pre61-list-digest Tuesday, June 9 1998 Volume 02 : Number 163

Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1960 and Older trucks and vans
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In this issue:

Re: Flathead V-8
I saw that also
Re: Drivin' the Dream
Re: FTE Small - FTE in V8 Times Magazine
FTE in V8 Times Magazine
Re: FTE Pre61 - brakes and '48 F-1 buyers advice
Shock mounts
Flatheads and 4 speeds
Re: FTE Pre61 - Value of '48 F-1 ?
Re: pre61-list-flathead V-8
Re: FTE Pre61 - Value of '48 F-1 ?
driving that dream truck



Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 07:37:17 -0700
From: Edward Sedgwick
Subject: Re: Flathead V-8

The question about the flathead V-8 was a trick question. Somewhere, I
have an article that discusses is (and I thought I knew where it was,
but haven't found it yet.) They stopped in the US with 53, and the
Canadians will have to figure out if they actually did use them in
Canada in 1954.

Supposedly the flathead was manufactured by Ford of Brazil, and thru
various sales of companies the engine was manufactured until the early
70's, and the end company was a subsidiary of General Motors. (This may
explain why J.C.Whitney's Ford flathead parts were quite often marked
"manufactured in Brazil".) All of the US manufacturers were noted for
continuing obsolete designs in South America long after they were gone
from the US market.

So the trick answer is 197?, by General Motors.

4 Speed on the floor, the basic part nos. for the 4 speed crash box used
in the 48-52 truck are Model A and B. Interchange manuals will show some
parts interchange from 1928-1952. Not actually sure if they were used in
1928. The T-98 was supposedly from 1948 to 1955, then they changed the
cut of the gears and the 1956 on was the T-98A. (The T-98's I've seen
have been in 1951-2's, I've never seen an original in a 48-50?)

Ed Sedgwick


Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 06:36:14 -0700
Subject: I saw that also

You are right, I remember seeing frankenstein and the monster vette in
Mulvane, Ks. when I lived there, (87-94) they used to be kept on a truck
trailer in Mulvane for a while, then the owner moved south of town on
K-15. I was told that the owner was the son of Darrell Starbird (yes,
that Darrell Starbird.)


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:11:26 -0400
From: "bill daly"
Subject: Re: Drivin' the Dream

Here here, Don.

Louise was never happier than the day she hauled a full load of mulch. She
purred and gave us the smoothest ride ever.

Jan & Louise

- -----Original Message-----
From: Don & Teresa Neighbors
To: Discussion Group - Ford Trucks
Date: Sunday, June 07, 1998 4:35 PM
Subject: Drivin' the Dream

> Mike, I think you'll find a lot of us drive our trucks on a regular basis.
>I have had my truck, a '54 F20, for just less than a year, and while I
>haven't driven ol' Grover a lot yet, I have every intentions of making the
>truck a frequent, if not daily, driver. I have been driving vintage
>vehicles for over 20 years, if for no other reason than the fact I could
>not afford anything but an old car for a long time.
> Many of my co-workers have looked at me in horror when I would tell them
>that I was driving one of them on vacation or back home to visit (a 750
>mile trip, one way) because a lot of people seem to think "old" and
>"decrepit" mean the same! Believe me, when I have Grover fixed up, I'll not
>only drive to any show I attend, but when I need to haul 3/4 of a ton of
>gravel, I'll load the bed down!
> An old truck may need more frequent maintenance, but if and when they do
>break down, they are a lot easier to diagnose and repair. I say find the
>truck you want, and drive it! I do!
> Don Neighbors
> '54 F250 Named Grover


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:20:15 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Randy L. Hatcher"
Subject: Re: FTE Small - FTE in V8 Times Magazine

huh??--I must have missed the topic....

On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Ken Payne wrote:

> V8 Times did a 1/2 page write up about in their May/June issue!
> Anyone interested can order a copy from:
> Linda McDonald
> V8 Times
> 1752 Darwin Ave.
> Livermore, CA 94550 or they can be ordered via FAX and credit card numbers
> from her at (925) 447-2920
> Later,
> Ken Payne
> CoAdmin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts
> == FTE: Unsubscribe and posting info
Randy Hatcher
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------
those that have minds don't use them,those that do can't think straight.


Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 13:22:16 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: FTE in V8 Times Magazine

Woops! Typo the first time out!

V8 Times did a 1/2 page write up about Ford Truck Enthusiasts
in their May/June issue! Anyone interested can order a copy from:

Linda McDonald
V8 Times
1752 Darwin Ave.
Livermore, CA 94550 or they can be ordered via FAX and credit card numbers
from her at (925) 447-2920

Ken Payne
CoAdmin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts


Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 19:44:54 -0500
From: Rich Garber
Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - brakes and '48 F-1 buyers advice

At 01:00 AM 6/4/98 -0500, you wrote:
>> You advised anyone doing a brake job to replace the old fluid with
>>DOT 5 fluid. However, I am replacing the wheel cylinders on my '48
>>F-68 (U.S. F-2), and was talking to a mechanic who said that D.O.T. 5
>>fluid will corrode some types of rubber and brake systems. I was also told
>>that DOT 3 and DOT 4 are both natural fluids, but DOT 4 is made to handle
>>more heat which is not a problem on drum brakes. Being natural fluids,
>>this grade will absorb water simply by contacting air etc. However, DOT 5
>>is a synthetic fluid, and so creates the corrosion problem. Is this all
>>correct? If so, can my '48 system support the DOT 5 fluid?
>Yeah, Rich, Is that DOT 5 Gonna eat out my brake system? :-)
>Ray C
>PS I thought silicone was good for rubber. I have never gone back to my
>truck after a long winter and found no pedal on the brakes since the DOT 5
>changeover. My panel's been soaking in it for 10 years now. What does
>everyone think on this one?
Well, I ve read all the responses to the dot 5 question. I just finished
the brakes and used dot 5. According to the instructions, you should heat
the fluid to remove all the air, let it cool and put it in. From what
I've heard, it won't absorbe water and since this truck will sit more than
drive, I think its a good idea. I've been told its hard on the pressure
brake switch, but a $5.00 a peice thats OK. Good tip Fred, mark it dot 5.

As for brake lines, the company I was dealing with (classic) was a total
waste of time, waited 3 mo., didn't fit. I told them I could obtain some
original line for them and they did'nt even offer a price brake!
To make matters worse, they said they would call back and I always ended
up calling them! And then the credit return, I had to call them to get my
cerdit and then they didn't give me the right amount so I'm still dealing
with them. They don't have lines for a 53 to 55 Ford truck.

I bent them myself, threw out the old.

You live , You learn

54 F100


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 20:04:14 -0400
From: "Howard Tarnoff"
Subject: Shock mounts

Perhaps I have discovered the tip of the iceburg.

In doing the clean up for the Truck Nationals I put a hand on
the shocks to wipe them down (front) and find that both have some
movement at the upper mounts. I put the normal torque to them
but can not seem to get them solid.





Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 20:39:04 -0800
From: (Roger Meier)
Subject: Flatheads and 4 speeds

Craig & Jan write:
"What year did ford stop making the flat head v8 ,and at what year did
they go to four on the floor?"

The flathead V8 was last used in the USA in 1953. The flathead 6 was last
used in 1952 in trucks.
I don't know the earliest date for 4 speed trannies but 42-47 pickups used
an unsynchronized 4 speed top loaader box. A similiar box was also used in
1939 in the larger trucks, don't know about pickups, but if you have a
desparate need to know about a particular year I can try to find out from
my parts book, it covers 28-47 trucks. Both the 39 and the 42-47 box are
set up to mount a PTO. Our local Fire Dept had a 34 Ford truck that also
had a PTO but I do not know whether it was a 3 or 4 speed. Hope the
history lesson helps.
Roger Meier


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:02:53 EDT
Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Value of '48 F-1 ?

In a message dated 98-05-31 20:39:32 EDT, you write:

real liking to it. From outward appearances, it appears to be in real good
shape. I believe it is in original condition. We are sincerely interested
in purchasing it, but have no idea:

(a) what to look for, and what to look out for;
(b) how much it is wort >>

V8. That's what to look for.
Rust. That's what to look out for. 'Specially rust in the cab, at the
mounting points and the floorboards. All external parts for the nose and bed
are available, but a solid cab is essential. Unless its been
rebuilt/restored, you'll need to replace all the rubber, so it doesn't matter
what condition it's in. Wiring? If its original, it probably needs to be
replaced, so it doesn't matter if its a little ratty or shot. The motor?
Flathead V8s are the hot ticket, but getting damned expensive to rebuild, IF
you have a good block. V8s are much more desirable than sixes. Tranny will
be either a floor shifted 3 or 4 speed. 4spd is a crashbox, pain in the butt.
Suspension, steering, brakes - try it out. If you'd like to drive it for a
while without rebuilding it, these things are important, especially the
steering box play. If you're going to rebuild/restore, it doesn't matter,
you'll replace all the wear-prone parts anyway. It's 50 years old, don't
expect any normal wear parts to be original and in good condition.
What's it worth? Lots. Depends on the emotional value you and the seller
place on the truck. I paid $5000 for a good, original '51 which needs,
eventually, all the above parts replaced. It had been well cared for, and the
owner of 35 years practically cried when I drove away. I'd pay double that
for one with all the wear parts already replaced, if I knew it was done
right,and there was no rust. 'Course a friend of mine was GIVEN an equivalent
quality '53. Can't win. I don't think any of the 'what's it worth?' books or
articles have any relevance to trucks this old. They're not investment
Ferraris, no matter what some people try to tell you.


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:10:05 EDT
Subject: Re: pre61-list-flathead V-8

In a message dated 98-06-08 06:21:50 EDT, you write:

From: Craig & Jan
Subject: flathead v8

> What year did ford stop making the flat head v8 ,and at what year did
> they go to four on the floor? >>

Craig and Jan

The shift from the "flathead V-8" to the OHV V-8 engines took place in 1954 in
the US. So 1953 was last year ( I got the 53 250 4 spd on the floor) I think
in Canada they had some 54"s that had the flathead 239, if not mistaken.
I believe that all model were three speeds, the 4-spd was optional on most and
was usually on the floor. So it you have a florr shift it is most likely a
4-spd tranny. Anyone pleased corect me if I'm wrong...I think 4-spd were
around since the 40's??
I hope this helps..



Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 11:16:30 -0400
From: "Proctor"
Subject: RE;Digest

For some strange reason, I am no longer getting the digest. I have reapplied
and to date still am not getting anything.
What is going wrong ?
It has been about 3-4 weeks since I lost it.
Looking forward to your response on this matter.
with ": Earl " ,the 53 F100........


Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 21:26:14 -0600
From: "Joe Michels"
Subject: Re: FTE Pre61 - Value of '48 F-1 ?

Steve-- I bought a 52 F1 for $1250 in Oklahoma. It was all original, the
rust was minimal, on the surface, with a couple of small bottle cap size
holes in the fenders near where the running board mounts. I have $4300 in
it now-- replace the wiring, hoses, belts, ignition system, clutch, brakes,
tires, king pins, Universal joints, pinion seals, springs rearced, coil,
radiator recored. I still have the glass, bed and paint and body work to
go-- along with the seat upholstery and headliner. I expect to put in
another $5000 probably having the paint and body work outsourced. Paint
jobs come in all prices, the one that I am looking at will be around $4000,
may cost me more than $5000 when all done. This truck was an Original
Oklahoma Farm truck, has 57750 miles on the clock, I am sure that those are
original miles-- the bed and interior is all original. Is it worth
spending this much? Not sure, however, should have something real nice
when done. Of course, I had most of the tools needed to work on this,
however, probably spent $1000 on a jack stands, jack and other assorted
miscellaneous tools required to do this. I don't count the cost of the
tools in the price of the truck, if this one turns out well, will get
another one and try again. Amortization will come on about truck 4!!!!!!!!
Hope that this helps.

- ----------
> From: Steve Offiler
> To:
> Subject: FTE Pre61 - Value of '48 F-1 ?
> Date: Sunday, May 31, 1998 6:34 PM
> Hi, folks:
> I'm a newcomer to this list, and I'm really enjoying it. Briefly, my
> credentials: I'm a mechanical engineer, a Ford guy, my daily driver is a
> '97 F250HD 4x4, and I'm a staunch regular over on the Antique Tractor
> mailing list. I own, among others, a '48 Ford 8N tractor.
> Now, to my question. My wife recently ran across a '48 F-1, and took a
> real liking to it. From outward appearances, it appears to be in real
> shape. I believe it is in original condition. We are sincerely
> in purchasing it, but have no idea:
> (a) what to look for, and what to look out for;
> (b) how much it is worth
> I'm hoping you folks might help me out with (a) and then I'll go look
> closely at it and get back to you with an assement of condition and we
> move on to (b). Remember, I am not a beginner - I have a very solid
> mechanical background.
> Any and all help is greatly appreciated!!
> Best regards,
> Steve Offiler
> North Scituate RI
> = Ford Truck Enthusiasts ==============================================
> Send posts to:
> Send unsubscribe requests to: with
> "unsubscribe pre61-list" in the message body.
> =======================================================================


Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 02:24:56 -0700
From: (R. Pietsch)
Subject: driving that dream truck

Mike, As some of the other list members have stated, it's not
unrealistic to have an older vehicle as a daily driver. I bought my '56
F100 15 years ago and it has been my daily driver ever since. I have
make many upgrades to her for reliability and safety sake, but I will
drive her anywhere without worry. It takes me to work every day, takes
me hunting every fall, and even tows my 22 ft. fifth wheel trailer. It
is the only truck I have and the only one that I want to have. Every
once in a while my wife says I should get a new truck, but I tell her if
she wants a new truck, go buy one. I've got the one I want.

Rix56 'The Rat'


End of pre61-list-digest V2 #163

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