Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 15:22:21 -0400 (EDT)
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Subject: fordtrucks-digest Digest V97 #92
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fordtrucks-digest Digest Volume 97 : Issue 92

Today's Topics:

Amp light in console [ ]
Re: Getting better gas mileage PCV ( [ ]
Re: 454 in an Econoline????? [ ]
Re: rear axle ratio,last resort mrth [ ]
Motor Up, kindler, gentler listserv ["Erik J. O'Daniel"
56 F100 power steering ["Erik J. O'Daniel"
Re: MAP woes [JIM HURD ]
Re: He-Man Apology ["Harry Jennings"
RE: F150 Hesitation ?? [Phil Conrad
Re: PCV ["Harry Jennings"
Re: Slick 50? [Mike Schwall ] [ ]
Re: Getting better gas mileage PCV ( [Gardner ]
Re: Slick 50 [Don Grossman ]
Unidentified subject! [ (Douglas Minnick, T]


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Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 10:09:59 -0400
Subject: Amp light in console
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Ok Tony try a few of these....

1). Check belt tension as mentioned before Possible but unlikely
2). At night ( obviously the best time to see the bulb ) Start with no
accessory load just the motor running do you see the light yes or no,
Next start loading the system with accessorys one at a time A/C blower
on low step to speed and so on to high, then headlights ect.. while
doing this observe the light dose it increase in illumination with each
step ? If it dose your fighting an alt or voltage reg problem. More than
likley a diode in the alt. is decaying under load this should be tested
by your dealership since you still have a warrenty.

Should the light stay the same, or only light when one specific
accessory is turned on you could very possibly be chasing a bad ground
in that specific accessory, A bad ground will back feed looking for a
better ground an can cause your problem. again with still having a
warrenty stand on your soap box and bitch till it's fixed, this will
save you from pulling out your hair. If you can't get satifaction from
the dealer E-mail me at and I'll step you throug it.
good luck


Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 10:22:32 -0400
Subject: Re: Getting better gas mileage PCV (The Right Stuff!)
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Holly &*%$#! Gentlemen, I'm sorry I asked !!!! did'nt mean to start
this type of FLAME Consider the subject closed

Have a Great Day......


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 08:01:50 -0700
Subject: Re: 454 in an Econoline?????
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>Date: Sun, 4 May 1997 22:40:50 -0500 (CDT)
>From: John Strauss
>Subject: 454 in an Econoline?????
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>I could very well be wrong, but I don't think Ford put a 351M in any E-150,
>>250, or 350 Vans in 1978. Small block 302 and 351W. Large block, what, a
>Arrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!! A 454 is a CHEVY damnit!!! I am
>losing my mind and my patience with you people! 460. 460. 460. 460.
>460. 460!
>OK, rant over. Happy, happy. Joy, joy.

A Ch*vy? No,no, haven't You been paying attention?... A 454 is an FE.
You take a FE427 and bore it +.010 (4.260")
Use a FE428 crank (3.98") = 454cid FE.
ch*vy, jeez, wazza matter with You people? (-:

Happy motoring,

Steve Delanty (


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 08:27:13 -0700
Subject: Re: rear axle ratio,last resort mrthod
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>Sorry I missed the beginning of the thread but I just joined the list.
>Would you put the chalk mark on the edge of tire or rim?

Yes, on the tire or the rim..
Near the edge of the tire, where it lines up with the edge of a fender or
some stationary location is good. Make the driveshaft mark line up with some
stationary referance as well. With both rear wheels slightly off the ground
and the vehicle
firmly supported, turn the driveshaft round and round til the wheel mark
comes back to it's origional spot. How many rotations did the driveshaft take?
3-1/2? (3.50) 4-1/8? (4.125) etc.
The trick is that both wheels must turn the same amount. Usually they will
wanna do this anyway, but sometimes they don't cooporate. Chalk mark both
wheels if necessary. With tracloc rear ends it's not a problem.. (-:

Happy motoring,

Steve Delanty (


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 09:53:16 +0000
From: "Erik J. O'Daniel"
Subject: Motor Up, kindler, gentler listserv

With all this talk of Slick 50 I have to jump in and ask about tha
Motor-Up stuff . Someone gave me a bottle but I've been very
hesitant about putting it into my 56F100. Any help? (And no
arguments about this, please!)

Also: I've noticed a certain trend toward macho, bullshit, "I know
more than you do", crap in the past ten digests or so, especially
with regard to PCV valves. I also subscribe to a hunting listserv
and can tell you that weeding out all the arguments that continue
ad nauseum gets boring. (.270! No, 30-06!, No, .270 you jerkoff...)

I was holding my tongue until I saw someone refer to another person
as a "dumbass."

Ken, don't know if you care and I don't know the solution, but just
wanted to express my "been there, read that, hated it" opinion. Let's
not ruin a good thing guys!

Erik O'Daniel
Boise, Idaho


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 09:53:16 +0000
From: "Erik J. O'Daniel"
Subject: 56 F100 power steering

What are my chances of finding the right stuff to convert my 56F100
to power steering? I had a 73 CJ-5 a while ago that I almost did
this to, so I know what'd be required partswise. I'm just not
certain where I'd find steering boxes and pumps and brackets,

I've got a later-year 292 and don't even know if it has propoer
places to mount brackets for the pump.

Any done this?

Erik O'Daniel
Boise, Idaho


Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 12:05:22 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: MAP woes
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(Sorry - being an old timer, I am not up on the "hooped" terminology.)

Sounds like you are on the right track. The 172 code indicates a lack
of Oxygen Sensor switches/lean. Your '94 probably has a heated O2 (HEGO).
You may have a faulty heater element. It should show 2 to 5 ohms at room
temperature between the power and ground connections of the HEGO. I would
first sheck out your theory about the fuel filter though, considering you
put some of that American gas in it.

Difference between the code 172 while engine running and continuous memory
is one is happening right now, while the other did happen. I believe that
if you set a continuous memory code on your '94 and the condicition isn't
seen by the EEC again after 80 start cycles, the EEC will clear it from
continuous memory.

Other possibilities *could* be a vacuum leak that the EEC/injectors can't
compensate for, or possible an exhaust leak that is letting some oxygen
into the exhaust ahead of the HEGO. (No matter how rich the EEC sends the
injectors, if oxygen is leaking into the exhaust, the HEGO will always read

Keep us (me) posted on where you find the solution.

Jim in Central NY
'79 F-150 (302!)
'92 Topaz (3.0l)


Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 09:36:44 PDT
From: "Harry Jennings"
Subject: Re: He-Man Apology
Content-Type: text/plain

First things first: I apologize for any rude comments I made!

I have no excuse!!

It is just that I normaly read and no not respond. A while back, though, someone
asked if it was normal for their 351M to be getting 8MPG. Many people responded
by saying that is normal.

I just couldn't take it!
I put a used 351M/C6 into my '71 F-100 and got an average of 17MPG. Again, that
is average (I drive alot in town). The best I have ever got on the highway was
21MPG. This was a mostly stock engine with 80,000mi. When I rebuilt the engine
and I performed some other mod's the mileage got even better.

What got me was when people would tell me I was wrong!?! Where do they get off
telling me what kind of mileage *my* truck gets. Basically I just kept the thing
well tuned.

After the rebuild I performed several mod's which helped mileage AND power. A
few people said some of the things I mentioned would not work.

I just do not understand how they can sit there and say "I have never tried
that, but it will not work".
I HAVE tried them and they DO work. (Well, OK, Slick50 didn't show any
improvements in my truck. I just mentioned it in because I have ran it in my
truck). If a had never tried it or did try it and it did not work then why would
I tell others about it?

Again, Sorry for pounding my chest.


>From Mon May 5 00:41:25 1997
>Received: (from loflocalhost) by (8.8.5/8.6.9) id DAA00443; Mon,
5 May 1997 03:38:01 -0400 (EDT)
>X-Authentication-Warning: lof set sender to using -f
>From: "Jim"
>Subject: Re: Slick 50
>Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 00:39:52 -0700
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>Hi Harry! Where have you been?
>>Fram would not have the
>> DuraGuard filter (which has PTFE in it). Why would they
>put something in their
>> filters that could cause failure? That would be asking to
>be sued!
>Your darn straight on that Harry! I'm sorry to say, I'm not
>quite up to date on this. What is PTFE (460 in a boat for
>all I know)?
>>It doesn't *add* anything to the metal. It allows the parts
>to produce a superfine
>> finish.
>Is this a bad thing?
>Again, I only mentioned these things because people asked me
>how I averaged 17
>MPG with a 351M/C6.
>What happened? I thought you were getting 21mpg. You'd
>better check your vacuum lines. Well got to go. Just wanted
>to ask where you been! Take it easy!
>Jim Strigas
>"73" Ford F100 (Daily driver. Getting better every day.)
>"83" Yamaha XJ900RK (Best Gift of my life! From my best
>friends! RSCL)
>"86" Honda GoldWing GL1200 (OK, this part goes here, and
>this... this... I think goes on the
>"77" Buick EstateWagon (Beast of Immense Magnitude!)
>These are "The Good Old Days"!
> Be Cool Daddy-O B-)>
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Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 09:36:01 -0700
From: Phil Conrad
To: "''"
Subject: RE: F150 Hesitation ??
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Well, first let me clarify one point. I am not a mechanic nor do I =
understand what "codes" are. I guess this is something that has to do =
with the computer read out or diagnostic check or something. I do have =
access to someone with this instrumentation but what I would like to do =
is try and fix the problem myself. I have the mechanical know how, if =
I could just identify the problem then I could swap out the part in =

With this type of problem is this possible ?

Also, what does EGR stand for.


Phil Conrad

Sent: Friday, May 02, 1997 5:35 PM
Subject: Re: F150 Hesitation ??

Phil Conrad,
Are you getting any codes with the KOEO, continuous codes, or
dynamic response codes?

Jim in Central NY
'79 F-150 (302!)
'92 Topaz (3.0l)

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Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 09:50:44 PDT
From: "Harry Jennings"
Subject: Re: PCV
Content-Type: text/plain

>>> it vents them into the carb. By fremoving this line to the carb and plugging
>>> hole you will gain MPG and power.
>>> >>
> Not to put too fine a point on it, but that's cra... I don't agree.

Oh, I see. Since you do not agree then it must be crap!?

> Unless your rings or valve stem seals are completely shot, there would be no
>perceptible, or even measurable, increase in power or MPG from disconnecting
>the PCV system.

I have a rebuilt engine. After 1200mi I datached the PCV valve and
noticedimprovements in power & MPG. I helped a friend do this to the rebuilt
289(after about 1500mi) in his '68 Fastback. He too, noticed a BIG improvements!

> Additionally, if you simply remove the vacuum supplied by
>the intake manifold (not the carb) to the PCV, you'll build up
>greater-than-intended pressure in the crankcase, jeopardizing all gaskets and
>seals which keep such pressure (and oil) in the crankcase.

WRONG! On both of the above mentioned cars the PCV line went the the base of the
There are about 25,000mi on the 289 and close to 80,000mi on my 351M and NO OIL
LEAKS or any other problems.
Since the vents are left open there is no excess pressure.
>lus, dumping these gases into the carb is like hokking your carb up to the tail
pipe. (don't jump I me for sayiny that. What I maen is that the gases vented out
by the PCV valve do NOT promote good combustion, like exhaust gases.)

> The PCV system
>does, in fact, 'suck out gases,' when the combination of crankcase pressure
>and intake manifold vacuum reach the levels designed into your particular
> What you will increase is emissions. This isn't a good thing to do, and
>the PCV system is basically a free emission control system, unlike air pumps
>and the like.
> Make sure the PCV valve is operating correctly (take it out, shake it, if
>it rattles it's probably ok), clean the little filter described above which
>allow air into the crankcase, and don't give any further thought.

> Just read add'l posts on the subject. This 'agree to disagree' concept is
also, crap.

Again, I guess it is crap if you do not agree! (What a putz!).

>Experience with one vehicle (or several) is not a valid sample,
>and should be viewed as only one person's limited experience.

Then how would you test something? Flip a coin? I do things and see how they
turn out! If it causes problems I would not tell others to do it (Duh!).

> If you think disconnecting the PCV system resulted in greater power and/or
mileage, yourtest methodology is flawed.

Oh, although it works my method is flawed?! I see. Rather than DO something and
see how it turns out you relay on the 1-900-future calls. Now there is a
*correct* methodology!

> And watch the 'college student' cracks, these
>young pups know more than we were ever taught, or have learned since.

This was NOT a *College Crack*! The reason I asked if he was a college
is because his Email has 'EDU' in it. This is common on Email sent from
I was going to ask him which college he goes to since I, too, am a
college student.
I got my two year degree in '94. I have worked as a police officer since. I am
now going back to school part-time to get my four year degree (I hope to work
for the FBI in few years.).

Iguess you were right about one thing. Us college students DO know more than you
were ever taught, of have learned since.!!!!!!!!


>The ONLY reason I mentioned the thing about the PCV valve is becuase I said my
>truck ('71 F-100 longbed w/ a '77 351M/C6) get an average of 17MPG and someone
>asked me what I have done to it to get that milage.
>>>Message distributed via
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Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 11:53:03 -0500
From: Mike Schwall
Subject: Re: Slick 50?
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 10:40 PM 5/4/97 -0500, you wrote:
>> g)Add Slick50 or Rislone to your engine.
>God, please DO NOT do this to your engine. If anyone is interested I can
>post a) my own personal experience with this CRAP and b) a study document
>that will explain why you should RUN from Slick50 and their ilk (it's pretty
>big so I don't want to post this unless y'all are really interested).

I'd like a copy of this document.




Home Page:
Ford Page:


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 10:07:58 -0700
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>> FE's forever...
>> Steve Delanty (

>All the wiring BS and rigging, Why? Mallory makes a magnetic pickup
>distributor with vacuum advance for about 125.00 brand new with 5 year
>warrantee and it requires nothing but a stock coil and a hot wire

What BS and rigging? The duraspark requires nothing but a stock coil and a
hot wire.
plus it has the cranking retard wire if You wanna use it. (white wire) It
gives about 6-8 degrees of retard during cranking.

It's all stock stuff, slit the tape and snip the wires as long as possible
at the wreckers, it took me about 10 minutes to extract mine; distributor,
blk box, harness and all.
It takes maybe 30 more minutes at home to install it. Mount the box
somewhere on the fender. There's only 2 wires that actually connect to the
One of these (the start/retard wire) can be ignored if You like...
All the interconnect between box, coil and distributor uses factory connectors.
It all just plugs together with it's own built in harness.
Just changing the distributor and timing it again takes longer than the
electrical install. It's exceedingly simple.

I gave up $15 at the wreckers for the dist, box, harness, etc.
I gave up another $40 at the parts house for a rebuilt duraspark distributor.

That's $55 dollars for the complete system.
That $70 savings over the Mallory sold me. That's a lot of lunch money for
some of us.

Also, if something "bad" ever happens to the electronics a new duraspark
black box can be obtained same day at nearly any auto parts store or wrecker
across America.
Less options with the Mallory. "Stock" can be nice.
I also rather prefer "stock appearing".

Sure the mallory is a nice distributor, but the duraspark setup is accurate,
*cheap*, and doesn't require much effort to install.
So why not?
I stood in line longer at Stupid Shops just trying to get a price for a FE
mallory distributor than it took to actually install my setup... )-:

Steve Delanty (


Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 13:56:38 -0500
From: Gardner
Subject: Re: Getting better gas mileage PCV (The Right Stuff!)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit wrote:
> Holly &*%$#! Gentlemen, I'm sorry I asked !!!! did'nt mean to start
> this type of FLAME Consider the subject closed
> Have a Great Day......
> ____________________________________________________________________
> Message distributed via
> For help send mail with subject "HELP"
> Comments and suggestions are welcome, use: kpaynemindspring.comOne more final note...I get about 30 mpg in my ranger if I driver it
conservately, yes it is a four cylinder but I don't use my truck for
work and this is mostly city driving


Date: Mon, 05 May 1997 10:14:18 +0000
From: Don Grossman
Subject: Re: Slick 50
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Any thoughts about PowerPunch?
Don Grossman

It's hard to do 90 on a speed limit budget.......

65 Ford F-150 4x4 (soon to be 72 Mustang)
63 Ford F-250 4x4


Date: Mon, 5 May 1997 14:26:20 -0500
From: (Douglas Minnick, Television Engr. WD4BSB)
Subject: Unidentified subject!
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Holly 1850-2 squair bore, any idia of cfm and application? I have two and
would like to install one on a 351w smogger (1980) w/automatic. whatda

I have inquired on Holly home page, got no thanks in advance

Douglas Minnick, WD4BSB
Television Engineer
Va Tech University
204 Saunders Hall
Blacksburg, Va.

End of fordtrucks-digest Digest V97 Issue #92
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