires. come to find out those "new" tires were over 10 years old and not new lol. Never found out what happened because it ended up settled out of court.
#60
05-02-2017, 08:43 AM
More Turbo
The sludge on the dipstick also means they didn't check the oil period, or just didn't care and passed it.
https://www.ford.com/resources/ford/...o/ford_cpo.pdf
section 6, check box 89, 102 and 103. He needs to get this from the original dealer(probably will be forged to cover their ***) and see what they put. If they didn't bother to check those what else was missed.
https://www.ford.com/resources/ford/...o/ford_cpo.pdf
section 6, check box 89, 102 and 103. He needs to get this from the original dealer(probably will be forged to cover their ***) and see what they put. If they didn't bother to check those what else was missed.
I would ask for their printed names if you can't read the signatures. I would bet one of them recently left the company.