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2500PSI, LOTS of smoke, no start, help w/ AE

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Old 11-11-2011, 10:06 AM
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2500PSI, LOTS of smoke, no start, help w/ AE

Not your normal cold start problems...

Smokes like a steam train, Reads 2500 PSi and 35% duty cycle on AE while cranking. It should be around 500PSI? Right?
and won't start unless plugged in.

It puts out ALOTof smoke that smells like fuel while cranking.

It has a Stancor relay, and passed the glow plug test on AE

The barometric pressure is reading in the red at 4.5v cold engine, does not match with Exhaust backpressure, or Manifold Absolute pressure as I read somewhere that it should.

Throws codes
P0500
P0603
P1247
P1211


What now? Please help, my head is bleeding from beating against the wall...
 
  #2  
Old 11-11-2011, 10:16 AM
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What glow plug test are you talking about?
When it's plugged in, does it start more normally without excessive smoke?

Set AE to system voltage and turn the key on. Does the volts drop down to the 11.2-11.7 range?

My first thought is that your relay is not working properly.
 
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Shake-N-Bake
What glow plug test are you talking about?

Diesel- KOER, glow plug , it is grouped w/ the other tests

When it's plugged in, does it start more normally without excessive smoke?

Starts easier, with some smoke

Set AE to system voltage and turn the key on. Does the volts drop down to the 11.2-11.7 range?

Yes

My first thought is that your relay is not working properly.

New Stancor relay and it is switching.

I just got it to start, fuel pressure at 700 - 750PSI and it is smoking less.

10 minutes of idling and I'm at 550PSI and no smoke.


So what is casing the fuel pressure to go so high while cranking?

It acts like a flooded engine...
 
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Old 11-11-2011, 11:02 AM
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I thought the glow plug system test was for the trucks that have the control module. I didn't know it also worked on standard relay arrangements as well....maybe somebody can help me out with that.

The high pressure oil will keep climbing while cranking until the engine finally fires. Sounds to me like the glow plugs aren't getting hot. Your volt readings appear to show a healthy draw but the symptoms you describe sounds like worn out glow plugs to me....especially since it starts better when plugged in and idles fine after it's warmed up.

Maybe someone else will have some other ideas.
 
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Old 11-11-2011, 11:18 AM
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The 700-750 PSI reading is the ICP and it appears that once it starts it is going into high idle which is normal at about 35° or less. After it warms up then high idle cancels and the ICP drops to normal idle ICP.

I agree with Greg that it doesn't appear that the glow plugs are heating up the combustion chambers. Do you have a GPCM or a GPR?

 
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by PaysonPSD
The 700-750 PSI reading is the ICP and it appears that once it starts it is going into high idle which is normal at about 35° or less. After it warms up then high idle cancels and the ICP drops to normal idle ICP.

I agree with Greg that it doesn't appear that the glow plugs are heating up the combustion chambers. Do you have a GPCM or a GPR?

I have a GPR, it's a new Stancor. It seems like the draw on the batts are a good indication of the glow plugs working.

What about the Barometric pressure reading? If it's really high wouldn't that cause some problems? Where or what provides the barometric pressure reading?

After it warmed up and went for a long ride, I stopped and tried to start again, in the 3 seconds or less it took to fire up the pressure climbed to over 2,000 PSI


What am I missing?
 
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Old 11-12-2011, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by 1duallyman
What am I missing?
What part needs more explanation?

The ICP difference after warm up?

Do you have 2 relays that look like the AIH relay or the above configuration, an AIH and a GPCM?
 
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Old 11-12-2011, 06:17 PM
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Pull the 9 pinconnector on the valve covers and ohn out the glow plugs to verify they are good. If all the glow plugs test ok then you may be looking at worn out injectors.
How many miles are on the truck?
 
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Old 11-12-2011, 07:17 PM
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How many miles are on the truck? What is the maintenance history like? Oil change interval? What color is the smoke? Does it start better if it's plugged in first? What are the temps outside when it's having problems? Can you read BARO in psi?

Kind of sounds like worn injectors.
 
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Old 11-13-2011, 10:18 AM
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Thanks everyone!

Let me say again, I do have a GPR, and it is a new Stancor.

The truck has a 140K

I pulled the connector and OHMed the plugs.

I got 3 on each side with open circuits and 1 on each side with .000 resistance.

Both the .000 terminals were the second from the front on each side.

So I guess the AE glow plug test does not work with GPR's

I guess I need to pull the valve covers and check the harness?
 
  #11  
Old 11-13-2011, 01:19 PM
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Sounds like you got her figured out.
If you change the glow plugs, get them from Ford or International. The Autolite plugs from parts stores tend to swell and break off in the head.
 
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Old 11-13-2011, 04:59 PM
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Ok, I got the drivers side cover off and tested the glow plugs direct, they all tested the same 3 broken connections and 1 .000

So all glow plugs are bad, ... thanks everyone for the help.

So do I replace the gaskets and harness to?

Where is a good place to get these parts?
 
  #13  
Old 11-13-2011, 08:29 PM
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Most of the parts are best found through Clay at Riffraff, I personally would not change the gaskets and harnesses unless you see a potential problem, just perform the 50 cent modification. Torque down the injector hold down bolts(120 inch lbs) and the rocker arm pedestal bolts(20 ft-lbs).

Riffraff Diesel: Motorcraft Glowplugs

Riffraff Diesel: Ford Under Valve Cover Harness 99-03

Riffraff Diesel: Ford Valve Cover Gasket 99-03
 
  #14  
Old 11-13-2011, 08:30 PM
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This thread might help with things too.

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/8...t=truck+shakes
 
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:47 PM
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With all this talk of GP's though, are you still having a no start issue? Will it start if you plug it in?

With the VC's off, have you watched the oil discharge from the injectors while trying to start?

To me it is sounding more like possible worn injectors.
 


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