1997 4.2 won't start
#1
1997 4.2 won't start
I have a long story, but I will try to keep it short. As the title says '97 F150 with a 4.2 V6. It has 108,000 but I don't know the history of the engine. I have owned it for 4 years and it has run well. During my problem, which I am going to describe, I found the engine has been out and not sure what was done.
I changed the plug wires on my truck and I did a stupid thing, when I started it, it was running a little rough. I figured I had crossed the wires. I checked the diagram and I guess my dyslexia, or lack of concentration caused me to really cross the wires on the number 2 bank. When I tried to start it that time, it backfired a couple of big ones.
Then I knew I really did have the wires crossed. I checked them out again and think I got them right then. But after that, it has not started and run. It kicked against the starter and backfired some small ones. It seemed to be really rich and when I pulled the plugs to check, they were covered with black soot.
Later, I did a compression check and found one cylinder with the compression 80# less than the others. I figured I had caused the timing chain to jump and that had messed up the valves on that cylinder.
I knew it would probably be $1500 to pull the head and front cover so I decided to get a reman. longblock instead of putting that much in the old one. My brother and installed it over the weekend.
Then things got worse, the new engine acted exactly the same as the old one. It kicked back against the starter, carboned up the plugs and spit and stuttered, never starting. We tried a new crank sensor, coil pack, and cam sensor. Nothing changed. We double checked to see if the it was timed right.
Is there a possibility that the large backfires, when I had the wires crossed, messed up the ECU? Or does someone have any other suggestions?
Thanks for reading through this and I have already cussed out my self and kicked my butt so I don't need anymore of that!!!!
Smitty
I changed the plug wires on my truck and I did a stupid thing, when I started it, it was running a little rough. I figured I had crossed the wires. I checked the diagram and I guess my dyslexia, or lack of concentration caused me to really cross the wires on the number 2 bank. When I tried to start it that time, it backfired a couple of big ones.
Then I knew I really did have the wires crossed. I checked them out again and think I got them right then. But after that, it has not started and run. It kicked against the starter and backfired some small ones. It seemed to be really rich and when I pulled the plugs to check, they were covered with black soot.
Later, I did a compression check and found one cylinder with the compression 80# less than the others. I figured I had caused the timing chain to jump and that had messed up the valves on that cylinder.
I knew it would probably be $1500 to pull the head and front cover so I decided to get a reman. longblock instead of putting that much in the old one. My brother and installed it over the weekend.
Then things got worse, the new engine acted exactly the same as the old one. It kicked back against the starter, carboned up the plugs and spit and stuttered, never starting. We tried a new crank sensor, coil pack, and cam sensor. Nothing changed. We double checked to see if the it was timed right.
Is there a possibility that the large backfires, when I had the wires crossed, messed up the ECU? Or does someone have any other suggestions?
Thanks for reading through this and I have already cussed out my self and kicked my butt so I don't need anymore of that!!!!
Smitty
#2
#3
Brian, thanks for replying. I had the truck towed to a garage with a very good mechanic. After some troubleshooting, he found out that there was no backfiring with the front and back plug wires out of the coil pack. He then put the front plug wires in the back and the back wires in the front of the coil pack. He was not sure what would happen, but it started and ran fine.
About the same time as he must have found this, I found the following post on another Ford forum.
The answer is in the last post that I did copy and include below the link.
crank and crank no run! - F150online Forums
"Okay guys….I never want to just leave a post hanging! I finally got the coil/plug problem solved!!! But it was not easy!!! First, let me say to all who’ve traveled this road before, a Haynes’s manuals can be wrong!! Well, maybe not wrong, but sometimes the right information is just not in there!……On this particular 1997 Ford F150 with the 4.2 liter V6, the manual will tell you, and even show you a diagram that lays out the coil to plug wire pattern. On the coil, from front of engine back to the firewall, passenger side, manual says 1 2 3 then, from front of engine back to firewall, driver side 5 6 4. BUT, THIS IS NOT RIGHT…at least not on my truck…The correct routing is front to back passenger = 3 2 1 then front to back driver side = 4 6 5 . If you compare this to what the manual says, it’s basically the same routing, just upside down….Now…how did I figure this out?....I didn’t….I called a mechanic who did a little research…he used the I.D. number on the engine block to get the information from Ford. Something about the transition from the 3.8 liter engine to the (Canadian built) 4.2 liter engine using much the same parts and engineering…or something…but to cut it short…some of the first crossover versions of this engine happen to use this “upside down” configuration…hope this helps someone else in the future!!! Thanks!"
This seemed to be my problem to a tee!!! I was out of town for 5 days and just got home and picked my truck up and it is running fine. When we first pulled the engine, we determined it had been out before. It must have had the hydro-problem. We found missing bolts, loose bolts and also there was some welding on the rear of the engine where the transmission bolts up. Something had been broken off and welded back on.
So, I am glad to have a good engine in my truck now.
Again, Brian, thanks for replying and maybe this post will help someone else.
About the same time as he must have found this, I found the following post on another Ford forum.
The answer is in the last post that I did copy and include below the link.
crank and crank no run! - F150online Forums
"Okay guys….I never want to just leave a post hanging! I finally got the coil/plug problem solved!!! But it was not easy!!! First, let me say to all who’ve traveled this road before, a Haynes’s manuals can be wrong!! Well, maybe not wrong, but sometimes the right information is just not in there!……On this particular 1997 Ford F150 with the 4.2 liter V6, the manual will tell you, and even show you a diagram that lays out the coil to plug wire pattern. On the coil, from front of engine back to the firewall, passenger side, manual says 1 2 3 then, from front of engine back to firewall, driver side 5 6 4. BUT, THIS IS NOT RIGHT…at least not on my truck…The correct routing is front to back passenger = 3 2 1 then front to back driver side = 4 6 5 . If you compare this to what the manual says, it’s basically the same routing, just upside down….Now…how did I figure this out?....I didn’t….I called a mechanic who did a little research…he used the I.D. number on the engine block to get the information from Ford. Something about the transition from the 3.8 liter engine to the (Canadian built) 4.2 liter engine using much the same parts and engineering…or something…but to cut it short…some of the first crossover versions of this engine happen to use this “upside down” configuration…hope this helps someone else in the future!!! Thanks!"
This seemed to be my problem to a tee!!! I was out of town for 5 days and just got home and picked my truck up and it is running fine. When we first pulled the engine, we determined it had been out before. It must have had the hydro-problem. We found missing bolts, loose bolts and also there was some welding on the rear of the engine where the transmission bolts up. Something had been broken off and welded back on.
So, I am glad to have a good engine in my truck now.
Again, Brian, thanks for replying and maybe this post will help someone else.
#4
#5
Yes, Brian, the coil pack has the numbers printed on the top. I have to assume the coil pack on mine was for the later engines. That was what caused my original problem when I was changing the plug wires. But on the transition engines, those numbers should have been reversed.
Actually, the engines are the same, it is just that the coil pack fires in the reverse order. I mean that the number one plug wire goes into the rear of the coil pack instead of the front. And the same on the driver's side, number 4 plugs into the rear instead of the front. I think it could be corrected by reversing the two primary wires that fire off the coil pack. But I chose to reverse the plug wires and my truck is running great.
Smitty
Actually, the engines are the same, it is just that the coil pack fires in the reverse order. I mean that the number one plug wire goes into the rear of the coil pack instead of the front. And the same on the driver's side, number 4 plugs into the rear instead of the front. I think it could be corrected by reversing the two primary wires that fire off the coil pack. But I chose to reverse the plug wires and my truck is running great.
Smitty
#7
I have a long story, but I will try to keep it short. As the title says '97 F150 with a 4.2 V6. It has 108,000 but I don't know the history of the engine. I have owned it for 4 years and it has run well. During my problem, which I am going to describe, I found the engine has been out and not sure what was done.
I changed the plug wires on my truck and I did a stupid thing, when I started it, it was running a little rough. I figured I had crossed the wires. I checked the diagram and I guess my dyslexia, or lack of concentration caused me to really cross the wires on the number 2 bank. When I tried to start it that time, it backfired a couple of big ones.
Then I knew I really did have the wires crossed. I checked them out again and think I got them right then. But after that, it has not started and run. It kicked against the starter and backfired some small ones. It seemed to be really rich and when I pulled the plugs to check, they were covered with black soot.
Later, I did a compression check and found one cylinder with the compression 80# less than the others. I figured I had caused the timing chain to jump and that had messed up the valves on that cylinder.
I knew it would probably be $1500 to pull the head and front cover so I decided to get a reman. longblock instead of putting that much in the old one. My brother and installed it over the weekend.
Then things got worse, the new engine acted exactly the same as the old one. It kicked back against the starter, carboned up the plugs and spit and stuttered, never starting. We tried a new crank sensor, coil pack, and cam sensor. Nothing changed. We double checked to see if the it was timed right.
Is there a possibility that the large backfires, when I had the wires crossed, messed up the ECU? Or does someone have any other suggestions?
Thanks for reading through this and I have already cussed out my self and kicked my butt so I don't need anymore of that!!!!
Smitty
I changed the plug wires on my truck and I did a stupid thing, when I started it, it was running a little rough. I figured I had crossed the wires. I checked the diagram and I guess my dyslexia, or lack of concentration caused me to really cross the wires on the number 2 bank. When I tried to start it that time, it backfired a couple of big ones.
Then I knew I really did have the wires crossed. I checked them out again and think I got them right then. But after that, it has not started and run. It kicked against the starter and backfired some small ones. It seemed to be really rich and when I pulled the plugs to check, they were covered with black soot.
Later, I did a compression check and found one cylinder with the compression 80# less than the others. I figured I had caused the timing chain to jump and that had messed up the valves on that cylinder.
I knew it would probably be $1500 to pull the head and front cover so I decided to get a reman. longblock instead of putting that much in the old one. My brother and installed it over the weekend.
Then things got worse, the new engine acted exactly the same as the old one. It kicked back against the starter, carboned up the plugs and spit and stuttered, never starting. We tried a new crank sensor, coil pack, and cam sensor. Nothing changed. We double checked to see if the it was timed right.
Is there a possibility that the large backfires, when I had the wires crossed, messed up the ECU? Or does someone have any other suggestions?
Thanks for reading through this and I have already cussed out my self and kicked my butt so I don't need anymore of that!!!!
Smitty
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#8
I bought new plug wires and spark plugs and installed them. Then is when my truck would not start. The wires were installed according to the diagram I found in Chiltons manual,. There was none under the hood. I ended up taking it to a garage and finally about the same time, the mechanic and I both figured out what was wrong. The engine in my truck was manufactured in Canada and the plug wiring was different on it than ones made in the US. In other words, number one wire was in a different place. Once we plugged the plug wires in correctly, the motor started and ran fine!
I feel like by what you described, you have one or more burned exhaust valves.
Good Luck
Smitty
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