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It lives!!! ..But smokes. (IP Timing & Battery)

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Old 08-23-2013, 06:41 PM
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It lives!!! ..But smokes. (IP Timing & Battery)

I got my truck started and running, took 'er around the block and I throughly enjoy it. This post is an update for any interested, a few questions, and my learnings, separated into two parts beginning with the update and learnings: I got the DB2-4812 Stanadyne injection pump from Pensacola and all eight new injectors from NAPA Auto Parts (I've no idea the "code"). I also purchased new glowplugs and controller from AccurateDiesel.com

Word to the wise, and I know it has been talked about so many times before, DO NOT REMOVE THE INJECTION PUMP GEAR HOUSING WHEN CHANGING THE INJECTOR PUMP. I did however manage to get everything time fairly easily, buy using this method "Talk about Timing!!" very informative, easy to understand, and most importantly, no dental mirrors. It took three days to bleed the fuel system, what with killing the batteries an all. I cranked on the motor no more than 20 seconds at a time, with a cool down period of 20 seconds -1 minute (My buddy was pretty impatient, but those short cool down periods didn't seem to screw anything up. I did smell something burning once or twice and that led to a 10 minute cool down). Installing the injector pump was a plug and play. One thing that helped the bleed process (that I discovered on the last day) was full throttle, and jumping the cold idle solenoid on the injector pump.That is done by taking an alligator clamp and running it from the positive terminal on the battery to the metal tab on the injector pump, closest to the firewall. You should hear a "thuck!" when you hook it up.

Once the truck was fired up I let it run for about 15 minutes, letting everything feel freedom again. Turned it off, and tried again a day later, no block heater, and it fired right up. I was pleased

Questions

1) My battery light is always on in the truck, even when I put the batteries on charge. The alternator belt is tight, so I know it's spinning fast enough. Truthfully I'm not sure if it's charging the batteries or not. I had the alternator checked in June, and it came out good. I checked to see if any fuses were blown, but I saw none on the Fuse Idenification Chart that mentioned the alternator. The factory voltage gauge reads dead center when no accesories are on at idle, same thing at 2000 rpm. The voltage drops to a hair above 8 when radio, vent, and lights are on (but I assume that's normal). No cables or wires seem to be corroded, and 3 battery cables are brand new. On my alternator I have two posts, and one plug. I tried to hook up a terminal to a post, it sparked pretty bad, tried the other, and nothing, so I know that's hooked up right. I also have the plug hooked up too (tried pushing it in thinking maybe it's scooting out, but no change). Batteries are both brand new, just different CCA, one reading 875, and the other at 675. Any ideas?

2) My truck will start, but it will continuously puff white smoke no matter the rpm. Now, it isn't "My head gasket is bad" white, but its a clear white/grey unburned fuel (sometimes a touch of blue). It doesn't smell like coolant or anything of that nature, and yes it burns my eyes. I read that bumping the injector pump with the motor off towards the passenger side will advance it, but I couldn't turn the damn thing. And if I did it had to been micrometers. Not sure if it's in my head but after *maybe* turning it towards the advance side I think the white smoke may have gotten worse. I'm new to diesels so I don't know if it's idling rough, or if it sounds like its knocking (if it was a gasser motor I might say yes to both).
Upon initial start up it looks like the tachometer doesn't move except the occasional bump. Once it has been running for two minutes or so it goes up above 500rpm, but not above 650. "Cold starting" at 75 degrees yields no more than three cranking seconds. A slight rev/tap of the motor makes it cough and sputter, and a quick flooring makes it sputter too. Full throttle it'll puff grey/blackish. How should I rotate the pump? Do I need a special tool? Does it sound like I need to advance or retard the static timing? What does this sound like?
 
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:48 PM
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Well, congrats on getting it back together and running!

Now, on electronics you can't just hook up stuff randomly and figure if it doesn't spark it's hooked up correctly. You need to look at another truck, get some schematics, and/or trace wires. You may not be charging due to your charging system not being hooked up correctly, not completely, or you could have shorted out the voltage regulator when you started arc-welding with the alternator harness.

Engine off hook up a volt meter across one of your batteries. Should read around 12.5 volts. If under 12 you need to charge the batteries.

Start the truck. In a perfect world you'd be seeing 14 volts with all accessories off and engine idling. My POS has to be up around 1000 RPM to hit the 14 volts, but this is still sufficient to keep the batteries up.

If you are still seeing around 12 Volts, even at high RPM you are not charging.

FWIW I got one of these from Wal Mart a long time ago, I leave it plugged in all the time:

Equus Innova 3721 Battery Charging System Monitor - Walmart.com

Again, congrats!

I'll leave the timing/smoking to the guys that have dealt with them...
 
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Chevy_Eater
you could have shorted out the voltage regulator when you started arc-welding with the alternator harness.
Haha, definitely made me laugh there. Is there any way that I could have shorted something in the alternator by doing that?

In regards to the voltmeter test I'll have to do that tomorrow.

Lastly, can anyone post some pictures of their alternator set ups, diagrams, etc, or lead me to some database that might have this? I'm looking it up now, but I can't really make sense of these diagrams.
 
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Old 08-23-2013, 09:53 PM
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It's completely possible, the regulators tend to be more sensitive though.

I'll try to get some pics of mine tomorrow, it's almost dark out now.
 
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Old 08-23-2013, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Chevy_Eater
It's completely possible, the regulators tend to be more sensitive though.

I'll try to get some pics of mine tomorrow, it's almost dark out now.
Much appreciated, you've always been a huge help

It isn't anything to take it off and have it bench tested again, so I'll do that. Man I hope I don't have to shell out another 100$ -shudder-

Where exactly is the regulator located and what does it look like? Is it costly?
 
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Old 08-23-2013, 11:33 PM
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Its mounted on the passenger side fenderwell a little 3"x3" box with a flat plug, Its about 20.00 bucks or so.

To advance the timing a little you need to loosen up all the lines then turn, Your binding on the lines and don't want to chance breaking any of them.
 
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Old 08-24-2013, 07:51 AM
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^^^ They're pretty cheap, I just checked RockAuto and they have them as low as $5.

Here's a pic of the regulator and its location:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post13294940
 
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Old 08-26-2013, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by kobaltblue
Its mounted on the passenger side fenderwell a little 3"x3" box with a flat plug, Its about 20.00 bucks or so.

To advance the timing a little you need to loosen up all the lines then turn, Your binding on the lines and don't want to chance breaking any of them.
Wouldn't I have to rebleed from the pump to the injectors due to air getting back into the lines? Do I take the lines off completely or do I just unscrew them halfway?

Here's a video of the smoking issue:

Sorry for the potato quality there, it didn't look near as bad on my phone.
 
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Old 08-26-2013, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Chevy_Eater

Engine off hook up a volt meter across one of your batteries. Should read around 12.5 volts. If under 12 you need to charge the batteries.

Check

Start the truck. In a perfect world you'd be seeing 14 volts with all accessories off and engine idling. My POS has to be up around 1000 RPM to hit the 14 volts, but this is still sufficient to keep the batteries up.



If you are still seeing around 12 Volts, even at high RPM you are not charging.

FWIW I got one of these from Wal Mart a long time ago, I leave it plugged in all the time:

Equus Innova 3721 Battery Charging System Monitor - Walmart.com

Again, congrats!

I'll leave the timing/smoking to the guys that have dealt with them...

According to the multimeter it is infact charging. I see aroudd 13.80ish volts at 1000 rpm, as well as at idle I see the multimeter go up .01 every two seconds
 
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Old 08-26-2013, 11:34 PM
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No you don't need to bleed the lines what would concern me is it took 3 days for you to bleed the air, It should only take about 10 minutes the white some could be from air still getting in the system, But you should TIME the engine correct way to rule out retarted timing until then you just making more work for yourself and will never be satified with the truck.

Just loosen a touch so its movable.
 
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Old 08-27-2013, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by kobaltblue
No you don't need to bleed the lines what would concern me is it took 3 days for you to bleed the air, It should only take about 10 minutes the white some could be from air still getting in the system, But you should TIME the engine correct way to rule out retarted timing until then you just making more work for yourself and will never be satified with the truck.

Just loosen a touch so its movable.
Gotcha, thanks for clearing that up. I have to go into work so I'll work on it tomorrow
 
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Old 08-29-2013, 11:31 AM
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I turned the pump towards the passenger side, advancing it. I saw little to no change in the white smoke, whether at idle or at a constant 15-20mph.

I'm not sure but I may also be hearing a tick (I noticed it before the advancement in timing)

The only change I saw was there was noticably more black smoke when I throttled it.
 
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Old 08-29-2013, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Xenthrax
According to the multimeter it is infact charging. I see aroudd 13.80ish volts at 1000 rpm, as well as at idle I see the multimeter go up .01 every two seconds
Well, it's charging then. Something's wrong though for your light to be on and the dash gauge to be showing only 8 volts.

Here's the pics I promised although it sounds like your problem is elsewhere:








 
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Old 08-29-2013, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Chevy_Eater
Well, it's charging then. Something's wrong though for your light to be on and the dash gauge to be showing only 8 volts.
Thanks for the pictures

Just for clarification the factory gauge only shows 8 volts when the glowplugs are cycling, or when the accesories are on

When the truck is warmed it shows what I'm guessing to be 13-15 volts
 
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Old 09-02-2013, 07:02 PM
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Is it possible that the truck may have low compression/ fuel lift pump bad?
 


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