2012 F350 tranny slipping when towing 5er
#31
08-12-2012, 10:43 AM
Does it shudder enough to spill your coffee or is it something that you just feel.?
I can feel strain on the drive line with heavy trailer and hard acceleration from a stop, but it's nothing but lots of power being loaded onto lots of steel. I expect it to groan a little.
I can feel strain on the drive line with heavy trailer and hard acceleration from a stop, but it's nothing but lots of power being loaded onto lots of steel. I expect it to groan a little.
#32
08-12-2012, 11:51 AM
#33
09-30-2012, 05:34 PM
Took my first camping with 2012 King Ranch F350 and 37 feet Challenger 12k fifth wheel trailer over the weekend.
I noticed there is lot of transmission slips in first gear. Once it enters 2nd gear, no more slips.
My previous Chev 2008 2500HD diesel didn't slip much with same trailer.
Is this normal for this F350? My rear ratio is 3.55. No slips without hauling.
Maybe I need to ask dealer to check 1st gear towing?
I noticed there is lot of transmission slips in first gear. Once it enters 2nd gear, no more slips.
My previous Chev 2008 2500HD diesel didn't slip much with same trailer.
Is this normal for this F350? My rear ratio is 3.55. No slips without hauling.
Maybe I need to ask dealer to check 1st gear towing?
#34
09-30-2012, 06:12 PM
Please keep us posted. I am still having problem and not related to wheel spin as I thought before. Do you have any kind of reference numbers or kit numbers that dealer installed that I can take to my dealer?
#35
10-05-2012, 09:21 AM
#38
10-06-2012, 09:38 PM
Asked dealer about shudder on take off with a trailer hooked up. Guy said he never heard of the problem. I told the dip ***** that I have read about a drive line problem on the forums. He then changed his story and said that they have advised adding air bags and that has helped the problem. A** hole. I think all the service reps' first response is 'never heard of that'. Told him I had a 350 and that it should not squat as bad. He held to his advise, so air bags are on order. Hope that helps.
#39
10-07-2012, 08:10 AM
#41
10-07-2012, 06:47 PM
#42
10-08-2012, 04:00 PM
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Every Super Duty I've had has had the "shudder" since 2003.
The shudder is axle wrap, which is caused by deflection of the rear leaf springs when sufficient torque is applied to the axle, and the wheel cannot spin or rotate enough to reduce the torque loading.
It is a known issue, and there is a TSB for it, which attempts to re-align the drive line angles to a straighter line when you are in the condition causing the shudder.
It tells you in the TSB that you may end up with a shudder when not towing...a co-worker took his 2009 F350 in because it shuddered when towing taking off from a stop. They fixed that, now it shudders when he takes off from a stop when NOT towing, just like the TSB stated.
My 2011 F450 shudders significantly less than my 2008 F350 DRW. When my 5th wheel was hooked up my 2008 would literally resonate with the 5th wheel and they both would start bouncing.
I had to take off slowly to avoid the bounce.
The new rear end in 2011 was re-designed with wider leaf springs and different mounting locations to reduce this effect, and it worked. I can pin my F450 and only get very minor shudder.
Do a google search on axle wrap and read all about it. It's annoying but normal.
"Axle wrap occurs when the rotational force of the tires causes the axle housing to twist and rotate. It’s most noticeable during hard acceleration from a standing start and on hill climbs while accelerating. This rotation of the axle housing forces the springs to bend into and S-shape. When the axle housing rotates far enough, two things happen: The spring force tries to push the housing in the opposite direction, and the U-joint attempts to make a straight line between the axle-assembly yoke and driveshaft. These forces cause the tires to loose traction, and “jump”, or “hop”. Once the traction is lost, the leaf springs snap back into their original position. This happens over and over until the truck either gains better traction or the drive reduces torque input by letting off the throttle. Axle wrap can also occur during deceleration, such as hard braking.
http://www.activesuspension.com/wp-c.../Axlewrap.jpeg
The shudder is axle wrap, which is caused by deflection of the rear leaf springs when sufficient torque is applied to the axle, and the wheel cannot spin or rotate enough to reduce the torque loading.
It is a known issue, and there is a TSB for it, which attempts to re-align the drive line angles to a straighter line when you are in the condition causing the shudder.
It tells you in the TSB that you may end up with a shudder when not towing...a co-worker took his 2009 F350 in because it shuddered when towing taking off from a stop. They fixed that, now it shudders when he takes off from a stop when NOT towing, just like the TSB stated.
My 2011 F450 shudders significantly less than my 2008 F350 DRW. When my 5th wheel was hooked up my 2008 would literally resonate with the 5th wheel and they both would start bouncing.
I had to take off slowly to avoid the bounce.
The new rear end in 2011 was re-designed with wider leaf springs and different mounting locations to reduce this effect, and it worked. I can pin my F450 and only get very minor shudder.
Do a google search on axle wrap and read all about it. It's annoying but normal.
"Axle wrap occurs when the rotational force of the tires causes the axle housing to twist and rotate. It’s most noticeable during hard acceleration from a standing start and on hill climbs while accelerating. This rotation of the axle housing forces the springs to bend into and S-shape. When the axle housing rotates far enough, two things happen: The spring force tries to push the housing in the opposite direction, and the U-joint attempts to make a straight line between the axle-assembly yoke and driveshaft. These forces cause the tires to loose traction, and “jump”, or “hop”. Once the traction is lost, the leaf springs snap back into their original position. This happens over and over until the truck either gains better traction or the drive reduces torque input by letting off the throttle. Axle wrap can also occur during deceleration, such as hard braking.
http://www.activesuspension.com/wp-c.../Axlewrap.jpeg
#43
10-09-2012, 02:01 PM
Every Super Duty I've had has had the "shudder" since 2003.
The shudder is axle wrap, which is caused by deflection of the rear leaf springs when sufficient torque is applied to the axle, and the wheel cannot spin or rotate enough to reduce the torque loading.
It is a known issue, and there is a TSB for it, which attempts to re-align the drive line angles to a straighter line when you are in the condition causing the shudder.
It tells you in the TSB that you may end up with a shudder when not towing...a co-worker took his 2009 F350 in because it shuddered when towing taking off from a stop. They fixed that, now it shudders when he takes off from a stop when NOT towing, just like the TSB stated.
My 2011 F450 shudders significantly less than my 2008 F350 DRW. When my 5th wheel was hooked up my 2008 would literally resonate with the 5th wheel and they both would start bouncing.
I had to take off slowly to avoid the bounce.
The new rear end in 2011 was re-designed with wider leaf springs and different mounting locations to reduce this effect, and it worked. I can pin my F450 and only get very minor shudder.
Do a google search on axle wrap and read all about it. It's annoying but normal.
"Axle wrap occurs when the rotational force of the tires causes the axle housing to twist and rotate. It’s most noticeable during hard acceleration from a standing start and on hill climbs while accelerating. This rotation of the axle housing forces the springs to bend into and S-shape. When the axle housing rotates far enough, two things happen: The spring force tries to push the housing in the opposite direction, and the U-joint attempts to make a straight line between the axle-assembly yoke and driveshaft. These forces cause the tires to loose traction, and “jump”, or “hop”. Once the traction is lost, the leaf springs snap back into their original position. This happens over and over until the truck either gains better traction or the drive reduces torque input by letting off the throttle. Axle wrap can also occur during deceleration, such as hard braking.
http://www.activesuspension.com/wp-c.../Axlewrap.jpeg
The shudder is axle wrap, which is caused by deflection of the rear leaf springs when sufficient torque is applied to the axle, and the wheel cannot spin or rotate enough to reduce the torque loading.
It is a known issue, and there is a TSB for it, which attempts to re-align the drive line angles to a straighter line when you are in the condition causing the shudder.
It tells you in the TSB that you may end up with a shudder when not towing...a co-worker took his 2009 F350 in because it shuddered when towing taking off from a stop. They fixed that, now it shudders when he takes off from a stop when NOT towing, just like the TSB stated.
My 2011 F450 shudders significantly less than my 2008 F350 DRW. When my 5th wheel was hooked up my 2008 would literally resonate with the 5th wheel and they both would start bouncing.
I had to take off slowly to avoid the bounce.
The new rear end in 2011 was re-designed with wider leaf springs and different mounting locations to reduce this effect, and it worked. I can pin my F450 and only get very minor shudder.
Do a google search on axle wrap and read all about it. It's annoying but normal.
"Axle wrap occurs when the rotational force of the tires causes the axle housing to twist and rotate. It’s most noticeable during hard acceleration from a standing start and on hill climbs while accelerating. This rotation of the axle housing forces the springs to bend into and S-shape. When the axle housing rotates far enough, two things happen: The spring force tries to push the housing in the opposite direction, and the U-joint attempts to make a straight line between the axle-assembly yoke and driveshaft. These forces cause the tires to loose traction, and “jump”, or “hop”. Once the traction is lost, the leaf springs snap back into their original position. This happens over and over until the truck either gains better traction or the drive reduces torque input by letting off the throttle. Axle wrap can also occur during deceleration, such as hard braking.
http://www.activesuspension.com/wp-c.../Axlewrap.jpeg
Unfortunately I don't recommend doing this on a regular basis because of the tremendous stress this can place on the transfer case and driveline when applying that much torque on dry pavement and not allowing for front-rear slip. The best way to manage axle wrap is to not apply full throttle from a dead stop.
Carl
#44
10-09-2012, 03:17 PM
I experienced this with my 2006 F350 and have experienced on the 2011 F350. My previous fifth wheel camper weighed approximately 8,000 lbs with 1660-1800 lbs on the pin and the truck would always shudder on takeoff with this trailer until it hit second gear. I installed airbags for a our new trailer with a pin weight of over 3,000 lbs and on the 500 mile trip home never experienced this shudder. Even with the airbags, the truck suspension sits at the same ride height that it did with the lighter trailer, so I don't think ride height is causing the issue.
I don't see how the airbags could mitigate axle wrap, but in my case they definitely made a difference.
I don't see how the airbags could mitigate axle wrap, but in my case they definitely made a difference.
#45
11-25-2014, 09:12 PM