Intermittent contribution codes...solved?!?
#1
Intermittent contribution codes...solved?!?
So as some know I recently replaced my HPOP and went the Adrenaline route. Prior to that I was having some injector problems with one hanging open, one failing the buzz test, and one intermittently failing the buzz test. Also was getting that little every so often stumble at idle while warm.
After cleaning every sensor, tubing, and replacing the bad injectors and HPOP the truck was pretty much running the best it has since I have owned it.
However, every once in awhile when warmed up I would primarily get a #4 or #5 contribution code. Only once did a #2 or a #6 pop up. Plus the only time the codes would show was when I romped on the throttle or goosed it just a bit. I could granny drive the thing all day long and the codes would not show up.
Been watching pressures, temps, percentages like a hawk and everything has been inline where it needed to be. But, the problem would only arise when I throttled the truck at all.
Truck is bluesprung and fuel pressure at driving WOT uphill stays at about 60 psi.
What I thought was strange was when the code would pop, sometimes it would run slightly rough. I could stop the truck, turn it off, reset the code, and fire it up and run smooth as silk like the code never happened. At this point I was thinking maybe a FICM problem. FICM volts have always looked good, logic and main.
Anyway, to the point
I searched forever and I found a single thread throughout all of the powerstroke forums about intermittent contribution codes that was determined to be the HP oil rail "check valves" on the log style rails. Before that was diagnosed injectors had been replaced and yatta yatta yatta, typical parts chasing right?
Decided to get one of those "check valves" and take a look at it. The part number is 3C3Z-6N853-BA
The "check valve" is more of just an orifice than a check valve. These two pics are off the new fitting.
Figured I would check out my driver side so I ripped it out to take a look. It was somewhat obstructed it seemed, but running my smallest torch tip cleaner through it seemed to clear whatever was there. Once done it looked the same in orifice size as the new one. Nothing was now wrong with it so I figured throw it back in and see what happens.
Drove around several times at temp and throttled the thing heavily. No driver side codes...only a #5 would pop.
Yanked out the passenger side oil rail check valve and discovered the orifice was even more restricted compared to what the new one looked like size wise. Carb cleaner and my torch tip cleaner appeared to somewhat clear the hole to a larger size, but the tip cleaner would not fit inside the orifice no matter how much I tried. It seemed there was a metal edge inside the check valve on the upstream side that would fold over the hole ever so slightly.
Here is a pic of the old and new valve side by side and you can see the difference. The old one in this pic was only as large as I could make it without that weird piece inside covering the orifice.
Here you can see the little flap of metal protruding into the orifice opening
After that last pic I was able to come in from the other side with the tip cleaner and knock that little piece of metal out. Seemed to be a flaw in the machining of this part in my opinion if it is going to obstruct a tiny hole to begin with.
Wonder how many injectors throughout the world have been replaced because of this one little bugger?!?!
Drove the pig around quite a bit today and throttled uphill, downhill, getting on the freeway, and just through town. NO CODES
Soooooo, hopefully I got this thing kicked and have no more contribution codes pop up again unless it truly is a failing injector.
After cleaning every sensor, tubing, and replacing the bad injectors and HPOP the truck was pretty much running the best it has since I have owned it.
However, every once in awhile when warmed up I would primarily get a #4 or #5 contribution code. Only once did a #2 or a #6 pop up. Plus the only time the codes would show was when I romped on the throttle or goosed it just a bit. I could granny drive the thing all day long and the codes would not show up.
Been watching pressures, temps, percentages like a hawk and everything has been inline where it needed to be. But, the problem would only arise when I throttled the truck at all.
Truck is bluesprung and fuel pressure at driving WOT uphill stays at about 60 psi.
What I thought was strange was when the code would pop, sometimes it would run slightly rough. I could stop the truck, turn it off, reset the code, and fire it up and run smooth as silk like the code never happened. At this point I was thinking maybe a FICM problem. FICM volts have always looked good, logic and main.
Anyway, to the point
I searched forever and I found a single thread throughout all of the powerstroke forums about intermittent contribution codes that was determined to be the HP oil rail "check valves" on the log style rails. Before that was diagnosed injectors had been replaced and yatta yatta yatta, typical parts chasing right?
Decided to get one of those "check valves" and take a look at it. The part number is 3C3Z-6N853-BA
The "check valve" is more of just an orifice than a check valve. These two pics are off the new fitting.
Figured I would check out my driver side so I ripped it out to take a look. It was somewhat obstructed it seemed, but running my smallest torch tip cleaner through it seemed to clear whatever was there. Once done it looked the same in orifice size as the new one. Nothing was now wrong with it so I figured throw it back in and see what happens.
Drove around several times at temp and throttled the thing heavily. No driver side codes...only a #5 would pop.
Yanked out the passenger side oil rail check valve and discovered the orifice was even more restricted compared to what the new one looked like size wise. Carb cleaner and my torch tip cleaner appeared to somewhat clear the hole to a larger size, but the tip cleaner would not fit inside the orifice no matter how much I tried. It seemed there was a metal edge inside the check valve on the upstream side that would fold over the hole ever so slightly.
Here is a pic of the old and new valve side by side and you can see the difference. The old one in this pic was only as large as I could make it without that weird piece inside covering the orifice.
Here you can see the little flap of metal protruding into the orifice opening
After that last pic I was able to come in from the other side with the tip cleaner and knock that little piece of metal out. Seemed to be a flaw in the machining of this part in my opinion if it is going to obstruct a tiny hole to begin with.
Wonder how many injectors throughout the world have been replaced because of this one little bugger?!?!
Drove the pig around quite a bit today and throttled uphill, downhill, getting on the freeway, and just through town. NO CODES
Soooooo, hopefully I got this thing kicked and have no more contribution codes pop up again unless it truly is a failing injector.
#3
That Chris is some damn good detective work. I was just about to order some injectors, now maybe I'll look at that on my '03 first when I pull them out to check my pushrods.
That part has popped up a few times due to breaking off the log, probably from over tightening it. Some unbolt it from the rail rather then using the quick connect release tool.
That part has popped up a few times due to breaking off the log, probably from over tightening it. Some unbolt it from the rail rather then using the quick connect release tool.
#4
Thanks guys
I try to post up info that I know I cannot find easily so hopefully it helps someone else out down the road with a similar issue.
I hate nothing more than reading a thread that has all my symptoms and the thread just ends with no resolution. It is usually because the guy got fed up, took the truck into a mechanic and did not post up the solution.
Fingers crossed I got this thing whipped and no codes come back!!!
to all out there who's posts and threads I have read to get my pig up and running like she should be.
I try to post up info that I know I cannot find easily so hopefully it helps someone else out down the road with a similar issue.
I hate nothing more than reading a thread that has all my symptoms and the thread just ends with no resolution. It is usually because the guy got fed up, took the truck into a mechanic and did not post up the solution.
Fingers crossed I got this thing whipped and no codes come back!!!
to all out there who's posts and threads I have read to get my pig up and running like she should be.
#5
That is an awesome write up Chris! I have nearly the same issue where mine would be more prevalent when using tow haul mode and letting the truck do the downshifting. It seems like it would run rough when I would come to a stop, but if I blipped the throttle it would go away. Could still get a contribution code, so I'll try looking at these and clean them.
Any chance you could post a picture where on the motor they could be found?
Any chance you could post a picture where on the motor they could be found?
#6
Join Date: Mar 2014
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That is an awesome write up Chris! I have nearly the same issue where mine would be more prevalent when using tow haul mode and letting the truck do the downshifting. It seems like it would run rough when I would come to a stop, but if I blipped the throttle it would go away. Could still get a contribution code, so I'll try looking at these and clean them.
Any chance you could post a picture where on the motor they could be found?
Any chance you could post a picture where on the motor they could be found?
#7
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Nice write up Chris! And the pics are good too.
Just a couple of observations. First that new valve is pretty rough lookin for a new part, looks like someone made it on a drill press with dull cutters instead of a lathe. And second is anyone else wondering what might happen if these holes were drilled just a couple of thousandths oversize?
Just a couple of observations. First that new valve is pretty rough lookin for a new part, looks like someone made it on a drill press with dull cutters instead of a lathe. And second is anyone else wondering what might happen if these holes were drilled just a couple of thousandths oversize?
#12
#13
At first I started to think about opening up the orifice too. But if that is a check valve as the name suggests, and there are two hexes on it so it could be an assembled part, then the orifice may be a slow pressure release orifice rather then a supply orifice. All depends on the "check valves" directionality.
#14
Nice write up Chris! And the pics are good too.
Just a couple of observations. First that new valve is pretty rough lookin for a new part, looks like someone made it on a drill press with dull cutters instead of a lathe. And second is anyone else wondering what might happen if these holes were drilled just a couple of thousandths oversize?
Just a couple of observations. First that new valve is pretty rough lookin for a new part, looks like someone made it on a drill press with dull cutters instead of a lathe. And second is anyone else wondering what might happen if these holes were drilled just a couple of thousandths oversize?
At first I started to think about opening up the orifice too. But if that is a check valve as the name suggests, and there are two hexes on it so it could be an assembled part, then the orifice may be a slow pressure release orifice rather then a supply orifice. All depends on the "check valves" directionality.
Thanks again to everyone, just trying to do my part and help others along the way
#15