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1973 - 1979 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Dentsides Ford Truck

Ford truck information and then some....

 
  #31  
Old 09-27-2014, 02:07 AM
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So you want a make a 2wd into a 4wd....

There is nothing nuts and bolts about a 4wd conversion, there is not a thing that is bolt on or swappable. The engine cross members are entirely different, and this means that if an un molested truck is what you are after, it will be impossible to create one with a 2wd platform.
The 2wd will have to be lifted quite a way to clear the front diff. 2wd trucks are coil sprung and most F250 4wd's are leaf sprung. None of the suspension items are even close to the same, so you will be fabricating or modifying some original 4wd stuff to work.
Steering systems are entirely different as well, so you will be upgrading that too.
My last conversion with leafs ran me several thousand dollars, and that was with the work that I performed for free. The difference in sale values between a 4wd and 2wd are minimal, and the 4wd conversion is hardly justifiable.
Well the frames are similar, with a few exceptions. The frame horns are slightly different, and the frame widths aft of the cab are different from 73 to 77 trucks. The frame rise is also slightly different, but this is not a show stopper and does not make much difference one the fabrication begins.
Now the important question is whether or not you will be using a coils springs or a leaf spring. It is possible to install a 78/9 radius arm and suspension. Not a big deal really, and with a standard cab this is reasonable. Not quite as easy with a super cab and or crew cab.
The 2wd frames are not cut for the shackle pivot, and they do not have the provisions for a spring hanger, but again, this is not a deal breaker. Installing a pivot is just a tedious process, accuracy is key.
Ok, so next is the transfer case. You have two choices, install a married case, and this requires the proper transmission. Might find some difficulty making or modifying an output shaft to accommodate the early C6 and a married transfer case. So then the next option is to find a divorced transfer case, and install this. You will have to make up a cross member, but then you will have to get creative with the shifter linkage. See the 4wd trans will have an adapter or tailshaft with a pivot for a typical 205 shifter. Fabrication is the only limiting factor here.
Next and final factor will be the speedo. See your speedo works from the trans, so that being the case, you will have to get a speed reference from the t-case. If you do not, the speedo will read twice as fast when you put the case in low range. But you will be in 4 low so who cares how fast you are going.

As mentioned the steering box will have to be relocated, and the truck will require some lift. That engine crossmember has limited clearance so you will be looking at some lift to even clear it. The other option would be to remove it and replace it with a tubular unit.
 
  #32  
Old 09-27-2014, 02:08 AM
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TRUCK BUILDING INFORMATION.

I suggest that you set a goal and stick to it, I mean that you should create a reasonable goal, and do what you can to achieve it. Not too many fellas are in the 700 hp club, and when I hear this I truly expect 500 real hp's, but let’s talk about that.

500 hp is huge compared to the whopping 120 something you are making now. I’m not ripping on the 351M, errrr, ok, maybe a little. But regardless, this thing made around 150 to 170 Hp's when it was new. A tired old "M" might make the same 30 years later. Add a big honking cam that makes power far higher than the engine is actually capable of reaching, or heads that can’t flow enough air to maximize that aftermarket carb, and you might actually make less than the factory spec. Consider that the engine is tired so it might be making 100 hp, and my original estimate was not accurate. Being an optimist, I as shooting for a high number.

You can make 1 HP per cubic inch, or at least make slightly less. Either way, you will have a mill that is still over three times the power house that the 351M ever was. Start with the 460 and never look back. Each time you upgrade you can’t count on the fact that you are one step closer to your goal, the reasonable one.

Guess this all boils down to priority. Is it a priority to complete what you have? I mean, it runs right? You decided that the priority was to build enough of a lift to clear tires large enough that your stock engine just won’t be able to turn? Sounds kind of strange when it is put like that right?

How about building a bullet proof drivetrain, that can handle anything that you throw at it, and use a reasonable tire? 37's can be a ton of fun in a stock truck with some gears and a locker. Ever drive a 1 ton equipped truck with 1 ton gear, 35 spline axles or even chromo, locker, steep gears and smaller tires like 37's? It’s a blast! Hit it with some power and one may not ever change from this.
Once the drivetrain is bullet proof, and you have installed all of the gear that will make it suitable for upgrades, now comes the bullet.
See since your drivetrain is bullet proof, you won’t ever worry about breaking it, and all of the money you save will go towards the next goal. No distractions, like broken axles or downtime. What’s next? The engine and trans. Meanwhile you are still wheeling the thing, and you are tearing all sorts of stuff up, but not the drivetrain.
So you have some fun wheeling the truck, and you are building a nice engine for it. Upgrades do not have to come right away, just a nice running 460 that will smash that little 351M. All of this is while you are still pimpin 37's.

So a little time goes by, and you have a nice bullet for the gun. A fresh 460 with early iron heads, flat tops, timing set, and a nice reasonable cam. Small carb, but that’s all you need right now. Its reliable, starts every time, runs like a champ and making over 350 Hp's easy.
That’s about a 300% increase over the old engine. Thought you were tearing it up before, now you are just getting crazy.
Time for tires. Since you already have nice 1 ton gear, and a bullet proof set of axles, you have the gears to turn a larger tire, you now set a goal for some lift and some tires that put you in a different category.
Lift it and make some mods, but the axles are still working great, engine is as nice as can be, and you are still having a blast.
This truck has seen minimal downtime, and you have been rolling it around all over the place.
What do we upgrade next? Who knows, because we’ve built a decent drivetrain, and it runs well, but we need some more puppy power, so we head to the speed shop, and up the cam, port some heads, step up the carb and maybe intake. You have already found a used intake on Craigslist, and got it for a song, and look at that, the National Dragster has a guy selling a Demon carb that looks like it has been unmolested, and it is cheap.

Kind of see where I am going here?

None of us have the pockets to build a fire breather on the first go around, and none of us have hit it out of the park on the first swing, but I am sure that every one of us would have done things a little bit differently, and some wish that we had.

Everyone can build a truck in any order they wish, but it seems to me that most build them backwards.
They lift it, put some big honking meats under it then struggle with broken parts, and have to limp a sorry engine around to try to turn the things. Backwards I say.

Gimme a nice 460, and some 1 tons that won’t break, I’ll throw in a Detroit out back, and Ill wheel it with white wall tires. Probably do as well or better than so many of those other trucks that I see on the trail. Wimpy little engine, no traction devices, we can see this because it is stuck on wet grass. Busted axle or u-joints, Oh….but it has some big ol meats and it looks nice, Can’t get out of its own way, but it looks nice.

Cracks me up............

For the reader of this I’m just throwing out some examples and some ideas. Its your rig, and in all honesty, I applaud your efforts. You do have the desire and ability. Keep that up. Don’t lose that. Only one way to gain experience my friend. Only one way.
 
  #33  
Old 09-27-2014, 02:08 AM
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Where has it been sitting for 6 years with oil in a pan? If inside, I’d leave that oil in. Oil don't "just go stale", it should last as long sitting in an oil pan of a closed up engine as it does in a can.

I would at least disable the ignition and pull the plugs, and spin her over some with the starter avoiding long spells, just like 5 secs at a time. Do not just pull plugs and leave wires hanging, either ground the spark plug end or the wires or better yet, unplug the ignition module itself. No plugs will let her spin faster and watch the mechanical oil gage.

I’d simply start with a full radiator with the proper thermostat in place for a 351M/400 if that's what it is and cap off and keep an eye on it as she warms. No different than when you change coolant every other year or three ... or 5 as the case may be.

Reasonably fresh fuel in the tank, watch the carb top for signs of a stuck float though if setting a long time. By the time you spin the motor over without plugs priming the oil pump the carb float bowl will be full .... but there won't be any intake vacuum with plugs out. Just watch the top of the carb vent tube. If gas comes out, gonna have to "unstick" a float or inlet needle.

C-6 and it's new and dry, I'm putting at least 8 qts in to start ... before I even prime my engine's oil system with the no plugs routine above ... unless it causes it to come out the dip stick tube which I doubt (total capacity for my C-6 in a '77 F-150 4X4 with 351m/400 is 27 pints or 13.5 quarts). That'll help raise levels in the trans and make sure nothing runs drier than necessary.

Then after the priming session, check engine oil level, look for oil filter gasket leak, check and add some trans fluid so it shows on the stick again.

Then reinstall plugs, hook up wires and ignition module and if gas ain't sprayed out the carb vents yet ....start her up with a fast idle and as she run and warms up, while watching temp and radiator level and oil pressure and belts and carb vents and watching for leaks and checking oil filter gasket .... I’d be checking and adding more trans fluid as needed running her through the gears after 10 quarts.
As you try to make is a daily driver watch for a lot of seals to start leaking and after a little bit of driving ck the valve cover and oil pan hardware torque. Do not over torque the valve covers and bend the lip.
 
  #34  
Old 09-27-2014, 03:49 AM
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ranger429 hitting it out of the ball park, with all this info.

Here are the differences between these models. I also have found out that for the 78/79 Bronco it was available as a Custom or Ranger XLT model only. They did not offer the Ranger package only on the Bronco.

Custom:
Pretty much your stripped down version although it could have been ordered with just about any individual option you wanted to put on it. A Custom model included: low back bucket seats, vinyl floor mat for the front only, 25 gallon gas tank, manual steering, 4 speed trans with the 351 motor and the 205 case.
Exterior features were:
hub caps, black painted bumpers and the stainless mirrors.
Ranger:
Not offered on the Bronco, only available in the F-series lineup. Those upgrades were:
The bench seat had a chain mail vinyl seat upholstery, it also included a color matching vinyl floormat, sunvisors, seat back covers in the regular cab model and white headliner with chrome trim.
Ranger XLT:
The front seat used a combination of cloth and vinyl, insulated woodgrain door panels, carpeted flooring, woodgrain around instrument cluster, passenger dash and the glove box, woodtone on the steering wheel horn button, chrome trim around taillights and halogen headlights. The XLT also got the body side trim.
Exterior:
Chrome bumpers, chrome molding around the windshield and side windows in the top, chrome molding around the drip rail by door, chrome wheel well lip molding, rear T-gate chrome pieces, and the body side trim.
Lariat:
Not offered on the Bronco, only available in the F-series lineup. Those upgrades were:
Full cloth seat trimmed in super soft vinyl, door trim panels that included padded inserts, map pockets on the lower door, button quilted padded headliner and extra insulation.
Options available:
These are the only options that I have prices on. Below are some additional options.
400 engine............................................ .....................$165.00
included 12 inch diameter clutch and 53 amp/hr battery
Traction lock front axle.............................................. ...$175.00
Traction lock rear axle.............................................. ....$175.00
Automatic trans............................................. .............$197.00
came with oil cooler and 53 amp/hr battery
Power steering.......................................... ..................$211.00
Heavy duty suspension........................................ .........$104.50
Forged aluminum wheels............................................ ... $218.30
Forged aluminum polished wheels....................................$304.30
When combined with the free wheeling package................$129.10
White painted styled steel wheels...................................$175.20
when combined with the free wheeling package.................$43.20
Rear seat.............................................. .....................$287.20
Quad front shocks............................................ ............$74.00
Swing away tire carrier Ranger XLT..................................$60.60
Swing away tire carrier Custom.......................................$81.6 0
Skid plates............................................ ......................$123.10
Rear stabilzer bar............................................... ...........$25.00
Tilt steering.......................................... ........................$72.00
Free Wheeling pacakge on a Custom................................$558.45
Free Wheeling Package XLT...........................................$385 .05
Ranger XLT package........................................... ...........$668.90

Additional options:
Appearance:
Chrome bumpers
Wheel well molding
Body side trim
GT bar with foam padding
Grilles. There were 3 different options for the front grille. Black, Silver or Argent with chrome accent. I have seen Black on an XLT and the Argent with chrome on an XLT. I am not sure how they decided what grille to put on what truck.
Audio:
AM radio
AM/FM mono radio (1 speaker in dash)
AM/FM stereo (speakers in door panels)
AM/digital clock radio
40 channel CB radio with antenna. This was available on all radio options. A simple way to tell if it had a CB originally if all wiring is gone look for an ash tray on the driver side cargo panel. If there is no ash tray it originally had a CB.
Comfort/convenience:
A/C
Comfort vent heater ( I think this was also the HI-LO option)
Insulation package
Rear floor mat (Custom only)
Front captain chairs (available in 79 only)
Front bench seat
Rear seat
Center console ( only available with buckets)
Convenience group ( intermittent wipers, map paockets and 12 inch day/night mirror)
Lighted visor mirror passenger side only
Privacy glass for top
sliding windows for top
tinted glass all
Western mirror, low mount(normal folding style mirror)
Recreation mirrors (towing mirrors)
GT sport steering wheel with simulated leather wrap ( not available with cruise)
Simulated leather wrapped steering wheel

Cruise control
Light group (ash tray, glovebox, underhood, instrument panel courtesy lights and dome light with map lights)
Swing away spare tire carrier ( stock when ordered with (5) 10x15 tires) with vinly tire cover
Performance:
Quad shocks (gas filled)
Handling package (rear sway bar, quad shocks up front and dual gas filled rear shocks)
Automatic trans
600 watt engine heater
Heavy duty suspension (HD front springs, HD rear springs and front sway bar)
Rear sway bar
Gauges (oil and amp)
32 gallon gas tank with skid plate
Skid plates for 25 gallon tank and T-case
Trailer towing package
Protection:
Tow hooks (front)
Locking hood release
Exterior protection group. Consists of door edge guards, front bumper guards and front bumper rubber strip.
Security lock group. Consisted of locking gas cap, locking hood release, spare tire lock and locking glove box.
Free Wheelin:
Standard features were:
Black bumpers front and rear, Dual black low mount western style mirrors, (5) 15x6 painted steel wheels in either white or chrome yellow with L78x15 raised white letter tires and of course the custom chromatic tape stripe found on the black Bronco. There were also 2 other stripe color combinations, Orange/Tan/Creme or Blue/White/Green.
Trailer Special:
Now according to my book the 1st year for the Trailer Special was 79. I have seen a few members here that have 78 Trailer Special's. There were 2 categories for the Trailer Special.
Light duty trailer towing package:
Good for towing up to 2,000lbs.
This package included a heavy duty radiator, external oil cooler, seven lead trailer harness, heavy duty turn signal flasher and the Trailer Special emblem on the T-gate.
Heavy duty trailer towing package:
Good for towing up to 6,000lbs.
This package included a heavy duty alternator,heavy duty battery, HD rear shocks, bigger radiator, rear sway bar, swing out recreational mirrors, amp meter, oil pressure gauge, HD front springs, external oil cooler and the Trailer Special emblem on the T-gate.
Transfer Cases
The T-case on an NP 203 (full time case) will have a shift pattern like this.
4 low lock
N
4 high lock

The NP 205 (part time case) will have this shift pattern

4 low
N
2 high
4 high
 
  #35  
Old 09-27-2014, 03:52 AM
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And here are a few more good ideas from fellow members.

Cab pull with a eng hoist.
 
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  #36  
Old 09-27-2014, 03:54 AM
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Bed removal and then some.
 
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Old 09-27-2014, 04:08 AM
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Door panel ideas....
 
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  #38  
Old 09-27-2014, 04:23 AM
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The steps, elec choke power, passenger side handle (put a bigger 2"x2" piece of metal to reinforce the holes where the mount hdwr is ). After a 6" lift, this is the bracket to drop your e brake cables. Nice job KIKKUP.
 
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  #39  
Old 09-27-2014, 06:52 AM
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Holy Mackerel, you're not bored are you?

My two favorite tutorials right here.

How to swap from a '78-'79 grill to an early style:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...rill-swap.html

How to bleed the notoriously difficult '78-'79 1/2 ton 4X4 power steering box so you have power steering again:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...ering-fix.html
 
  #40  
Old 09-27-2014, 06:57 AM
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Thanks for those good ones, remember this one?

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...body-lift.html

Awesome job you did on that one.
 
  #41  
Old 09-27-2014, 07:49 AM
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Rich, thanks for taking the time to do this. I know it's taking a lot of work and time. I think all of the members can benefit from this and appreciate it.
If I can help let me know .

EDIT: I'm finally out of rep hell, reps sent.
 
  #42  
Old 09-27-2014, 08:12 AM
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No thanks due to me, its the guys like you that post the diagrams and all the other FTE members with the good ideas. I just put it in one Ford truck bed and managed to get the tail gate closed. lol

I wish I had the computer skills to match it all up, but it is was chore to just keep it all straight while posting it.

Shortly I will see how I get along with that new CD in my mail box, thanks again.
 
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Old 09-27-2014, 08:33 AM
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thanks rich,alot of goood stufff
 
  #44  
Old 09-27-2014, 10:15 AM
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great job Rich this will be helpful to all
 
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Old 09-27-2014, 08:58 PM
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wow, just wow. that is alot of great info that should be stickied immediately. thank you for doing such a great job breaking things down for us. this will be a go to spot to send people new and old.
 

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