Hi guys, I'm usually in the F100 dent side forum but our Fire Department is looking to buy a brand new ambulance with the F 450 chassis and we were wondering does anybody have any problems with the Ford 6.7 diesel. The last two F450 bought had the 6.0 and we've had nothing but problems with both of them. The 7.3 was awesome and we still have one as a backup ride with almost 400,000 miles on it. Any input would be highly appreciated

 

I can appreciate what you do as I have friends in the same field, and I don't want this to come off wrong, but with importance of getting where you need to be I would chose a new gas motor. Is that an option? That said, I do believe the 6.7 is the most reliable of the new diesels, and I have owned them. All new diesels have their share of problems, and I have come to their stranded aid in my non-diesel. When I had my 2014 6.7, the chassis was a little different from the F250/350, it may still be.

 

the problems with all fuel burning vehicles post 2007 reguardless if its a harley ultra classic or an f-450 superduty is driven by the amount of heat the emmissions compliant systems produce as well as the sensitivity of the fuel systems.

the plus's of the 6.7 diesel include larger waterpump and a housing that is free air rather than the faceplate to the motor....this lets you see coolant leaks due to cavitation before your engine oil becomes filled with coolant. there are more head bolts than in the 6.4 or 6.7 so less chance of blowing a head gasket. the rocker arms are bigger and the push rods have cups which forces more oil thru the pushrod and onto the rocker arm tips. the lifters are much bigger which will help with lifter bearing failure. there is a bar across all the rockers which sprays oil onto the rockers which should help with premature rocker failure. there is less turbo lag due to the new design of the intake and exhaust paths.....they have been reversed...so the turbos are direct mounted onto what was the intake manifold which is now the exhuast manifold thus eliminating a lot of piping. the oil cooler is easier to service. the 6.7 is much better than the 6.0 and 6.4 in design and a lot of the material defects have been redesigned thanks to the owners of the 6.0 and 6.4 who were fords guinea pigs.

 

Every engine has it's share of problems. Some more than others.

That said, the 6.7L has proven thus far to be very reliable.

However, if you are planning to purchase a new diesel for service use, learn everything you can about care and maintenance of these modern engines. You'll need to become extremely familiar with the emissions system, as well as other new changes and updates to these motors. Maintenance plays a much greater factor vs the old days of just changing oil and fuel filters and drive it till the wheels fall off. Now you'll need to keep up with DEF refills, coolant system maintenance (there's 2 coolant systems now), and more. Not only that, you'll have to learn how emissions will affect things such as idle time, drive cycles, etc. These modern emissions systems do not hold up well to excessive idling or frequent short trips only.

Education is key to getting the most out of these engines.

 

Although I feel very inadequate to answer the question, I have done a lot of reading on the 6.7 before buying a diesel. I put 12,000 trouble free miles on a '15 F250, then traded for an F350 just before Christmas. This motor seems to be extremely reliable over previous Ford diesels - maybe the best. I have been amazed by the power, quick starting, quietness and overall performance of the vehicle. There is a thread on the 6.7 forum about high mileage 6.7's and they seem to be very positive. Thanks for what you do.

 

Thanks guys, I love Ford Trucks but our administration has been a little scared of buying a Ford diesel after having problems with the past ones our department has run. I'm definitely going to recommend we try another one.

We have two mechanics on duty and good dealerships in the area so I'm not worried about maintenance, we just need to make sure they stay on the road more than there in the shop.

The reason why we don't go with a gas ride for our trucks is one our entire fleet of engine, ladders and support trucks are diesels and every station has a diesel fill station at it.

I don't know if it still makes a difference for not but in the 80s and 90s we were in 460s in our ambulances and just didn't seem to last as long as the diesels do and didn't have the same power and fuel economy.

 

Oh by the way all of that emission stuff also applies to our new Pumper trucks, we have def on those too now and an exhaust system that weighs more then my F100 does.

 

Our brush truck is based on a 2011 F350, haven't had a single problem yet. The one thing that concerns me is high idle times, it's never shut off on scene and it doesn't have the high idle mod. That said, make sure you get it up fitted with the high idle and dual alternators to handle the load of all the medical equipment, climate control, Etc.. Fortunately, we got our new pumper and tanker pre-emmisions.

 

Make sure your commercial account manager makes you get the 47A or 47L ambulance packages. Making another chassis an ambulance will void your warranty. They both require the 6.7, so the gas options are ruled out (additionally they were balanced out for the year, so you'd have to wait anyhow).

The ambulance packages include manual regeneration controls so you can decided when to burn out the exhaust. Something important for folks who let their diesels idle for long periods and then also need on demand performance. The 350 DRW ambulance package does come with the wide track front axle, so you can make some of the other guys jealous.

Other than those notes, the 6.7 has been proving itself as a good motor. All modern diesels cost more to buy and operate than the old ones did, but that's the cost of progress. As many folks know, the 6.7 is designed by Ford, unlike the troublesome 6.0 and 6.4 motors. If I needed a diesel I would't hesitate to get one of these for my fleet.

 

There is no problem getting the right chassis the manufacturer Horton Ambulance takes care of all of that. They have been building trucks scince 1968 and was able to buy there first Ambulance back and it's in their showroom floor now. Any guess on how much a new ambulance cost it's between $190k and $240k which is absolutely crazy but what do you do.

 

One of the Ford PR videos for the 2017 showed the 6.7 in extreme cold environmental testing. In that video, they said that they had to handle their northern customers, who "start their trucks in the fall and don't turn them off until spring." Apparently, they idle all winter.

Is that not true, or have they fixed the long idle issues?

 

There's a difference between testing conditions and real life.

I've seen quite a few of those videos. Yes Ford often times will test extreme conditions to see how the vehicle reacts, but it's not an indication of real life longevity of components. In other words, just because they test it, doesn't mean that it's something that will hold up to a normal service life.

For example.... watch the video below. In it they actually recommend not to idle for long periods, but they do understand that in extreme cases some customers have to. In addition, they briefly discuss that there are inherent issues regarding the emissions system with excessive idling in extremely cold temps. No where in that video does Ford actually endorse excessive idling, nor do they state anything about the longevity of the DPF performance or indicate that excessive idling will lead to a normal service life.

 

Also, the manual OCR is available for anyone as an option. So anyone that does do a good amount of idle and short trips should option for this. Not a single truck that I have in stock has this though, so I mention it for folks to be aware of it. Ford test and has solutions for most situations, but if the customer don't know there are differences it's likely to assume a 6.7 is a 6.7 is a 6.7 while Ford is testing the right truck for the right job.

 

Unfortunately this option is only available on trucks with the basic driver information display. Those with the larger screen in the dash cluster do not have the option to have this enabled.


For fleets this isn't typically an issue since most are built with the basic screen. I believe all ambulance packages have the basic screen as well, but I could be wrong there.


That said, it's a great suggestion for trucks that will spend a long time at idle. Driver's would of course have to be educated, but to be able command a regen is very helpful. Any dealer can activate this feature through IDS.