fordtrucks-digest Tuesday, April 7 1998 Volume 02 : Number 094

Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1960 And Older Trucks Digest
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In this issue:

Temp Gauge ["Don & Teresa Neighbors" ]
428 Heads on a 460 ["Don & Teresa Neighbors" ]
Re: Flathead exhaust question [Andy Montebello ]
54 F100 ["Piegat, Tim" ]
54 12v Wiper and etc (re: Cardogno) ["Piegat, Tim" ]
54 F100 handling ["Piegat, Tim" ]
Re: Radio for '48 to '51 F Series [Fordf3 ]
Re: Stroker question somewhat answered [Cathy Greenlaw
"51 fenders [Burke Wills ]
Re: "51 fenders [Scott ]
old lincoln [jc & terry ]
clevelands and chevy motors [jc & terry ]
Alternator tickler [Ray Cardogno ]
ADMIN: Free web space [Ken Payne ]
ADMIN: Free web space [Ken Payne ]



Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 06:34:22 -0400
From: "Don & Teresa Neighbors"
Subject: Temp Gauge

In the last issue, Terry wrote:

"We drove Bruce into town last night to have supper, and I noticed after I
had shut off the key that the temperature gauge read hot. He said maybe it
is the gauge since the radiator
had plenty of water in it and was just resently repaired and a new
thermostat installed. Sure enough I turned on the switch and the gauge
immediately went down when my mechanic friend fiddled with a wire under the
hood. What would make the gauge show hot when the switch is off and go back
down when it is
turned on? Also, I am having trouble with my dash lights not coming on. I
have to fiddle with the switch to get them to stay on."

Terry, about that gauge, it could be said "They all do that!" I have noe
real idea why the gauges do that at shutoff, by my truck does the same
thing. The vapor coming out of the oil breather cap is also normal. Bruce
may have a little blowby. As for your lights, the switch is either dirty or
about to die. Get some electronics cleaning spray at Radio Shack and use it
liberally on the switch. It will work wonders!

Don Neighbors
'54 F250 Named Grover


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 06:47:32 -0400
From: "Don & Teresa Neighbors"
Subject: 428 Heads on a 460

Doug, the 428 is an entirely different engine from that 460, so a head
swap is out of the question. However, I seem to remember a 490 version of
that engine back in the early 70s. If it's torque you want, that may
satisfy your craving!
Don Neighbors
'54 F250 Named Grover


Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 06:19:55 -0600
From: Andy Montebello
Subject: Re: Flathead exhaust question

Pea Soup A wrote:
> In a message dated 98-04-05 22:13:43 EDT, you write:
> exhaust and mufflers? :-) >>
> .......To this will say...PROBABLY....they get a little excited in my
> neighborhood when l pull the dragster out of the garage...even though we pick
> our starting places carefully.......l don't think it is good for the valves to
> run the engine without some kind of headers or exhaust system.........Bob
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1960 and Older --------------+
> | Send posts to, removal form on the web |
> | site. |
> +---------- Visit Our Web Site: ----------+
Back in the 50's we raced "stock cars" with no headers. I had a '34
three window coupe with a flathead - the exhaust came out of the block,
no problem with valves.


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 18:42:08 -0000
From: "Piegat, Tim"
Subject: 54 F100

I am new to the group and would like to introduce myself. I'm Tim Piegat,
and my Ford machine is a 54 F100, very much like Abe Stauffer's or Don
Neighbor's trucks. I am rebuilding the original 239, meantime it has a 272
with 312 heads, intake, and carb. I removed the original T98 4 spd and
installed a T89 3spd, with column shifter out of a 54 sedan. After I get the
239 shortblock finished, I'll take the 312 heads and port them, put in
stainless valves and hard seats, and install them on the 239. After this
comes time for the body work. Also, I obtained a 3.31 carrier and ring gear
from a 51 Merc that will replace the stock 3.92s. I used to drive the truck
to work everyday in Colorado, but it's pretty tough to manage in the Dallas
traffic, so my wife and I enjoy cruising in it, and are looking forward to
vacationing in it. I've been reviewing the archives, and will post several
additional messages under different subjects.


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:52:19 -0600
From: "Piegat, Tim"
Subject: 54 12v Wiper and etc (re: Cardogno)

About the issue concerning wiper motors in 54 F100s, I replaced my 6v unit with
one from an early 60s F100. All of the mounting and wiring was directly
applicable; the only difference is in the crank arm. The "rod journal" of the
new unit was too large for the 54 wiper "connecting rods". The shaft of the new
motor was too large for the old crank, so I used a rat tail file on the old one
for the right fit. This took about 20 minutes. I also use the 12v heater motor
from an early 60s F100. I enlarged the 54 heater fan from 1/4 to 5/16 shaft size
to fit the new motor; the wiring is the same. I use the full gauge set from a 55
F800. Since the gauges looked the same as those used in early 60s F100s, I used
the IVR from one of the later trucks to adapt my 6v gauges to 12v; the gauges
work fine.


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:06:28 -0000
From: "Piegat, Tim"
Subject: 54 F100 handling

Phatstang wrote awhile back about F100 handling so I thought he'd be amused
with this little story. When I worked in Denver, I used to take Deer Creek
Canyon Road to my home in the mountains, which is a very twisty,
switchbacked, narrow road. The first part of my trip home was on a highway,
and modern drivers were pretty impatient with me because I cruise at 55 mph
(3.92 gears). One night, after I turned off the highway onto the mountain
road, a small Japanese car was impatiently following and trying to pass. I
figured I'd see how his handling stacked up with my 54 F100. I determined
that I would drive no slower than 35 mph except on two switchbacks, and if
he could get around, more power to him. I apexed every turn perfectly that
night, and my arms were pretty tired from sawing the wheel back and forth.
Several times I saw his headlights swing 'way wide as he misjudged a turn
and had to practically stop. He caught up a little on the straightaways, but
never enough to pass. After 10 or so miles, he wasn't even close (1/4 mile).
As long as the speed is below 35 or 40, the old Ford will set up a line in a
curve and stick pretty well. "Monkey Motion" front ends get the wheels at
all kinds of crazy angles when a rig rolls in the curves and don't seem to
do so well at times. I'm not sure what all of this means, after all, it
wasn't an NSX or a Ferrari, but I was pretty smug about it.


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 20:30:47 EDT
From: Fordf3
Subject: Re: Radio for '48 to '51 F Series

I have always been told those radios were very rare because people did not put
radios in their trucks. i am interested in one also


Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:57:15 -0400
From: Cathy Greenlaw
Subject: Re: Stroker question somewhat answered

Doug Mclaughlin wrote:

> I have a 75 460
> the torque increase that I can get by stroking the motor.
> I am thinking of having the heads shaved to increase compression and
> installing a high lift,long duration cam to further increase torque. What kind
> of cam would be best? Would swapping heads from a 428 be a better idea? What
> do I need to have done to the C6 Should I find 1-ton driveshafts to replace
> the stock 1\2 tons? wonder if the front Dana 44 is strong enough.going under a
> 56 f100. Everyone has lowered or restored Effies, I wanted to be different

The old saying "there is no substitute for cubic inches except more cubic
inches" is pretty much true, but stroking, as opposed to boring, will definitely
increase the grunt. Sure mill the heads, compression always good, but keep in
mind high octane lead free is only good for about 10:1, and marginal at that.
Compression will also increase, all else being equal, with the stroker kit due
to the change in the swept area of the piston Try to get flat tops that come
within .040" of the head at TDC. This improves turbulence and helps prevent
knock (detonation). Forget the 428 heads as they won't fit as Don said. 429
heads will fit, but they are rare and no advantage for you. Don't put in a long
duration cam, it may sound nice with the lopy idle, but bottom end torque goes
to Pontiac heaven, what you want is a so called "RV" or towing cam. Don't put in
a single plane manifold or a high rise dual plane, torque is best built with
smaller runners and high velocity flow in a low rise dual plane. Headers are
also good, for a high torque motor you want long tubes, and definitely a
balance pipe, about 15 to 18" after the collectors. I think the C-6, with a
shift imp rover kit will give you good service without problem if its in good
shape now. My guess is 1/2 ton shafts are OK unless you plan to stadium race it,
I won't venture to guess about the Dana having no experience with them.

47 Fred


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 16:16:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: Burke Wills
Subject: "51 fenders

Does anybody out there have rear fenders and sides of the box for a
'51 ford F1? I'd appreciate it.



Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 18:32:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott
Subject: Re: "51 fenders

- ---Burke Wills wrote:
> Does anybody out there have rear fenders and sides of the box for a
> '51 ford F1? I'd appreciate it.
We are getting new fiber glass ones for our 52 so the old ones are for

1952 Ford Pickup
Please take a look at my 1952 Ford Pickup Page:


Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:09:32 -0700
From: jc & terry
Subject: old lincoln

My dad doesn't seem too hot on the
idea though because he thinks that it wouldn't be worth it, can you
guys give me some excues? Oh yea, the body is in great shape, not
dents or crap but it is rusting in the lower fenders but that's it.
And it's fully loaded, how many horse would it have stock? I need
this car.
Thanks, Scott
i don't know what yur dad thinks is worth something but engine tranny and
rear end of this type cannot be had for under 2 k if yur out buying stuff
provided it does not need rebuilding. if you read fred's letter he told you
what you will be up against in a later model. this car has a solid
foundation and virtually all the parts you nned in one package. yur gonna
save 2 years just in running around to find stuff and trying to make it fit.
the body has rust(23 years of it) so dump it after you get all the good
parts. you can probably even get a couple of bucks at the scrapper for
what's left. then find one of those old solid ford bodies and go to work.
get it running and add the other stuff while you drive. another thought is
people very rarely beat lincolns to death. these were not known for hp
because of the gas crunch of the time and the auto indsutry was in a big
rush to give us overpriced garbage and blame the 2000 % increase in price on
the govt. well a few of us didn't fall for it. which side are you on?
T-bird Terry


Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:39:14 -0700
From: jc & terry
Subject: clevelands and chevy motors

47 Fred

PS: what do you want to know about Cleveland motors Mr. Fox? Did you
ever consider why there are so many Chevy powered rides, is that no one
throws away a Ford 'till it's well worn out? Perhaps that thought is
disagreeable enough.

fella asked the other night about the differences between a 351 c and the
351 w+m . since i consider you to be very knowledgeable about the ford
motors i was requesting you give him the run down. as far as the reason
behind so many chevy powered rides, the one you came up with, although a
sentimental favorite no doubt, holds little water in the face of all this
flathead talk. flathead, hemi head, semi hemi head, wedge head, eliptcal
head. all are powerful mills of choice. everyone produced by all of the big
3 at one time or another. if you think yur motor is superior because of the
letters on the valve cover i'll be the first to admit that it's useless to
argue with that kind of logic.
T-bird Terry


Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:49:18 -0400
From: Ray Cardogno
Subject: Alternator tickler

>Subject: Re: Alternator
>>Now, does anyone know why my alternator on my 83 302 won't kick in until
>>I rev the motor a bit, say 2000 rpm. After I do that it kicks in and
>>stays on and charges the battery fine, until I shut it down, then I have
>>to rev it again to get it back on. I changed the voltage regulator and
>>checked the wires, seems OK.

I can't speak with total authority on that particular alternator, but you
>might not have a problem. Back when I still had my flathead I put a GM 1
>wire alternator on it and to excite the thing (i.e. make it start charging)
>you had to rev it to 2000 rpm. It wasn't a quirk or anything, that's just
>what you had to do--it was designed that way.

>If you feel bold, and have no fear, take the alternator apart and check the
>brushes, there's a good chance they are worn and sticking, especially if the
>alternator is origional. It's realy not a bad job unless the 3 body bolts
>are frozen and break.

I also have a couple of pennies worth of input on this one. Some
alternators have more than 1 wire so that a wire can be used to excite the
field when the ignition is turned on. If a 1 wire alternator had a
battery-excited field, that circut would constantly be draining the battery
when the motor is off because the wire goes directly to the battery.
Therefore the field of a one-wire alt has to be excited like Dan said
electromagnetically by spinning the winding past a permanant magnet. I bet
that's what your seeing at 2-G's.

Ray C.


Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 00:46:30 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: ADMIN: Free web space

And now the moment we've all been waiting for...
The free web space script is now working! Those who are
interested in having free web space for a Ford truck related
web site can now have up to 300k of free space on the domain.

300k doesn't sound like much but it is when you consider that
an 85% quality 640x480 JPG picture is about 40k in size and the
average html file is under 5k then you'll see that you can put
quite a bit on it. Besides, I have to limit the space so more
people can get a site.

In order to get this free space, the following is required:

1. Your desired site name. This will appear as

2. Your desired password. Think it through and make sure you
don't forget it as it will be a hassle to change it.

3. Somewhere on the site, a link to the main page:
In return, we will provide a link to your page.

4. Your site must be non-commercial. I didn't put in all this
time and effort to give away free space to businesses - this
is for the owners/hobbyists on the list. Arrangements for
businesses may be possible, I'm still considering it and
haven't made up my mind.

5. A description of the site. Keep it short. I need this for
the return link. Make sure your main page on your site is
called index.html or index.htm

6. It has to be under 300k. Our access script will enforce this.
It will not be possible to exceed this limit by 1 byte. Keep
this in mind when you design your page. You may want to keep
clipart or other items on a different server and link to them.

Site upload instructions and confirmations will be sent via email
starting this weekend (I may not be able to get them all done in
one weekend). Everything is handled through a user friendly web
interface with password protection. Included will be a free hit
counter and instructions on its use.

Ken Payne
CoAdmin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts


Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 00:49:38 -0400
From: Ken Payne
Subject: ADMIN: Free web space

Almost forgot...

send requests to:

If you send it to the list everyone will see your

Ken Payne
CoAdmin, Ford Truck Enthusiasts


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