It is what it is and all I can do at this point is hope for the best. Most of the "good" traction bars out there mount to the frame with holes in one fashion or another. Back when I first started this venture, someone had told me about the potential problem of drilling holes in the flange, but I figured because of the bracket and the way it is designed and the fact that there are a lot of holes in the flange and frame the entire length of the truck it would be fine.

Again, I am not an engineer of any sort so what I say is only my own thoughts and ideas. I think that the traction bars will perform as intended and have no negative effects on the frame or its ability to support the weight of a 5th wheel. As Rich said, there are a lot of OUO bars out there, and even more of the other brands that also require holes to be drilled.

It would have been nice to see a different bracket from OUO that goes along with what Ford has designated as an OK practice when modifying the frame, but it is what it is and what is done is done. There is no getting away from holes in the flange being a bad idea based on what Ford has said, but at least they are only 3/8" (.375) and at least they are somewhat close to what Ford requires for the vertical part.

I have been thinking about sending the link to this thread to OUO for comment, but I am not sure about the sponsor/company rules in regards to posting. I suppose it doesn't matter anyway because no matter what OUO has to say, Ford has deemed that drilling into the flange is a bad idea.

I really hope I did not F%^K up my truck simply by trying to make it better, that is all I have to say.

I have been working on a couple of other videos for the forum in regards to other modifications/improvements for the truck, but I will take some time and reconsider the content and what may come of them before posting them.

Happy holidays everyone.

 

I am interested in the OUO kit as well. I also wondered about drilling the frame but figured I was over thinking something that has been out on the market. Has anyone been able to find anything on the web about frame failures after an install.

Looking at the pictures, its hard to tell, but would it be possible to box the frame in that area in order to strengthen it. I'm sure the fuel tank, lines and harnesses on the driver side would need to moved for welding and reinstalled.

Really not ideal for someone planning to install the kit, but maybe a possible solution for someone that has already done the install and is having second thoughts.

I am by no means an expert in this area, but I thought it may be worth putting out there. For all I know Ford may have rules out there that go against any welding on the frame.

 

Maybe I should look at having the holes filled/repaired and the frame fortified, then have the brackets welded to the frame. I just don't know what to do at this point to be honest. The sole purpose for installing the bars was to make towing our 5th wheel a much more pleasant experience. The axle wrap was not too bad unloaded but would shake your soul out of you when loaded with the 5th wheel.

EDIT: I just don't have the time or funds to be sending my truck off to a frame shop, especially if the fuel lines and tank need to be removed. I will have to just see how things go and hope for the best.

 

I would relax,even though I was taught not to drill in them locations,Our 75 F-250 & 01 F-350 in signature, Previous Owners had drilled in these locations with never a sign of cracks, both trucks hauled heavy,not to mention all the other light/medium trucks in service That I worked on in this same situation.

 

I've never heard of a failure related to a mount, doubt many have. Engineers do err on the side of caution at least 3x in automotive engineering and factoring the difference in loading from a bed load to traction bar, I just don't see a lot to be concerned about. Keep an eye on it and my guess is in a few month's you'll find this is not a problem. Would certainly not advise to remove and weld up on a frame, that seems more counterproductive. The only viable option IMO would be creating interface plates that spread the load significantly more. My .02 FWIW.

 

Drive your truck. It'll be fine.

 

If you look up by the transmission mounts, you'll see that Ford has violated their own "rule" about drilling into the flanges.
Everybody's worried about lawsuits. Ford as well as OUO. It is much easier and safer to say don't do it than to explain how to do it safely. I'd be reasonably sure that OUO has their own engineer.
You did a professional job. You stepped your bits and you torqued everything down correctly. You followed instructions. I would not be concerned. I would just enjoy it.

 

After a lot of consideration and sleeping on it, I trust that the 8 holes per side of the traction bar system will not cause a problem. I was under the truck today beginning the install of Air Lift 5000 bags (more difficult than I thought it would be) and noticed holes in the flange along the entire length of the frame made from the factory.

In my uneducated opinion the holes are far enough apart and center enough on the flange and vertical web not to cause an issue. Also, the way the bracket is designed and installed appears to fortify that particular section of the frame by bridging the gap between the holes.

To each their own of course (I would not have it any other way), but I am comfortable with the way the bars are mounted to the frame. I will continue to monitor the locations when changing the oil or any other time I am under the truck, but do not expect to find anything.

I have asked RiffRaff and OUO to chime in here if they have time (it is Christmas time and they are running a business) and provide any sort of feedback they may have gotten from previous customers. I can only speculate, but perhaps they can enlighten us on why the brackets were designed as they were without divulging too many trade secrets.

Thank you all for the compliments on the video and process of install. I have a few more videos in the works now and will post them once they are done. They include Bilstein shocks, AirLift bags, Wireless One compressor, OUO air line valves, HPOP lines, fuel bowl rebuild kit, etc...

 

I just got off the phone with David from OUO and I am going to do my best to quote him from the conversation we had about the bars and the way they mount to the truck. I asked him to keep me honest and read up on my notes and call me if they are not the message that he was intending to get across.

1. OUO has roughly 20 Ford dealers around the country that install these bars as I have with zero reported problems.

2. The bracket is designed to cover the vertical (web) and horizontal (flange) sections of the frame to strengthen it, not make it weaker. One without the other is not the optimal design even though it still would be OK, the mounting locations on both surfaces causes it to utilize the others. I saw this as a single single stick being snapped or 8 sticks being snapped. The 8 sticks are clearly stronger.

3. The flange and vertical web drilling Ford claims to be "no drilling", but it is easier for Ford to say no drilling rather than stipulate the different diameters of the potential holes and what they may do. David said that when people start drilling 5/8" or 3/4" holes in the flange, you will probably see long term problems from these. The 3/8" holes have been researched and found to be the most reliable in regards to the mounting hardware and holes in the frame.

4. Not all 8 holes need to be drilled into the c-channel frame of our truck. The 8 holes are recommended for box frame trucks where the actual steel is thinner and lighter. In addition, you don't have to drill into the flange for the 4 3/8" holes if you don't want, you could drill the 4 holes in the vertical web and that should be fine. Clearly, drilling all 8 per side gives you the most support for the bars, but is not required.

5. After over 1000 sets of this design traction bars have been installed, OUO has received zero complaints or comments about the frame failing on any truck.

6. The brackets could be welded onto the frame if the customer prefers, but not everyone has access to a welder (like me) or has the skill to do a quality job. I took this as it is much easier for someone such as myself to drill and mount 8 holes per side than to try and monkey around with a welder or take the truck somewhere to be done.

7. The 90 degree bracket went through many, many designs before OUO decided on the current design. The mounting of the bracket on both the horizontal and vertical section of the frame allows for maximum flex and bracing. That in combination with the way the bushings and bar are affixed to the bracket is the safest and most effective method of traction bars on the market.

8. OUO has several "jump trucks" (I made sure he meant trucks that make jumps from ramps and what not) that get beat in the dunes until they break and zero of those have broken a frame because of the traction bars or the brackets. David told me a story about one guy that refused to go home until he broke something on the truck and this owner broke a wheel before breaking the bars or frame mounting location.

9. For the frame to fail at the drilling location, the top of the frame where the top c-channel is would need to be compromised in some way as it would need to collapse on itself. The bottom of the frame c-channel tightens and the OUO bracket actually helps to stop this from happening by spreading the weight across the frame at the mounting locations.

I did my best to write notes down as David from OUO explained to me why they designed the bars and brackets the way they did. He was very respectful of my concerns and the concerns of the FTE members here. In my opinion it is hard to find this sort of customer service nowadays. I have seen the same level of support from other FTE favorites like Clay from RiffRaff or Corey from CNC Fabrication.

I can now say with confidence that I am completely comfortable with what I have done to my truck and am looking forward to hooking up the 5th wheel and towing it around the country like a champ. I used to roll into the throttle and try to convince the truck not to shake itself and my family to death while starting out. I would slowly roll through stop signs in an effort to reduce the axle wrap with the trailer on, but no more my friends!

Once I get the air bags installed, I might just hook up the trailer to tow around the countryside a bit just because...

 

This is a small jump for a OUO lifted truck. I have seen videos of them jumping them at the dunes 10-12 feet in the air and 40-50 feet out. From what Dave mentioned to do one of these lifts you have to drill over 70 holes in the frame for mounting everything. If you can jump over and over those kind of jumps and have that many holes in the frame I don't think 8 per side is going to matter

 

I forgot the lifted trucks part of our conversation!

David did mention that lifted trucks have several holes drilled into the frames and some of those lifted trucks do a lot of jumping. He mentioned that there is a video on the OUO site where a truck is jumping about 100 ft. I laughed and thought to myself, well that is good enough for me then...

 

I am not an engineer but I could never understand why drilling of frame flanges would be prohibited unless they were concerned that someone might go overboard with drilling. It is great that you made the call to them and got peace of mind on it. Worrying about that all the time would bite.

 

With the question of the frame holes raised and answered, I now feel like this is the most comprehensive thread on the OUO traction bars that can be found on the internet. Great job to Sous for his hard work on the actual install, documenting his actions, following up on questions raised, and posting the answers to those questions.

As a person looking specifically at this mod, I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy.

 

Rich, you are very welcome and the thanks are much appreciated. I hope this thread serves as an educational platform for many people for years to come.

I know when I was doing my search on the OUO bars for our truck, the information was limited at best and difficult to decipher at times. I strive to help others out and aid them in learning from my experiences and mistakes just as I like to learn from the experiences and mistakes of others.

Cheers again Rich, hope your holiday is good for you and your family.

 

Sous, I think you'll be fine with your install.

I've seen frame failures. Most recently a buddy asked me to look at his 10 ton dump truck. The frame had substantial damage.

I saw the flange broken at drilled bolts of an addon bracket.

The cause, IMHO, was due in part to the unsupported weight at the far rear edge of the frame, then apparently compounded by shims welded to raise one side, which acted as a fulcrum that transferred the stress to the top flange unevenly, which I think then failed.

I saw one many years ago (80's) with another addon pickup truck dump bed. Again overloaded to break the frame.

In the first case we repaired the frame. In this second case we will likely plate and wrap split c-channel, heavy, around the top and bottom flanges about 24" on one end and 36" on the other end of the failed spots.

Of interest to note about long supports is that the flanges bear most of the distortion forces. They MUST NOT shrink or stretch. The center webbing are fillers. The farther away the two flanges (wider beam), the greater the "internal leverage" between the flanges. (engineers may cringe at that terminology, as I try to describe what the webbing does)

IMHO it is sloppy holes in flanges that cause the most problems. They create voids, whereas you have only created very tight areas filled with solid bolts. There will be some minor gapping there, but likely very minimal.

Especially with the bottom flange, most of that force will likely be compression, which the flange and bolts should have no trouble taking up.

Holes securing through the webbing put the "leverage" to work, spreading out any forces that may distort the frame.

Considering the engineering by the OUO guys and the substantial extremes their systems are pushed to endure, I highly doubt towing even a really heavy 5th wheel will hurt it.

Now...if you decide to tow that puppy at 90MPH as you do Yahoos across the desert dunes.....THAT may be hard on it