I wish I knew half of what you guys have forgot!
Do you know what I am talking about though? On the head markings? I had a particular machine shop do all my valve jobs, and they would stamp them with their own marking, and epoxy a heat sensing disk on the ends of the head. If the heat sensing disk was melted under warranty, you were SOL

 

You guys missed the dead giveway in the pics he posted.
He's got a 1969-1970 351W. If he counts his intake bolts, he'll find that he's got 4 more than he should have. Both the 351W and the 289/302s use 12 bolts to hold the intake down throught most all the years except 1969 and 1970. Offenhauser is the only manufacturer that makes an intake manifold that uses all 16 bolt holes that the early 351W heads have.

The other giveaway to the engine's vintage is his alternator bracket setup. See that "T" bracket mounted on the head to secure the alternator bolt? That's another '69-'70 351W only part. Allows the use of 289/302 alternator brackets on the 351W engine.(Ford's quick fix) In '71 the brackets changed and were fitted to align with the typical tri-angular bracket you see mounted to the head throughout the 70s on ALL the small block fords. The change also brought the alternator onto a belt of itself as the power steering ran the waterpump by then.

 

EZ way to ID 351C/351M/400 if the heads are MIA: The fuel pump bolts to the left (drivers) side of the engine block, the pumps bolt pattern is: 12 & 6 o'clock, the only Ford engines to use this pattern.

Other fuel pump bolt pattern: 3 & 9 o'clock.

These engines do not have a timing cover, per se (where the fuel pump usually mounts), just a flat 'engine front cover plate.'

btw: inre to '1969/70' 351W intake manifold bolts, the '65/72 Ford car parts catalog sez: 1969/71 351W: 56127-S .. Bolt-Intake Manifold to Cylinder Head / 5/16" -18 x 2.25" hex head.

52 Merc: Los Angeles assembly plant actually located in Pico Rivera, was erected intially to assemble Edsels, but only 1958's were assembled there (sales were slim and none for the Dead-sell).

It became a Lincoln/Mercury assembly plant, was shuttered at some point (don't recall when) in the 1980's.

A well known (at one time) incident occurred there. A fellow who had bought a new Continental Mark III had myriad complaints, FoMoCo refused to fix many of them...so what did he do?

He contacted the news media...then drove to Pico Rivera...up onto the lawn in front of the FoMoCo administration building and set the Mark on fire!

It burned to a crisp to the delight of the media, and was a feature story on LA TV stations for several days hence.

 

Yeah I've been told that before too. I've only run across C9xx and D0xx casting coded heads with the 8 per side bolt config. Have yet to see a pair of D1xx heads with the extra intake bolts. I suppose Ford would have just been using up the D0xx casted head in '71 tho~.

 

I won't lie I did not read a single post on this thread.
But here is my thought.
Darksider whatever everyone wants to call it.
If you go anything from stock, you changed something so your not stock. "Darksider"
Apparently what you change seems to matter.
If you put a Chevy engine, (look around this forum, very few members can even spell Chevy) then your a huge darksider.
Yet so many put parts from other brands on their truck. Oh my god you put a 350 in yoru truck.
What I have learned it doesn't matter what anyone thinks. My thought if they don't like it so be it.
It's your truck do what you want.
I have talked about puting a 302 or 351 in mine because I would like to keep it Ford.
I have argued with one guy to the point I don't want to see him ever again in my life. Has to be stock.
Told a guy I had my truck and same deal. He told me to e-mail Jay Leno and he would tell me how to fix it, same guy told me to use street signs to fix the floor in my Camaro.

Dosen't matter how you look at it, either they are stupid or you are.
Nothing wrong with listening to someone else, but do what you want.

 

Well that's obvious.... thread is about IDing an engine.



Well, its a Ford/Chevy thing, but not the way you point it out...



It does. All original, non-upgraded, year correct, NOS stock parts makes a person a "MELVIN"... That comes from ****-retentive Mustang restorers who do every paint daub, chalk mark, over-spray & orange peel that came off the line.



No, just makes you a regular darksider. Dual circuit master cylinders, disc brakes, electric windshield wipers, 12 volt electrical systems that can run modern lights and a whole host of upgrades that keep a person & the others driving around him safe makes a person sane.



Nah, that's just the typical "abomination unto Henry" that true, bleed Ford blue enthusiasts have come to live & put up with...

 

I've been a MELVIN since 1956...and have never owned a Mustang.

At one time, before all the made in China crap repro parts invaded our shores, the only parts available were NOS or used.

 

Back in the fall I pretty much established my engine is a 351W (see previous posts). My main reason for resurrecting this thread is to determine what the numbers mean that are stamped on the block. I still do not know for sure what year my engine is and what vehicle it came from. How about this stamp in the pic below? I think this is the defining number, is it not? If so, how do I decipher it to know what vehicle and what year it came out of?



I have replaced my Offy intake with an Edelbrock, so now I have only 12 intake manifold bolts But I do, in fact, have the T bracket for the alternator you talked about.

 

0C23 = Engine block cast March (C) 23, 1970 (0).

Block casting numbers are foundry marks, cannot be cross referenced to Ford parts numbers, but...

C9OE = 1969 Fairlane/Torino, but this doesn't mean it was only installed in Fairlane/Torino's, coulda also been installed in a Galaxie/LTD/Montego/Mustang/Cougar, but...

It wasn't installed in any of these cars...because the 1969 model run ended August 1969.

Which means, the same casting number was used in 1970 / 1970 possibles, same as 1969: Galaxie/LTD/Fairlane/Torino/Montego/Mustang/Cougar.

 

OK, cool. Where did you find that info?


thanks!

t

 

It's not info you 'find'. It's common knowledge that we who know a thing or two about Ford stuff because we've been doing it for 40 or 50 years just know. I don't understand why you continue to doubt us about the answers we give to your questions. They are consistent and correct. I know I've told you several times you have a 1970 351W, yet you still continue to say you don't believe us. Perhaps you should try talking with these folks. You can give them the partial vin and some money and they will tell you everything you ever wanted to know about your engine's donor vehicle. Marti Auto Works - Concourse Quality, Hobbyist Price.

 

The posts on this thread have been getting pretty deep into the weeds on casting numbers, etc but to answer your intitial question there are a few basic traits of these engines that you can use to quickly differentiate one from the other.

First...BBF or SBF: a Cleveland has the radiator hose outlet mounted on the timing cover housing...SBF comes out the intake manifold.

Second...302 or 351W: the bores on the SBF are the same, what differentiates them in terms of dispacement is the stroke...3.0 for the 302 and 3.5 for the 351W. What this means is that the deck on the 351W is taller. A taller deck means that the heads sit higher and the width of the intake manifold is noticeably wider. With a little practice you will be able to tell a narrow intake from a wide intake and at a glance know whether the engine is 302 or 351W.

Hope this helps...

 

One other thing to note is that your dip stick enters the front of the block by the water pump, mine is on the drivers side by the fuel pump and down into the oil pan?

 

Yeah they did that in the later years to both the 302 and the 351W. I think it had alot to do with the shape the oil pan had to take on to be installed in the vehicles at that time. It seems that the truck/van applications in the later 70s had the dipstick going straight into the driver's side of the oil pan, but if you were to look at the pan, it's more of a rear or mid-sump pan anyways. No way for a front mount dipstick then. Even the 460 was this way too. In the 80's there was an open hole casted into the driver's side of the block just above the oil pain rail that is used for the dipstick, rather than going into the pan itself. The '87 302 block i have laying around has one.

 

Easy there merc. I've never once said i dont believe you. I know it's a 351w and you all were instrumental in helping me determine that. I'm not doubting your answers. Somehow I missed that it was for sure a 70 tho. As stated a few posts back, the reason I resurrected this thread was to figure out WHAT VEHICLE my engine came from. Not what kind of engine it is. Now I know it is not completely determinable. As far as asking where somebody found some info, I am trying to learn about sources of info etc so I can look things up for myself without having to post questions. Last, if my threads and inquiries irritate you, then don't read them...but I hope you continue to read them and answer them because I know you know a lot. Sorry to have annoyed you. Just trying to learn...

Tyler