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My D60 swap into '96 CCSB PSD

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  #91  
Old 04-29-2015, 12:07 PM
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All 4 of these Bilstein shocks have 255/70 valving. I don't know what the units are, but the first number is rebound, the second is compression.

The Bilstein part number for the front is:
33-185552
with expanded/compressed dimensions of
25.93"/15.91"

My front ride height with U code springs and 2.25" RSK is 21-1/2" shock length. There is about 5" of space between the spring and the bump stop, or an effective minimum shock length of 16". The maximum axle droop with no shocks attached is 25-1/2". The front Bilstein shock length as about perfect.


The Bilstein part number for the rear is:
33-185569
with expanded/compressed dimensions of
29.7"/17.91"

The rear ride height shock length is 23-3/8" with B code leafs and 4" F350 4x4 blocks. I do also have an overload leaf but this does not change these dimensions.

There is about 5" between the ear on the blocks and the bump stop. Making the effective minimum shock length about 18-3/8". Full axle droop without shocks attached is 26-3/4".

If my rear springs had 3" more downward travel the longer shocks would be required. But as it is, I have a shock that has 3" of travel that I'll never use. Also, the rubber boot looked very compressed.


Without sway bars, front or rear, the truck is like driving a waterbed. Soft and cushy, but wobbles left and right and the rear kicks your head after a bump, as the springs rebound back.


I now have a 1-1/8" diameter rear and a 1-1/8" diameter front sway bar installed. These have stopped the left-to-right bobble head feel. Finding the correct length front end links is still a mystery for me. Too short and they pull the sway bar into the leafs during a jump. (Exaggerated statement for visual effect.) Too long and they hang way down, exposed to damage, and put goofy stresses on the sway bar. The links I now have for the front have enough metal to them that I plan on threading them, sort of adjustable links. I'll post details when I tackle this project.


In my quest for stiffer valving Bilstein said the longest shock they have in the range of the original two part numbers was one with the front shock dimensions.

Based on my calculations the front shock dimensions will also work just fine on my rear.

I just installed a pair of:
Bilstein part number for FRONT: 33-230344
25.93"/15.91" dimension
360/80 valving

Yes, the axle needed to be raised about 1/2" from full axle droop to make the shock bolts fit.

My experience is that shocks (or struts) limit the maximum travel on most of the vehicles I have worked on. Do stiffer rear code springs droop more? I don't know, but this should be determined before using the shorter front shocks.


Initial drive impressions are very favorable. The 'kick to the head' feeling is almost gone. I suspect when the front shocks are changed this will be virtually eliminated.


I later ordered a set of shocks for the rear, with the same stiffer valving. These rears came with solid hiem joint style inserts on both ends. The upper rear shock mount on my truck is sized so that the sleeve normally in a rubber shock eye needs to be removed. I pressed the solid insert out and pressed in a poly insert. I'll post part numbers later as I am trying two different styles.


So now my shock set up is...

Front shocks, Bilstien part number: 33-230344
15.91"/25.93" compressed/extended lengths
360/80 compression/expansion valving


Rear shocks, Bilstien part number: AK7112SB-06
7100 series shocks, rebuildable, valving changeable with disassembly, external reservoir
16.10"/27.68" compressed/extended lengths
360/80 compression/expansion valving


The added expansion dampening of the shocks have eliminated the bucking or kick-to-the-head after all bumps, small or large. This is a good thing.

The added compression has stopped the caddy mushiness. With the lessor dampened shocks, at a stop, I could do the brake, unbrake, brake, unbrake dance and the front end would bob up and down. But the stiffer compression valving has brought some ride stiffness over the the small bumps and ripples.

Ideally, I think shocks with the stiffer expansion but the compression somewhere between the two would be ideal. I'll likely put the softer shocks back on the front and keep the stiffer ones for when I have a camper or similar load.
 
  #92  
Old 05-19-2015, 03:51 PM
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Added for my future reference…

Bilstein steering stabilizer 33-170794, 23.64" extended, 14/72" compressed, has 128/126 valving.

Was told that this is really 1280/126 newtons of force.
 
  #93  
Old 06-17-2015, 07:31 AM
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My dual stabilizer kit from PMF arrived with the optional bilstein 5100 series shocks.

With my front sway bar installed I could not complete the installation.

Not PMF's fault though. If you have seen a front D60 with a sway bar, you will understand how tight everything is. The sway bar rides between the axle and the track bar. And as the axle raises and lowers the sway bar pivots and changes its clearances.

I also have a PMF drop track bar bracket and it is much beefier than the stock bracket so it requires the end links of the sway bar to be longer to pivot it enough to provide clearance.

The forward facing center piece of the PMF stabilizer uses a back bracket to clam shell the bracket to the axle tube rather than using U bolts. Looks great installed, but the back bracket interfered with the sway bar due to my sway bar being pivoted by the extremely long sway bar end links.

I have not measured to see if using U bolts instead of a back bracket would provide enough clearance but I truly suspect it would not.

Even if U bolts would provide more clearance than the back bracket design, I am not confident that the ideal sway bar end link length could be found that accommodated both a drop track bar bracket and a U-bolted stabilizer.

I removed my front sway bar to get the steering stabilizer mounted.

Most of the installation is easy to figure out. Two tips; the two brackets that get u-bolted to the drag link are oriented so the shock mount holes are offset towards the outside of the truck and with the wheels aimed straight the shock mounting holes are to be set 19-1/4" center-to-center apart. This takes a little fiddling and tapping wit a rubber mallet while the u-bolts snugged but still allowing movement. Also, a 4' level helps get the two outside tabs and the center bracket all in alignment.

Bonus tip: With the wheels turned all of the way to one side I could slide the boot farther onto the shock body to about an inch of the blue bilstein label without it being pulled too tight. I did the same to the boot that was compressed and the boot didn't look so contorted. The tie wrap is tight and makes this about the hardest task of the whole install. Cutting it and replacing it after moving the boot may make sense. Getting any twist our of the boot helps too, easiest done at the eye end rather than on the body.
 
  #94  
Old 06-17-2015, 11:00 AM
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The stabilizer did not affect the shacking at about 65mph. It did smoothen some of the slower speed wiggles as did removing the sway bar.

It's about time for the tires to be rotated and balanced, but I don't expect improvement.
 
  #95  
Old 06-21-2015, 03:12 PM
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Make sure and remove the rear stabilizer too if you are not going to run a front one.

Or, you can use the F250 one. Only need to fab up the mounts to the axle and that's it.

 
  #96  
Old 06-23-2015, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by eakermeld
Make sure and remove the rear stabilizer too if you are not going to run a front one.
Why? I installed a rear before the front one became available. And am now only using the rear.

Thanks for the pic of the F250 front stabilizer…that my be my long term solution.

I haven't solved the shaking thing, but I can make the frame wiggle if I get the right frequency of foot motion on the front hitch. My brother was watching it and says the cab and bed look to be moving up and down in opposite directions.
 
  #97  
Old 06-23-2015, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by LeoJr
Why? I installed a rear before the front one became available. And am now only using the rear.
Some trucks, not all, will drive totally squirrely with only the rear sway bars on. They have a tendency to dive in a turn and the back wants to come around the front. Several others here have had those experiences, including myself.

You're welcome on the pic. Glad to help.
 
  #98  
Old 06-24-2015, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by eakermeld
Some trucks, not all, will drive totally squirrely with only the rear sway bars on. They have a tendency to dive in a turn and the back wants to come around the front. Several others here have had those experiences, including myself.

You're welcome on the pic. Glad to help.
Makes sense. Thanks!
 
  #99  
Old 07-27-2015, 04:44 PM
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I removed the steering stabilizer (and sold it) is it did nothing to address my shaking issue.

Now that have room for the front stabilizer again, I need to pick up a few dies and thread the shaft of my intentionally long front stabilizer end links so I can adjust them to my desired length.

Afterward I'll remove the rear stabilizer and keep it in case I ever decide to hitch a 5th wheel or bumper pull camper to it.
 
  #100  
Old 07-27-2015, 04:58 PM
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Replaced the U joints and centering yoke on the donor F350 axle. Most of the three U joints weren't in too bad of shape. But the needle bearings in the centering yoke were desert dry and rusty, they likely were never serviced.

I had the F250 drive shaft in place in case I needed it, but I never exceeded 30mph as it howled and vibrated so bad. With the F350 shaft in place I cannot tell that it is n 4x4 even on highway speeds. (Hubs unlocked for testing.)

I used greasable U joints and also drilled hole and installed a flush zerk in the centering yoke casting.

The rear most U joint in the double cardon joint is at an angle that won't allow a grease gun coupler to reach it. Four 8mm bolts and the it is unbolted from the yoke. The skid plate needs to be dropped for access anyway so that doesn't count.

Later I picked up a needle fitting (not the hypodermic kind) and will try it next time I need to grease everything.
 
  #101  
Old 09-05-2015, 12:05 PM
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I didn't say it earlier but to install the F350 driveshaft I had to change out the transfer case yoke. I had bought the yoke a year or so ago from ebay for about $100 so I breathed a small sigh of relief when it fit like it was supposed to.

Driving with the rear sway bar only is a strange sensation for the driver, the passenger can't really tell. The front wheels are moving up/down with the road but the rocking left and right isn't happening until the rear tires hit the bumps. It's a timing and sensory thing that is hard to describe.

I didn't have the experience eakermeld shared but I intentionally avoided those situations. Realizing there may be a situation that I couldn't avoid it, I removed the rear sway bar.

My plan to thread the uber long sway bar end links and make them adjustable was interrupted by me scoring a wire feed welder. The too short links are 4" shorter than the unnecessarily long ones. So I made the short ones longer by 2".

I cut 1/2"x1/2"x1/8" angle to 6" lengths. Cut the end links about in half. Like splints, put an angle on two sides of the link in a vise. This gives 2" of weld at both ends and 2" gap.

I haven't cycled the suspension over our favorite 'jump' (just a perfectly sized crossroad that is fun at 45mph) yet so I don't know if the 2" is the final length.


 
  #102  
Old 10-04-2015, 02:51 PM
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I started a thread elsewhere with videos of the truck being shaken by a foot pressing on the front receiver hitch in the RSK. The frame arches up and down, the gap at the truck bed and cab open and closes.

I haven't found anyone else that can make the movements necessary so I can watch the frame move myself, so I have to use their feedback.

The frame is flexible, but it has a natural frequency that gets excited by whatever is happening at about 65 mph. It is not %100 consistent and as others have said, I should keep a log book and note all the conditions when it does, and doesn't happen. Outdoor temperature, concrete versus asphalt, etc.

The consistent observation I get is that the front of the frame seems to be see-sawing over the front axle.

A thought... Part of the RSK benefit is to let an arched leaf spring grow in length as it is compressed, towards the rear, so that the axle moves rearward as it move upward. My soft SD U code leafs are near flat at ride height. Which means that as the axle is compressed upwards, it is also being pulled forward.
 
  #103  
Old 02-20-2016, 10:58 AM
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In stock configuration, the rear of the leaf was held fixed at a point behind the axle, closer to mid length of the frame.

Now the front of the leaf is fixed at the front end of the frame.

The RSK puts the front axle being anchored to a point about 5" off the bottom surface of the frame.

While the shock and weight of the truck control the vertical movement of the wheels, the fixed end of the leaf spring controls the horizontal movement of the wheels.

With the fixed point now at the front, and with its additional leverage, horizontal wheel forces are translated into the frame in a manner that bows the middle of the frame up and down. This is the same bowing I can cause with my foot on the front reciever hitch.

This also explains why the big heavy military tires cause more bowing than the smaller stockish size tires. Even though both were very well balanced, the heavier tires caused much more frame bowing about the same 65 mph speed, because their heavier weight is putting more force into the frame.

I'll do some measuring but I think I can move the shackle from the rear to the front for some test drives. My caster will be way our of wack but I can put in my adjustable caster/camber sleeves and get about 3 degrees of camber back.
 
  #104  
Old 09-08-2016, 07:38 AM
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Knowing my Torque Converter is a known weak link, I have been babying the trans until I could get a new TC into the budget and schedule.

Driving home the other day I noticed the TC would slip a little. I did not notice it slipping the last time I pulled my camper as I am rather attentive to the tach and watch for the TC to lock.

After some polling of various sources and talking to a few shops I decided a shop and took it to them. While the transfer case and auto trans were removed I had them replace the up pipe donuts and install the FloPro full length exhaust.

The Fo Pro install was far more difficult than it should have been.

When I type the word "I" below it usually means that I made the decisions and provided the directions and the shop guy did the wrenching and welding. His good welding and wrench turning skills and my creative problem solving made for a good team.

The provided front hanger was useless and I had to fab one using the old catalytic converter hangers, the middle one on the muffler was bent (from shipping, not a FloPro issue) and we bent it back but doesn't really look right, and the rear hanger was nowhere close to working without some creativity.

I chose FloPro for their use of the band clamps versus U bolt clamps. When the kit arrived I found that one of the smaller band clamps was missing and a larger one was provided. The larger band clamp would not tighten sufficiently at the transition flange from 3" to 4" pipe and FloPro shipped one out at no cost.

The turbo flange was noticeably smaller though the pipe was the correct diameter. I did not trust it and cut it off and had the factory flange welded on. I did call FloPro tech support and they said the flange would be a little smaller. I have no reason why they would have taken such a short cut. I sent them a photo of theirs and the stock flange but have not heard back.

I will call them and share my experiences and I do not expect anything to come out of the conversation.
 
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