I may have found a way....
I don't know if this has been done before, so please excuse me if this isn't an original idea.

First off, my rig is a '64 F3-- Dump body, 292....

I broke an axle shaft a few years back and figured I'd just swap out the entire rear axle to upgrade the shafts, brakes and wheels. I found a 4:10 Dana 70 from a 70's Winnebago (Dodge platform) and threw that in after a yoke swap. A few weeks ago, I found 17" tires and rims on Craigslist from an '02 Dodge dually to replace the scary 17.5" rims and tires that came from the Winnebago. Four out of six wheel issues solved.

Since then, I've been trying to find a way to swap over the front to match the rear, or at least upgrade the split 6 on 7.25" wheels to tubeless-types. I carry extreme amounts of weight in this truck, and I fear for my life every time I load it.





The front tires are so cracked and bald, I can't believe they haven't blown apart regardless of the rims. My worries have been compounded since converting the front brakes to discs from an E-350 van... best mod ever, but putting that much more strain on those horrid rims. (I'll start another thread on this conversion if anyone is interested.)


I have stooped as low as to looking for two more rims to weld the holes and re-drill the correct pattern. Then I stumbled onto something. I came across a CL posting for (5) 16" ford dually 10-lug wheels for $50. With a little research, I found that the ford 10 lug rims have the same 7.25" spread as ours. That means I should be able to leave two of the holes unmolested, and weld the other 8 shut, use the remaining 2 opposing holes to bolt the old and new rims together to transfer the holes perfectly. I'll feel a lot safer about having 2 factory holes than none at all.

Now I'm not sure about the center hole, but it doesn't really apply to me because I'm only planning to do this on the front where there isn't a centering ring on the hub.

I'm going to pick the wheels up as soon as I can coordinate a time with the owner. It's a 3 hour drive to go get them. I'll post back here with my progress and findings.

 

You don't have 17.5s, which are tubeless. You have 17s, that are two part widow makers.

I'd be concerned trying your 10 lug scenario because they are gonna be hub piloted, and it sounds like a cooter bobbed solution. I'd be more comfortable seeing you do something like Gary Sisson did to the front hubs on his 59 F-350. I'll email him and have him check in here, and link his thread describing what he did. Stu

 

The 17.5" tubeless wheels came on the rear axle from the Winnebago, and are the white wheels on the rear in the pics. I didn't like them because the replacement tires are a fortune, and 17.5" rims, like 16.5" rims, don't have a bead-holding lip built into the rim. I had a mishap in the woods where I had a slow leak in an outside tire and a full load, and the tire popped off the rim in a dramatic, blow-out fashion because there wasn't enough pressure to keep it on the rim. They have since been replaced with 17" Dodge wheels.

The fronts are the original 16" 2-piece rims that I am trying to replace.


I'd love to see other options. My biggest problem is my shoestring budget. I know I could do the right thing with a bigger wallet.

Is your concern a strength issue or a centering issue? My current front tires are at least 1/4" out of round, so I figure even if my end result is 1/16" off, I'll still be ahead of where I was. This truck rarely sees speeds over 45.

 

Yeah, my oops on the fronts. Should have remembered the DRWs were 16s. I emailed Gary and hope he drops by to show how he converted his fronts to 8 x 6.5" pattern. He did it himself without any real expense. You look to be resourceful like Gary, so would hope his technique might work for you. Stu

 

Gary emailed me back and wasn't sure where to find the old thread and pictures. So it set me to looking. The first one linked is the one with pictures. The second one has good description. Stu

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...-raytasch.html
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...y-59-f350.html

 

Thanks for helping out Stu! The adapters were from wheeladapters.com and they are 8 lug to 8 lug and meant to convert your front hubs to use a dished dually type wheel on the front after you convert your 3/4 or one ton to a dual wheel truck. They aren't cheap from the website, but I have since learned that Detroit used bolt on adapters, sometimes referred to as 'Toledo adapters' as factory equipment for various truck applications. A friend told me a guy came to his shop and unbolted a set off a truck he was hauling for scrap so I know they exist. Best of luck. In the Pacific Northwest we haul our logs lengthwise or in Navy talk 'fore and aft'....A buddy of mine went to Michigan and he told me they haul them crosswise there. Different regions, different markets and length requirements. And then down in the bayou they compete with the gators for their logs!

 

Thanks for your replies, guys. All great info!

Well, I went to pick up the Ford Super Duty 10-lug rims on Friday. It turned out the guy wanted $50 a piece, not $50 for all. Luckily I had enough cash on me to get 3 (for $110 after some wheeling and dealing). What would you expect from this ad?







I got them home and immediately got to work. After meticulously grinding the paint off of all the necessary surfaces, I welded 8 of the 10 holes shut inside and out.





I then ground them smooth.





I forgot to get a picture of this step, but I took my old 2-piece wheel and ground the face smooth enabling me to get a tight, face-to-face surface when bolting the wheels together. I used 2 fine thread 5/8" bolts down through the old wheel. The holes in the new wheel were about .090" bigger than the 5/8" holes in the old wheels, so in order to get the wheels perfectly centered on one another, I put a little bit of a countersink on the backside of the holes and used the tapered end of the lug nuts to center themselves in those holes. I ground the tip of a 5/8" drill bit nearly flat with a little of a brad point. I transferred the center point of the hole with this bit by making sure I revolved the spinning bit 360° around the inside of the hole. (50 hard years of abuse had left the holes a little less than round.) I found the center of each mark and smacked it with a center punch. I then drilled a 1/8" pilot hole, then used the drill press to carefully drill each hole to 11/16".

You can also see in this pic the location of the old holes from some of the residual blueing from when I touched up the inside welds. All the new holes fell on virgin steel.





I cleaned them up and painted them.





Saturday morning, after the paint was dry, I ran a countersink in the first two holes. I am running the tapered end of the lug nuts in those two holes (because I am certain those are centered), and the flat face of the other four lug nuts against the other four un-tapered holes. I needed to do just a hair of caliper grinding to get them to fit on my disc brake conversion, but nothing severe. Here's the end result.




I did the "block of wood against the fender" test, and noticed very little runout. Maybe 1/16". I can live with that!
I haven't had it out on the road yet; I'll make a dump run later this week and report back.

 

YES I would be most interested in knowing what parts you needed for your disc brake conversion. You used them from a E-350? Should be fine as long as they're not ABS. I see they clear your stock wheels by at least a half an inch and almost no mods to the stock axle. Did you use the master and power booster from the E350? (F series are likely the same) Please tell us more (think I'm buying a '61 F350 soon)

 

HERE is the link to the new thread concerning the disc brake conversion.

 

One thing I forgot to mention about this 10-lug to 6-lug swap....

I didn't measure it, but the center hole on the 10-lug wheels is about a 1/4" smaller diameter than the old wheels. Not an issue up front, but this would be an issue if doing this on the rear. They'ed need to be turned down to fit over the rear hubs.

I'll grab the calipers and get exact measurements next time I think of it.

 

The wheels look great! I would be interested to know how well they have held up. I would be interested in doing something like this. How do they ride on the road? Thanks for the post!

 

They are holding up great! They've hauled countless tons of wood and water since I've put them on with zero issues. I've been hauling 550 gallons of water 8 miles almost every day for the last two months to irrigate. I've put more miles on this truck this summer than my car.

I can see the tread of the drivers side tire through a rust hole in the floor, and it runs straight and true. Zero wobble or out-of-round.

I have the third rim here that I just haven't found the time (or motivation) to do this to for a spare, but I will eventually.

Best of luck if you try it!

 

Thanks for the update! I figure I am a few months away from trying, but anything will be better than the search for those elusive 6 lug rims!

 

Please forgive me introducing a contrarian viewpoint here. The wheels as original, and as modified, have hub piloted lug holes. The trucks hubs are stud piloted. As modified there is no centering being done by the hubs. The lug nuts appear to be installed up side down, so the studs are taking all the load. With the loads being carried you're putting a lot of strain on the studs, and would watch for torque loss, wallowed out holes, and stress cracks on the wheels' faces. Especially after having rearranged the metal molecules by welding up the holes. Just my 2 cents. Stu

 

Contrarian viewpoints are welcome! Our options are limited with these old tucks; I know it isn't a perfect solution, but it is better than using the 30(?)-year-old bald tube tires on badly-rusted 2-piece rims.

The two holes in the new rims that were left unmolested were countersunk to accept the lug nuts in standard fashion. They center the wheel. The other four lug nuts were reversed to give premium surface pressure. In theory, as long as the lugs are kept tight, the studs should never feel any radial forces, only axial forces. The friction between the hub and the wheel created by the extreme pressure of the lug nuts is what keeps the wheel from moving and putting shear stress on the studs under a load. If the wheel is shifting on the hub enough to put shear loads on the studs, something came loose.

That is not to say I haven't kept a close eye on these, but so far, so good. There has been zero movement.

BTW, these are my personal theories, not official scientific theories.