Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 00:38:57 -0600 (MDT)
From: (fordtrucks80up-digest)
Subject: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #132

fordtrucks80up-digest Friday, September 26 1997 Volume 01 : Number 132

Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 And Newer Trucks Digest
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email to the same address with the word "help" in the body of the
In this issue:

Fast Idle Problem [Robert Hackney ]
'86 Bronco II [Pete Wilhite ]
Re: Mass Air conversion ["Stephen M. Brown"
Re: Ford F-150 Mileage, Cold Start Problem, and Misc. ["David J. Baldwin"]
Re: Fast Idle Problem ["John D. Bowne" ]
F-series for snow plowing? [Kent Premo ]
RE: F-series for snow plowing? [Ron Madurski ]
RE: Ford Winch Systems [ (quadrai)]
Re: Ford F-150 Mileage, Cold Start Problem, and Misc. ["S. Spaulding"
Re: Tire Question [Jerad Heffner ]
Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #130 ["Lare/Eric" ]
web site -- links or other lists [Edward A Arkin ]
F150 shocks [Al Spangler ]



Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 07:31:03 -0400
From: Robert Hackney
Subject: Fast Idle Problem

>From: Richard Vaughan

>I have a 1990 F250, 4X4, 5.8 motor with 33K miles. The rig is stock
>except for a cat back Flowmaster. The truck starts easily and runs
>great. However, it does have an intermitent problem with the engine
>idle. Most of the time it is OK. Sometimes it will idle at 1500 RPM,
>or higher. It will not slow down even if I rev the engine and then
>back off the throttle. If I shut the motor off and immediately
>restart it the idle returns to normal. (about 800 RPM in neutral). The
>problem occurs randomly after the motor is warmed up. I'm stumped. Any
>ideas? I would appreciate any and all advice. Thank you in advance for
>your help.


I had the same problem, it turned out to be the throttle position sensor (TPS)
Most of the time it won't set any codes in the computer except an occasional
'Can"t control low band rpm' or something to that effect.

Good luck,


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 07:27:46 -0700
From: Pete Wilhite
Subject: '86 Bronco II

I have an '86 Bronco II 2.9L V6 with a Fuel injection problem. At all
engine rpm(s) it surges 200-300 rpm. Have not had time to look at anything
other than fuel pressure and clean the T-body. I also looked for vacume
leaks with a can of carb cleaner, no success. Has anyone ran into this?
Please respond with any ideas, I would appreciate it.

Thanks, -Pete

Pete Wilhite

Office: W170G2
(619) 651-0546
pager: (619) 636-8398


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 09:47:42 -0500
From: "Stephen M. Brown"
Subject: Re: Mass Air conversion

> From:
> Subject: Re: Mass Air conversion
> while. Everytime I call Motorsport tech line, they say, "Nope, still
> delivering that thing."
> >>
> Even though they have this in the SVO catalog?

Yup, call em yourself...the tech line for SVO (# is in the catalog). Those
guys have told me multiple times that it isn't available.

> I've been doing business with an authorized Ford Motorsport dealer who
> to wait until October to go the next round; this Lightning Mass Air and
> cam. I wonder if they're just stalling because the part isn't ready yet!

Could be.

> The more I read about the Ford EEC-IV, oxygen sensors, Mass Air, and
> Density the more confused I get about why we should convert to Mass Air.

Just depends on what you want. Speed density can only adjust (EEC-IV is learns & adjusts) so far. A cam will throw it outta whack by
changing your engine characteristics beyond it's built in data. Intakes,
headers, heads, cat-back....those are OK, they aren't as agressive as a cam

> Especially after my dealer told me I'd be street legal after so many
> to my engine -- and you're not helping with your super charger. Doesn't
> this change the "air pump" characteristics to the point where the
> needs to be reprogrammed? And isn't the point to have Mass Air so that
> eliminates the air pump characteristic from the equation?

My supercharger has a little doo-dad that has to fool the computer.
Various pieces of equipment are expecting a vacuum reading ALWAYS. With
the supercharger, I've got a boost pressure reading >0 under heavy
throttle. The doo-dad (Vacuum-Solenoid assembly) changes the boost
reading, so it never sees the boost. The line to the MAP sensor has a
bleed off valve that blows off anything above 0. Also, because Mr. Engine
needs more fuel when it gets more air (boost), ALL supercharger kits come
with a Fuel Management Unit which reads boost & shuts off the fuel return
line (fuel rail to tank), increasing available pressure. I can watch my
fuel pressure gauge (45 psi at cruise) jump to 80-85 psi under boost.

Pros/Cons of Mass Air (from my own reading...not gospel):

SD is faster, MA has to sample (read air flow), then adjust.
SD has fewer restrictions is inlet, MA has meter that interferes with flow
MA is MUCH more flexible, SD requires look-up tables of data.
If SD can be reprogrammed (C&M CALIBRATOR), it is ideal. If it cannot,
Mass Air is better for mods like cams & major porting.
SD requires workarounds for superchargers. MA does not (except Fuel
Management Unit).

Conclusion: With a supercharger (street legal at 6psi boost), I avoid the
switch to mass air & probably get the same hp increase for the same/less

> Take care,
> - -David :-)

good luck


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 10:16:59 -0500
From: "David J. Baldwin"
Subject: Re: Ford F-150 Mileage, Cold Start Problem, and Misc.

Shawn & Jennifer Clark wrote:
> Lump me in with the crowd of F-150 owners with lousy mileage. I'm
> averaging about 13 mpg city and highway (including a long trip with several
> fills--13.3 mpg consistently.) The truck is a '91 with Supercab, 302, and
> the E4OD transmission

I have the same, except a 95 model. Just calculated milage this morning
with a mix of about 80% highway / 20% city driving: 15.6 MPG. It's been
hot here, so that was running the AC all the time. I stomp on it a lot,
too, so it's not like I'm trying to wean it or set any records.

Two things bother me about what you wrote (below):

> 2. Exhaust
> manifold is cracked completely in two behind the last cylinder on the
> passenger side. Looks like poor, cantilevered design. It seals up within
> a few seconds of starting.
> 5. I keep losing coolant out of the reservoir, slow process, have never
> caught it bubbling or anything like that although I keep trying.

These are classic signs of past overheating. Your previous
"Neanderthal" may have run it dry and the overheating cracked the
exhaust manifold--and perhaps a head, too, causing you to lose coolant
internally. If you're losing coolant, and it isn't leaking out, you're
probably burning it.

If you're burning it, and it's a slow consumption, try comparing your
plugs. I had a slow consumption problem that turned out to be a head
gasket. The cylinder where the leak was had black powdery dry carbon
dust deposits on it. These deposits fouled the plug, causing rough
running (especially when cold). Milage also took a dive. Just look for
differences of any type between the plugs.

Good luck. Keep us posted.
- --
Best Regards,

Dave Baldwin
Dallas, TX
- --------------------------------------------------------------


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 10:08:31 -0700
From: "John D. Bowne"
Subject: Re: Fast Idle Problem

>>From: Richard Vaughan
>>Subject: Fast Idle

I have basically the same truck with the same engine and miles, at about
30K I had a similar problem, that stumped all of the shops, including about
3 dealers. Eventually, I rigged up my DVM (Digital Multimeter) to the
output of the TPS sensor and found that during the higher idle periods, the
output was elevated. It is supposed to be a bit below 1.0 volt. Mine was
going to about 1.3 at times.

I was told by one of the dealers that the TPS can cause the 'idle' to go to
about 4K in the worst possible case.

Replacing the TPS with one from a local auto parts store completely fixed
the problem. It cost about $30 bucks and took about an hour to fix.

Good Luck,


John D. Bowne - Cornelius, OR
| Stolen .Sig Line: |
| "Salad is not food. Salad is what food eats" |
| Corollary : |
| "If animals weren't meant to be eaten, |
| they wouldn't be made out of meat." |
| 2 Wheeled Toys 4 Wheeled Toys |
| '89 BMW K100RS '93 BMW 325i |
| '81 Honda XR250R '90 Ford F250 4x4 |
| '86 Yamaha Moto 4 |


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 13:08:09 -0500
From: Kent Premo
Subject: F-series for snow plowing?

Hi folks,

I just discovered this newsgroup, and thought I'd ask for opinions about
our next purchase.

My wife and I are considering a new Ford F-series truck for our next
vehicle. We live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. so we know snow. We
expect, in a few years, to need a truck for personal snowplowing, possibly
a substantial length of driveway (1 mile!). We're already committed to
automatic trans and supercab.

Should we expect the Ford to be our snowplow truck? I know, for instance,
they don't allow a snow plow prep package on a supercab.

If so, should we get:
1. 4.6 L or 5.4 L V8? (assuming 5.4)
2. 150 or 250? (assuming 250 or at least 150 with off-road package)
3. if 250, 1998 Light Duty, or newly styled 1998 Heavy Duty 250 (March
98?), or older styled 250 HD, if available?

Can we expect a reasonably proficient Ford dealer in snow country to be
able to retrofit a supercab for snow plow receiver, with sufficient

I'd really appreciate some ideas from people with Ford experience.



Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 15:01:48 -0500
From: Ron Madurski
Subject: RE: F-series for snow plowing?

- -----Original Message-----
From: Kent Premo []
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 1997 1:08 PM
Subject: F-series for snow plowing?

Hi folks,

I just discovered this newsgroup, and thought I'd ask for opinions about
our next purchase.

Welcome aboard.. I just got here as well. Seems to be lots of good info.

My wife and I are considering a new Ford F-series truck for our next
vehicle. We live in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. so we know snow. We
expect, in a few years, to need a truck for personal snowplowing, possibly
a substantial length of driveway (1 mile!). We're already committed to
automatic trans and supercab.

Have you ever seen what snow plowing does to a trucks frame? Buckling,
stress cracks, sheared bolts on the cross members... I would not get
anything less than a 3/4 ton for plowing and definitely 4wd if you are
plowing in a straight line like a driveway. A diesel would have some
advantages for plowing the snow but the extra weight might make it less
desirable if you are going to be running through mud also. I think the
auto trans might be a mistake. I have always had better luck rocking out
of snow with a manual. I'm not sure why you can't get a plow on a supercab
but I'd be willing to bet it's because it would flex and buckle too much.

Should we expect the Ford to be our snowplow truck? I know, for instance,
they don't allow a snow plow prep package on a supercab.

I think you'd be better off with a nice pickup (you did say it was going
to be a new one right) and get a small to medium sized tractor to do the

Attachment Converted: "C:\Internet\DOWNLOAD\WINMAIL2.DAT"


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 13:47:48 -0700
From: (quadrai)
Subject: RE: Ford Winch Systems

I recently purchased a 1994 Ford F150 (300) 6 cyl. 4x4. I want to install a
front winch. After much research, it seems that electric winch systems are
only for very limited applications where PTO or hydraulic winches can be
depended upon for more applications. The real rub for PTO winches is setting
up the drive linkage around the front axle drive in a 4X4. Also, you have to
make your own bumper system. The Hydraulic winches seem to have the best of
all worlds, but may be very costly operation. I want to adapt the attractive
electric winch bumper systems, such as, the F150 wrap around w/ Bush Guard
normall y designed for electric winches.

Need input ????



Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 19:00:26 -0700
From: "S. Spaulding"
Subject: Re: Ford F-150 Mileage, Cold Start Problem, and Misc.


I also have a '91 F150 with a 302 (regular cab, 4x4, M5OD). The broken
exhaust manifolds are a very common problem. Even the dealer parts
counters admit this. Eventually, it will not seal when hot. Mine came
off in two pieces, and I replaced them with shorty headers. Rotted out
oil pans are also very common (right over the crossover pipe).

I found coolant seeping very slowly into the crankcase. The only reason
I found it was because the engine sat for several days, and I went to
drain the rotted oil pan to put on a new one. As I loosened the drain
plug, a small stream of bright green coolant came out ahead of the oil.

When I disassembled it, it appeared to be coming from the intake
manifold gaskets. I replaced the head gaskets, too, because I was
almost there once I had the intake and exhaust manifolds off. The
timing chain was very loose, so I replaced it and the oil pump.

My mileage is around 14. It drops to as low as 11 on high speed trips
(not very aerodynamic...). I have headers and a cat-back system.

Good luck with yours,
Steve S.


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 17:07:54 -0500
From: Jerad Heffner
Subject: Re: Tire Question

Great!! I have the BFG A/Ts too, and I love them. They're the smallest size
made for them 215-75R-15, but on my stock-height '84 Ranger (with the 4-cyl)
they look great. I wanted bigger, with the likely possibility of a lift, but
I'd get a new engine in it first. (V8 Arr arr arr!) Stock rims too, was gonna
get new ones, but were too expensive for the ones I wanted. I'm only 17, you
see, and I have a girlfriend, and anyone who has one (or a wife) can probably
attest to the fact that money doesn't last long. Oh well, I can't wait to try
out the tires this winter.

What size you gettin?

Jerad wrote:

> In a message dated 97-09-23 08:27:36 EDT, you write:
> have a
> Tall Tire Pros & Cons: what works - what doesn't when you run big meats.
> PLus,
> all-terrain vs mud tread AND wheel sizing secrets. It also talks about
> whell
> backsapcing tips and has a good comparo between BFG tires (All-terrain, Mud
> Terrain, Trail, Baja, and Sport) . Anyway, check it out if you can.
> Jerad Heffner
> '84 Ranger 4x4
> wrote:
> > A bit of a tire question I am looking for tires for my 1995 F150 4X2 and
> am
> > looking to get the widest and biggest tires I can have I do not have a
> lift
> > or anything special like that I was thinking about some 31X12.5 or so how
> > does that sound some feedback would be nice
> > Thanks
> >>
> Excellent articles, Jerad! I think my next set will be the BFG All
> Terrain's.
> Personal experience with 31x10.5" on factory 7.5" wheels on my stock
> suspension '92 F150 4x4 is that they would rub the radius arms at full
> steering lock. Aftermarket 8" wheels cured the problem; just went with the
> normal backspacing. Now I've got 30x9.5" snow tires on the factory wheels
> and they work great.
> -David :-)
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 and Newer --------------+
> | Send posts to, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to |
> +-- Visit Our Web Site: --+


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 21:35:56 -0400
From: "Lare/Eric"
Subject: Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #130

- ----------
> From:
> To:
> Subject: Re: fordtrucks80up-digest V1 #130
> Date: Wednesday, September 24, 1997 10:52 PM
> Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 13:53:29 -0400
> From: William Holmes
> Subject: radio
> How do I get the stock radio out of my 92 ford F150?? There is 4
> holes around the radip face, could this be a way in?
> Wal-Mart has a tools for this. There are two U shaped tools that push
> the holes. When they are both inserted, simply pull the radio straight
> It's REALLY simple. The tools cost me less than $5. Out of curiosity,
> your stock radio have cassette? If so, would you be interested in
selling it?
> I only have AM/FM in my 96 F250.
> +-------------- Ford Truck Enthusiasts - 1980 and Newer --------------+
> | Send posts to, |
> | Send Unsubscribe requests to |
> +-- Visit Our Web Site: --+

I just upgraded to a Pioneer from the stock unit in my '94 ranger. The
stock unit does have a cassette player. If this unit will work and you're
interested e-mail me at I'll consider any reasonable offer.

Eric S.


Date: Thu, 25 Sep 1997 20:43:15 -0700
From: Edward A Arkin
Subject: web site -- links or other lists

you might wanna add
to the links or other lists
this site, which also has a bulliton board
is similar to yours-- but it is only for
the new style pickups-- 1997 & up
85 f-150


Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 01:38:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: Al Spangler
Subject: F150 shocks

I have a '97 F150 extracab longbed. This configuration gives me a very long
wheelbase and I expected the ride to be rough, but on uneven freeway
pavement I was surprised at how rough it really is, esp. at speeds over 55
mph. Question: can I improve the ride by installing good shocks, say KYB
gas shocks. Any advice welcome. Thanks.


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