Ford Super Duty Going Electric
#61
I had a quick drive though the Ozarks today and got to thinking about Air Hybrids and how easy they would be to build into a pickup...
Heck, you don't even have to modify the engine... just add a pneumatic motor/compressor externally to start with and then integrate it in the next big round of changes. It could act just like a Jacobs brake and completely disconnect when not in use... when you downshift and tap the brakes, the pneumatics kick in as a compressor and fills the tank... When you have enough pressure, the pneumatics run as a motor in parallel with the engine and boost fuel mileage.
I was also thinking that if used on a semi, this would cause quite a few of those "no engine brake" signs to start falling, and allow drivers to use their rigs like they are meant to... since the compressed air is not released to the atmosphere, neither is the sound of the rapid decompression when the braking valve opens.
Heck, you don't even have to modify the engine... just add a pneumatic motor/compressor externally to start with and then integrate it in the next big round of changes. It could act just like a Jacobs brake and completely disconnect when not in use... when you downshift and tap the brakes, the pneumatics kick in as a compressor and fills the tank... When you have enough pressure, the pneumatics run as a motor in parallel with the engine and boost fuel mileage.
I was also thinking that if used on a semi, this would cause quite a few of those "no engine brake" signs to start falling, and allow drivers to use their rigs like they are meant to... since the compressed air is not released to the atmosphere, neither is the sound of the rapid decompression when the braking valve opens.
#62
I'm not 100% sure, but I think on a stock engine, it would work poor because of the compression stroke.
Maybe it would be better to use an external pump....the engine also can only pump to a certain pressure-
Only problem is that a pump behind the transmission is going to work not as nice.
Maybe it would be better to use an external pump....the engine also can only pump to a certain pressure-
Only problem is that a pump behind the transmission is going to work not as nice.
#63
A traction motor will never fit there, not with today's technology.
Unless they go really whimpy.
I've seen a 30 HP traction motor, it is about the size of a 20 gal drum.
There are small high performance traction motors, but those are for light vehicles, not massive heavy loads......I would have to imagine they would wear out super fast.
At this point, I'd say everything I've seen on the internet looks like trial stage stuff.
If you take a super duty truck, loaded to capacity, and calculate the joules it takes to get it rolling, you'll see that nothing available right now is capable of doing that from batteries.
Maybe for a ranger, not a super duty.
Unless they go really whimpy.
I've seen a 30 HP traction motor, it is about the size of a 20 gal drum.
There are small high performance traction motors, but those are for light vehicles, not massive heavy loads......I would have to imagine they would wear out super fast.
At this point, I'd say everything I've seen on the internet looks like trial stage stuff.
If you take a super duty truck, loaded to capacity, and calculate the joules it takes to get it rolling, you'll see that nothing available right now is capable of doing that from batteries.
Maybe for a ranger, not a super duty.
On my 99 F250SD, I figure there is greater than 7' between the back of the transmission and the rear differential (assuming I read the tape measure correct in the dark). You could fit two 55 gal drums in that space.
#65
I was sitting here thinking about all of this PHEV stuff and had a thought. I have a 99 F250SD 2 valve 5.4L V8 with 260 hp. Moreover, I have towed a 9000 lb. trailer load of hay at highway speeds with it. My combined truck and trailer load of hay puts me in the GVWR range of these medium duty vehicles. Now convert 260 hp to kilowatts. The conversion if I remember correctly is 1 horsepower = 0.746 kilowatt. So, I get 194 kilowatts.
The E450 balance hybrid system uses a 100 kilowatt motor. Therefore, an induction motor (the traction motor) of twice the power used in the E450 hybrids, 200 kilowatts, would give a bit more horsepower than my 2 valve 5.4L V8. Oh, you also get the torque benefit of the electric motor. Now if you only want to go 30 mph full electric you would not need 260 hp (assuming light acceleration). Stomp on it and the 6.7L diesel gets a horsepower and torque boost by electric assist.
Hey, but I am just speculating on all of this based on my knowledge of what has been developed, produced, and is under development. I could be totally wrong on this the PHEV system for the F550. It may have very little in common with the balance hybrid electric system. ---Fun to discuss nonetheless---
The E450 balance hybrid system uses a 100 kilowatt motor. Therefore, an induction motor (the traction motor) of twice the power used in the E450 hybrids, 200 kilowatts, would give a bit more horsepower than my 2 valve 5.4L V8. Oh, you also get the torque benefit of the electric motor. Now if you only want to go 30 mph full electric you would not need 260 hp (assuming light acceleration). Stomp on it and the 6.7L diesel gets a horsepower and torque boost by electric assist.
Hey, but I am just speculating on all of this based on my knowledge of what has been developed, produced, and is under development. I could be totally wrong on this the PHEV system for the F550. It may have very little in common with the balance hybrid electric system. ---Fun to discuss nonetheless---
#67
Prius cars in reality are less green than most vehicles on the road because when those batteries wear out, they will be cost prohibitive to replace and alot of cars will just get dumped and the owner will buy something else. Yet, the people get suckered into thinking that they are good for the enviroment, when in all reality, they could get better mileage and less cost by getting a diesel commuter.
#68
#69
But why that should matter for average Joe making 12,000 miles a year?
#70
I had a quick drive though the Ozarks today and got to thinking about Air Hybrids and how easy they would be to build into a pickup...
Heck, you don't even have to modify the engine... just add a pneumatic motor/compressor externally to start with and then integrate it in the next big round of changes. It could act just like a Jacobs brake and completely disconnect when not in use... when you downshift and tap the brakes, the pneumatics kick in as a compressor and fills the tank... When you have enough pressure, the pneumatics run as a motor in parallel with the engine and boost fuel mileage.
I was also thinking that if used on a semi, this would cause quite a few of those "no engine brake" signs to start falling, and allow drivers to use their rigs like they are meant to... since the compressed air is not released to the atmosphere, neither is the sound of the rapid decompression when the braking valve opens.
Heck, you don't even have to modify the engine... just add a pneumatic motor/compressor externally to start with and then integrate it in the next big round of changes. It could act just like a Jacobs brake and completely disconnect when not in use... when you downshift and tap the brakes, the pneumatics kick in as a compressor and fills the tank... When you have enough pressure, the pneumatics run as a motor in parallel with the engine and boost fuel mileage.
I was also thinking that if used on a semi, this would cause quite a few of those "no engine brake" signs to start falling, and allow drivers to use their rigs like they are meant to... since the compressed air is not released to the atmosphere, neither is the sound of the rapid decompression when the braking valve opens.
The air starters/emergency supply operate with like 3000-5000 psi. Totally different animal and safety issues.
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01-23-2008 03:36 PM