6.4L Power Stroke Diesel Engine fitted to 2008 - 2010 F250, F350 and F450 pickup trucks and F350 + Cab Chassis

Diesel Kleen to clean DPF?

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  #16  
Old 07-17-2017, 09:53 AM
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Don't forget about Archoil. Their fuel additive provides "the works" pretty much. I've had good results with that and their oil additive as well. AR9100 and AR6200.
 
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Old 07-17-2017, 10:09 AM
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"they haven't had a forced regen in over two months which I'm very pleased about. In addition milage is up on the test trucks 15-17 percent."

I'm curious... how much was spent on the additive in that time? If anything, I think the biggest value is minimizing the annoyance of regening all the time.

I still have a bottle of DK in my garage. Now that you mentioned it, I forgot I still have it but haven't missed using it.

My belief of using good fuel from the big brands compensates for the need of adding additives still holds true :-)
 
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Old 07-17-2017, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by aquaman
...My belief of using good fuel from the big brands compensates for the need of adding additives still holds true :-)
I agree with you on using good/name brand fuel. However, I still like to use additives. It can only help.
 
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Old 07-17-2017, 01:42 PM
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cleaners will "dirty" the exhuast system first, before the cleaner state is reached.

the cleaner will loosen carbon from the combustion chambers and manifolds , cat converter, which will clogg the DPF initially....so upon initial use...rengens may happen more frequently until the catch up game is complete.

it will take a few tank fuls to get to the really clean state.
 
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Old 07-17-2017, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by speakerfritz
cleaners will "dirty" the exhuast system first, before the cleaner state is reached.

the cleaner will loosen carbon from the combustion chambers and manifolds , cat converter, which will clogg the DPF initially....so upon initial use...rengens may happen more frequently until the catch up game is complete.

it will take a few tank fuls to get to the really clean state.
Yes sir...and then once the cleaning has begun...I continue to throw the Archoil with every tank...so the cleanliness remains. At least that's the idea anyway.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by jimh425
I think the problem is people aren't clear about what Diesel Kleen says it does and doesn't do. For sure, I'm not the only one who can hear/feel the difference running it and not for the past 10 years in different vehicles.

In any case, update us on how your new DPF cleaner works.
I am fully aware what the diesel kleen does and does not do, there have been many independent studies that support the product is lacking to say the least. There are MUCH better products to run if your interested in diesel fuel additives that help deal with the low sulfur fuel we currently have to use. Opti-lube is about the best on the market for cetane and lubricant additives.

Enerburn is about the best catalyst additive to help teir 4 engines with erg and DPF emissions as well as final their 4 engine that use the above and SCR. These two products are very different and serve different purposes.



The following are the preliminary results of a research study on diesel fuel Lubricity Additives. There is likely to be further commentary and explanation added at a future time.

PURPOSE:

The purpose of this research was to determine the ability of multiple diesel fuel additives to replace the vital lubricity component in ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfer Diesel) fuel.

HISTORY:

ULSD fuel is the fuel currently mandated for use in all on road diesel engines. This fuel burns cleaner and is less polluting than it’s predecessor, called Low Sulfer Diesel Fuel. Low sulfer fuel contained less than 500 ppm of sulfer. ULSD contains 15 ppm or less.
As diesel fuel is further refined to remove the polluting sulfer, it is inadvertently stripped of its lubricating properties. This vital lubrication is a necessary component of the diesel fuel as it prevents wear in the fuel delivery system. Specifically, it lubricates pumps, high pressure pumps and injectors. Traditional Low sulfer diesel fuel typically contained enough lubricating ability to suffice the needs of these vital components. ULSD fuel, on the other hand, is considered to be very “dry” and incapable of lubricating vital fuel delivery components. As a result, these components are at risk of premature and even catastrophic failure when ULSD fuel is introduced to the system. As a result, all oil companies producing ULSD fuel must replace the lost lubricity with additives. All ULSD fuel purchased at retail fuel stations SHOULD be adequately treated with additives to replace this lost lubricity. The potential result of using inadequately treated fuel, as indicated above, can be catastrophic. There have been many documented cases of randomly tested samples of diesel fuel. These tests prove that often times the fuel we purchase is not adequately treated and may therefore contribute to accelerated wear of our fuel delivery systems. For this reason it may be prudent to use an after market diesel fuel additive to ENSURE adequate lubrication of the fuel delivery system. Additionally, many additives can offer added benefits such as cetane improver, and water separators or emulsifiers.

CONTENT:

In this study we will test multiple diesel fuel additives designed to replace lost lubricity. The primary component of this study is a side-by-side laboratory analysis of each additive’s ability to replace this vital lubricity. Additionally, claims of improving cetane, water separation or emulsification, bio-diesel compatibility and alcohol content will be noted. These notes were derived from information that was readily available to consumers (via the label and internet information) and none of this information has been evaluated for validity and/or performance. Cetane information has only been noted if the word “cetane” was used in the advertising information. The words “improves power” has not been translated to mean “improves cetane” in this evaluation. Information on alcohol content is provided by indicating “contains no alcohol”. Omission of the words “contains no alcohol” does not imply that it does contain alcohol. This information was simply missing in the information available to a consumer. However, the possibility of a form of alcohol in these products is possible. Additionally, information on dosages and cost per tankful are included for comparison purposes.

How Diesel Fuel Is Evaluated For Lubricating Ability:

Diesel fuel and other fluids are tested for lubricating ability using a device called a “High Frequency Reciprocating Rig” or HFRR. The HFRR is currently the Internationally accepted, standardized method to evaluate fluids for lubricating ability. It uses a ball bearing that reciprocates or moves back and forth on a metal surface at a very high frequency for a duration of 90 minutes. The machine does this while the ball bearing and metal surface are immersed in the test fluid (in this case, treated diesel fuel). At the end of the test the ball bearing is examined under a microscope and the “wear scar” on the ball bearing is measured in microns. The larger the wear scar, the poorer the lubricating ability of the fluid. Southwest Research runs every sample twice and averages the size of the wear scar.
The U.S. standard for diesel fuel says a commercially available diesel fuel should produce a wear scar of no greater than 520 microns. The Engine Manufacturers Association had requested a standard of a wear scar no greater than 460 microns, typical of the pre-ULSD fuels. Most experts agree that a 520 micron standard is adequate, but also that the lower the wear scar the better.

METHOD:

An independent research firm in Texas was hired to do the laboratory work. The cost of the research was paid for voluntarily by the participating additive manufacturers. Declining to participate and pay for the research were the following companies: Amsoil and Power Service. Because these are popular products it was determined that they needed to be included in the study. These products were tested using funds collected by diesel enthusiasts at “dieselplace.com”. Additionally, unconventional additives such as 2-cycle oil and used motor oil were tested for their abilities to aid in diesel fuel lubricity. These were also paid for by members of “dieselplace.com”.
The study was conducted in the following manner:
-The Research firm obtained a quantity of “untreated” ULSD fuel from a supplier. This fuel was basic ULSD fuel intended for use in diesel engines. However, this sample was acquired PRIOR to any attempt to additize the fuel for the purpose of replacing lost lubricity. In other words, it was a “worst case scenario, very dry diesel fuel” that would likely cause damage to any fuel delivery system. This fuel was tested using the HFRR at the Southwest Research Laboratory. This fuel was determined to have a very high HFRR score of 636 microns, typical of an untreated ULSD fuel. It was determined that this batch of fuel would be utilized as the baseline fuel for testing all of the additives. The baseline fuel HFRR score of 636 would be used as the control sample. All additives tested would be evaluated on their ability to replace lost lubricity to the fuel by comparing their scores to the control sample. Any score under 636 shows improvement to the fuels ability to lubricate the fuel delivery system of a diesel engine.

BLIND STUDY:

In order to ensure a completely unbiased approach to the study, the following steps were taken:
Each additive tested was obtained independently via internet or over the counter purchases. The only exceptions were Opti-Lube XPD and the bio-diesel sample. The reason for this is because Opti-Lube XPD additive was considered “experimental” at the time of test enrollment and was not yet on the market. It was sent directly from Opti-Lube company. The bio-diesel sample was sponsored by Renewable Energy Group. One of their suppliers, E.H. Wolf and Sons in Slinger, Wisconsin supplied us with a sample of 100% soybean based bio-diesel. This sample was used to blend with the baseline fuel to create a 2% bio-diesel for testing.
Each additive was bottled separately in identical glass containers. The bottles were labeled only with a number. This number corresponded to the additive contained in the bottle. The order of numbering was done randomly by drawing names out of a hat. Only Spicer Research held the key to the additives in each bottle.
The additive samples were then sent in a box to An independent research firm. The only information given them was the ratio of fuel to be added to each additive sample. For example, bottle “A” needs to be mixed at a ratio of “480-1”. The ratio used for each additive was the “prescribed dosage” found on the bottle label for that product. Used motor oil and 2-cycle oil were tested at a rationally chosen ratio of 200:1.
The Research Laboratory mixed the proper ratio of each “bottled fluid” into a separate container containing the baseline fuel. The data, therefore, is meaningful because every additive is tested in the same way using the same fuel. A side-by-side comparison of the effectiveness of each additive is now obtainable.

THE RESULTS:

These results are listed in the order of performance in the HFRR test. The baseline fuel used in every test started at an HFRR score of 636. The score shown is the tested HFRR score of the baseline fuel/additive blend.
Also included is the wear scar improvement provided by the additive as well as other claimed benefits of the additive. Each additive is also categorized as a Multi-purpose additive, Multi-purpose + anti-gel, Lubricity only, non-conventional, or as an additive capable of treating both gasoline and diesel fuel.
As a convenience to the reader there is also information on price per treated tank of diesel fuel (using a 26 gallon tank), and dosage per 26 gallon tank provided as “ounces of additive per 26 gallon tank”.

In Order Of Performance:

1) 2% REG SoyPower biodiesel
HFRR 221, 415 micron improvement.
50:1 ratio of baseline fuel to 100% biodiesel
66.56 oz. of 100% biodiesel per 26 gallons of diesel fuel
Price: market value

2)Opti-Lube XPD
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
cetane improver, demulsifier
HFRR 317, 319 micron improvement.
256:1 ratio
13 oz/tank
$4.35/tank

3)FPPF RV, Bus, SUV Diesel/Gas fuel treatment
Gas and Diesel
cetane improver, emulsifier
HFRR 439, 197 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.60/tank

4)Opti-Lube Summer Blend
Multi-purpose
demulsifier
HFRR 447, 189 micron improvement
3000:1 ratio
1.11 oz/tank
$0.68/tank

5)Opti-Lube Winter Blend
Muti-purpose + anti-gel
cetane improver
HFRR 461, 175 micron improvement
512:1 ratio
6.5 oz/tank
$3.65/tank

6)Schaeffer Diesel Treat 2000
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
cetane improver, emulsifier, bio-diesel compatible
HFRR 470, 166 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.87/tank

7)Super Tech Outboard 2-cycle TC-W3 engine oil
Unconventional (Not ULSD compliant, may damage 2007 or newer systems)
HFRR 474, 162 micron improvement
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
$1.09/tank

8)Stanadyne Lubricity Formula
Lubricity Only
demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 479, 157 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.00/tank

9)Amsoil Diesel Concentrate
Multi-purpose
demulsifier, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 488, 148 micron improvement
640:1 ratio
5.2 oz/tank
$2.16/tank

10)Power Service Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 575, 61 micron improvement
400:1 ratio
8.32 oz/tank
$1.58/tank

11)Howe’s Meaner Power Kleaner
Multi-purpose
Alcohol free
HFRR 586, 50 micron improvement
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.36/tank

12)Stanadyne Performance Formula
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
cetane improver, demulsifier, 5% bio-diesel compatible, alcohol free
HFRR 603, 33 micron improvement
480:1 ratio
6.9 oz/tank
$4.35/tank

13)Used Motor Oil, Shell Rotella T 15w40, 5,000 miles used.
Unconventional (Not ULSD compliant, may damage systems)
HFRR 634, 2 micron improvement
200:1 ratio
16.64 oz/tank
price: market value

14)Lucas Upper Cylinder Lubricant
Gas or diesel
HFRR 641, 5 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant change)
427:1 ratio
7.8 oz/tank
$2.65/tank

15)B1000 Diesel Fuel Conditioner by Milligan Biotech
Multi-purpose, canola oil based additive
HFRR 644, 8 microns worse than baseline (statistically insignificant change)
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.67/tank

16)FPPF Lubricity Plus Fuel Power
Multi-purpose + anti-gel
Emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 675, 39 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$1.12/tank

17)Marvel Mystery Oil
Gas, oil and Diesel fuel additive (NOT ULSD compliant, may damage 2007 and newer systems)
HFRR 678, 42 microns worse than baseline fuel.
320:1 ratio
10.4 oz/tank
$3.22/tank

18)ValvTect Diesel Guard Heavy Duty/Marine Diesel Fuel Additive
Multi-purpose
Cetane improver, emulsifier, alcohol free
HFRR 696, 60 microns worse than baseline fuel
1000:1 ratio
3.32 oz/tank
$2.38/tank

19)Primrose Power Blend 2003
Multi-purpose
Cetane boost, bio-diesel compatible, emulsifier
HFRR 711, 75 microns worse than baseline
1066:1 ratio
3.12 oz/tank
$1.39/tank

CONCLUSIONS:

Products 1 through 4 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an HFRR score of 460 or better. This meets the most strict requirements requested by the Engine Manufacturers Association.
Products 1 through 9 were able to improve the unadditized fuel to an HFRR score of 520 or better, meeting the U.S. diesel fuel requirements for maximum wear scar in a commercially available diesel fuel.
Products 16 through 19 were found to cause the fuel/additive blend to perform worse than the baseline fuel. The cause for this is speculative. This is not unprecedented in HFRR testing and can be caused by alcohol or other components in the additives. Further investigation into the possibilities behind these poor results will investigated.
Any additive testing within +/- 20 microns of the baseline fuel could be considered to have no significant change. The repeatability of this test allows for a +/- 20 micron variability to be considered insignificant.

CREDITS:

This study would not have been possible without the participation of all companies involved and dieselplace.com. A special Thank You to all of the dieselplace.com members who generously donated toward this study and waited longer than they should have for the results. You folks are the best. Arlen Spicer, organizer.
 
  #22  
Old 08-25-2017, 01:43 PM
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Most people are not aware of these better products because there not available at most truck stops, auto supplies, k-mart, Walmart ect like the poorer quality additives that are more main stream. Most of the good products have to purchased from a specialty store or ordered online and the cost is higher but the quality is well worth it in the long run.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by SANDDEMON08
Enerburn is about the best catalyst additive to help teir 4 engines with erg and DPF emissions as well as final their 4 engine that use the above and SCR. These two products are very different and serve different purposes.
You didn't update us with the results of using Enerburn. The study doesn't really matter unless you sell one or all of those products. In that case, maybe it's good advertisement ... maybe not.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 01:54 PM
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The enerburn product has worked very well. Its the only product we have tried so far that actual has reduced active regens. One truck has had zero active regens and one truck has had 2 loved by the PCM. Both truck have seen an increase in fuel milage but the biggest item the drivers like is almost no active regens. When there loaded with a 9 axle trailer empty there around 80,000 lbs and load there around 180-220,000 lbs which even with a 600 ISX the derate kills the performance during an active regen. Our other trucks are having active or forced regens ever other week
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 02:03 PM
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Ill also add to that last year the other 4 trucks had around 14,000 in emission related repairs, one of the trucks had a failed EGR cooler which racked about a 5-6K bill by-itself but the two test trucks have had zero emission related repairs which is impressive by-its self its pretty common for these trucks to need a NOX sensor at least once a year if not two just because the tolerances are so low.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by jimh425
The study doesn't really matter unless you sell one or all of those products. In that case, maybe it's good advertisement ... maybe not.
I guess one could argue that studies and publications also can be used to inform you and keep you from buying snake oil type products.

The U.S. standard for diesel fuel says a commercially available diesel fuel should produce a wear scar of no greater than 520 microns. The Engine Manufacturers Association had requested a standard of a wear scar no greater than 460 microns

All these request are ignored by the fuel industry because of the cost, so there provide the most cost effective fuel that works at the most minimum standards.

Standard low sulfur diesel available in the current market does not meet this, its a fact not an option. Current fuel systems found on common rail diesel engines are much more precise then former diesel engines. If your a long term diesel owner of a newer model diesel engine you will find value in this information to make an informed decision on a good fuel additive
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 04:07 PM
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Having done a lot of my own research both prior to and after buying my Powerstroke, everything SANDDEMON08 has posted agrees with my findings. However, while I have never used it, nor said anything good about it in the past, recent research has indicated that DK is a decent cetane booster and cleaner; it just doesn't improve lubricity at all. I am staying with Opti-Lube Summer Plus.
I am paying attention to his Enerburn project.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 04:13 PM
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Talking

Originally Posted by SkiSmuggs
it just doesn't improve lubricity at all.
Of course, that doesn't matter if we are strictly talking about affect on DPF.
 
  #29  
Old 08-25-2017, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by jimh425
Of course, that doesn't matter if we are strictly talking about affect on DPF.
Absolutely, but folks should know what they are getting.
 
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:05 PM
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Keep your tanks above 3/4

below that you get s lot of sloshing and foaming resulting in 5 to 10 percent entrapment

when this entrapped fuel hits your injectors it throws the injectors out of time due to the compressibility of air

this out of time operation results in improper burning, more unburnt furl, higher participants and more emmissions

rhen we deseil clean


cycle repeats
 


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