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Bronco to Have a Solid Front Axle?

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Bronco to Have a Solid Front Axle?

 
  #16  
Old 02-03-2017, 08:26 AM
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Count me out for the solid front axle, not really interested in that. Maintenance on modern IFS setups is substantially easier, in addition to the ride and handling benefits. If I were to be buying a Bronco it would be my daily driver, and I'm not interested in off-roading my DD.

I'd love something a bit more truck-ish than the Explorer and Escape, but I've never been interested in a Wrangler.
 
  #17  
Old 02-03-2017, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by P.Bronner View Post
Yeah, TTB was actually not a bad design EXCEPT there was no means of camber adjustment from the factory. I know you can install an eccentric pivot bushing and/or indexable ball joints, but it would have been nice of them to do it at the factory.
I'm not sure what you are talking about. The caster/camber adjustment is done by an eccentric on the top ball joint.

tseekins,
Manufacturers have been using sealing unit bearings with solid axles for decades so I'm not sure why you would think that Ford would not go the same founts and use bearings that required service every 30K miles or so.
 
  #18  
Old 02-03-2017, 10:01 AM
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My issue isn't with bearings, it's the labor to disassemble the whole knuckle for a balljoint, U-joint, or bearing service. Lots more unsprung weight makes for a harsher ride.

No thanks. Good for off-road, crap for everything else. Wouldn't fit my needs.
 
  #19  
Old 02-03-2017, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by My4Fordtrucks View Post
I'm not sure what you are talking about. The caster/camber adjustment is done by an eccentric on the top ball joint.

tseekins,
Manufacturers have been using sealing unit bearings with solid axles for decades so I'm not sure why you would think that Ford would not go the same founts and use bearings that required service every 30K miles or so.
Because the owners guide that came with my '86 and '88 trucks said to repack the bearings every 30K miles and to check them if the front axle was submerged. I can't prove what I read as I haven't had the truck for some time now.

I've had these apart enough to know that they are sealed but nothing is 100% water tight.
 
  #20  
Old 02-03-2017, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by tseekins View Post
Because the owners guide that came with my '86 and '88 trucks said to repack the bearings every 30K miles and to check them if the front axle was submerged. I can't prove what I read as I haven't had the truck for some time now.
That was 30 years ago, Tim, and not exclusive to solid axles. Some recent 2WD F150s have had serviceable bearings, but I think the last year was '08. I remember the older Panther cars used serviceable bearings, but my '97 had sealed units.

Super Duties have had unit bearings since at least '99. People like to grouse about the cost when they fail, but you don't hear them complaining every two years about servicing them. Bearing service is a PITA, and I'm happy that it's largely a thing of the past.
 
  #21  
Old 02-04-2017, 05:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom View Post
That was 30 years ago, Tim, and not exclusive to solid axles. Some recent 2WD F150s have had serviceable bearings, but I think the last year was '08. I remember the older Panther cars used serviceable bearings, but my '97 had sealed units.

Super Duties have had unit bearings since at least '99. People like to grouse about the cost when they fail, but you don't hear them complaining every two years about servicing them. Bearing service is a PITA, and I'm happy that it's largely a thing of the past.
Well it's about time then. I hated having to service the front ends of my trucks, it is a PITA but I did it and never had to so much as replace a worn bearing on either of the TTB trucks.
 
  #22  
Old 02-04-2017, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by My4Fordtrucks View Post
I'm not sure what you are talking about. The caster/camber adjustment is done by an eccentric on the top ball joint.

tseekins,
Manufacturers have been using sealing unit bearings with solid axles for decades so I'm not sure why you would think that Ford would not go the same founts and use bearings that required service every 30K miles or so.
Yes, an eccentric top ball joint as I stated, which is NOT installed from the factory. At least not on any TTB I've owned (3). Camber alone can also be adjusted by means of an eccentric cam installed on the pivot, also as I stated earlier. All these things have to be user installed. No factory adjustment on anything I've owned.
 
  #23  
Old 02-04-2017, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by P.Bronner View Post
Yes, an eccentric top ball joint as I stated, which is NOT installed from the factory. At least not on any TTB I've owned (3). Camber alone can also be adjusted by means of an eccentric cam installed on the pivot, also as I stated earlier. All these things have to be user installed. No factory adjustment on anything I've owned.
No. You are incorrect. The eccentric (caster/camber bushing) was installed when the alignment was set at the factory. The adjustment is the sleeve around the stud on the top ball joint. When the alignment was done at a later date it may have been replaced with another bushing to correct the caster or camber because of wear or spring settling. If you couldn't read the numbers on the old sleeve to know where you were starting, you replaced it with a zero (0) and rechecked the alignment. Then you would refer to a chart and it would tell you which bushings to install to set the caster and camber. That is NOT the same as an adjustable ball joint or caster bushings for the radius arm.

I currently have 2 TTB trucks (down from 3) and have never needed to use an adjustable ball joint to get the caster and camber back into specs. There is something worn out in your suspension if that is what is needed. I worked as a line tech in the 90's at the local Ford dealer and all the caster/camber adjustments are by the eccentric.
 
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Old 02-04-2017, 04:12 PM
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  #25  
Old 02-09-2017, 09:20 PM
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Really confused by some of the responses here. It really needs to have solid axles. Anyone that says the independent suspension is good offroad doesn't go off road. Second, IT'S A BRONCO, why are we focusing on road handling? If that is what you care about, why the heck are you buying a bronco? Independent can be made to be good in serious offroad with enough money like what they do in the king of the hammers, but OEM and IFS are 6 letters that should not be in the same sentence when talking about offroad. Independent front and rear? Hell no! that would be the biggest joke ever.
 
  #26  
Old 02-09-2017, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom View Post
My issue isn't with bearings, it's the labor to disassemble the whole knuckle for a balljoint, U-joint, or bearing service. Lots more unsprung weight makes for a harsher ride.

No thanks. Good for off-road, crap for everything else. Wouldn't fit my needs.
Your needs sound like you should not be buying a bronco.
 
  #27  
Old 02-09-2017, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by theboom View Post
Really confused by some of the responses here. It really needs to have solid axles. Anyone that says the independent suspension is good offroad doesn't go off road. Second, IT'S A BRONCO, why are we focusing on road handling? If that is what you care about, why the heck are you buying a bronco? Independent can be made to be good in serious offroad with enough money like what they do in the king of the hammers, but OEM and IFS are 6 letters that should not be in the same sentence when talking about offroad. Independent front and rear? Hell no! that would be the biggest joke ever.
For rockcrawling, straight axles are the way to go, along with revolver shackles and all kinds of other mods that make a vehicle nearly undriveable at highway speeds. For Baja /dunes type racing, everything has gone to IFS. Trucks, buggies etc. Definitely depends on the target market. A minuscule percentage of buyers are going rock crawling with their new Bronco, assuming they even make production. Most will be preppie-mobiles and suburban grocery getters. Don't forget the slalom/skidpad testing they'll have to pass. At minimum they'll be IFS front/solid rear. Bet you a Big Mac.

Frankly I'm skeptical that we'll ever see them make production. I think Ford is just putting out feelers right now. Anybody remember the Dodge T-Rex? Never happened.
 
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Old 02-09-2017, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by P.Bronner View Post
For rockcrawling, straight axles are the way to go, along with revolver shackles and all kinds of other mods that make a vehicle nearly undriveable at highway speeds. For Baja /dunes type racing, everything has gone to IFS. Trucks, buggies etc. Definitely depends on the target market. A minuscule percentage of buyers are going rock crawling with their new Bronco, assuming they even make production. Most will be preppie-mobiles and suburban grocery getters. Don't forget the slalom/skidpad testing they'll have to pass. At minimum they'll be IFS front/solid rear. Bet you a Big Mac.

Frankly I'm skeptical that we'll ever see them make production. I think Ford is just putting out feelers right now. Anybody remember the Dodge T-Rex? Never happened.
In king of the hammers there is still a TON of rigs that use solid front. How does the wrangler/rubicon or super duty pass the skid pad with their solid front? My rubicon will cruse at 80mph no problem, whats the issue? They can be made to ride decent as well. I just really don't get the point of bringing back the bronco if it's not going to have anything different other than the model name from anything else ford has already. For everything other than high speed desert racing, they are better at anything offroad and the bronco is supposed to be fords offroad vehicle so make it good at that. I laugh at the raptor, it's a pos offroad. Tell me, they said only 4 door, no removable roof, people saying independent suspension, I literally can't see any reason to buy this "bronco", if you can even call it that, over something like the expedition.

This would be a really dumb conversation:
Customer-"I am looking at the bronco and the expedition, what is the difference"
Dealership-"The name of it. That's about it. We are trying to sell it by disrespecting the bronco name."
 
  #29  
Old 02-14-2017, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by theboom View Post
In king of the hammers there is still a TON of rigs that use solid front. How does the wrangler/rubicon or super duty pass the skid pad with their solid front? My rubicon will cruse at 80mph no problem, whats the issue? They can be made to ride decent as well. I just really don't get the point of bringing back the bronco if it's not going to have anything different other than the model name from anything else ford has already. For everything other than high speed desert racing, they are better at anything offroad and the bronco is supposed to be fords offroad vehicle so make it good at that. I laugh at the raptor, it's a pos offroad. Tell me, they said only 4 door, no removable roof, people saying independent suspension, I literally can't see any reason to buy this "bronco", if you can even call it that, over something like the expedition.

This would be a really dumb conversation:
Customer-"I am looking at the bronco and the expedition, what is the difference"
Dealership-"The name of it. That's about it. We are trying to sell it by disrespecting the bronco name."
The new Bronco will basically be a resurrection of the pre-2011 Explorer sizewise (maybe with removable roof panels and maybe some skid plates) and is significantly smaller than an Expy, just like the new Ranger will be smaller than the F150. The Expy ain't remotely an off-roader and has IFS and IRS.

As for IFS, look at the Toyota 4Runner and current Tacoma (and departed FJ Cruiser), recently departed Nissan XTerra, and any modern Jeep other than the Wrangler. How about the real military Hummer H1? These as well as modern Land Cruisers, Land Rovers, Range Rovers have no solid front axles. Many of these have some serious off road credibility... Off road design has gone well beyond oxcarts these days.

I did just see a new GMC Acadia with the "all terrain" package and that is pretty funny...the most aggressive tires they offer are Michelin all season Premiers. No car company is gonna make money selling specialized vehicles that are true rock crawlers; I would bet that less than 5% of new Wranglers ever see serious off road duty in my area (Detroit and burbs).

George
 
  #30  
Old 02-15-2017, 12:17 AM
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Come to think of it, I'd rather see portal axles on this thing!
 

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