Rear LS in front axle?

[78bigbronco]

Well y'all got more faith in the factory LS than I do. My F150 was all open and that thing has been unstoppable with moderatly oversized mud tires (285's). Never been stuck once, and even able to drive through some spots were others got stuck without even spinning. I attribute that to the super short WB and light weight. However my new truck has LS and many times spinning tires so far I have never once noticed both tires spinning. Every time I got hung up or started spinning I been checking just because the LS is new to me, and in every case so far I have been doing 1 wheel spins. I've heard applying the brake might help, of course that can be hard to do with the 6 speed. I have 6,000 mi on it so I dont think its worn out. Heck I wouldnt have got the LS if it was an option that I could have deleted but it wasnt, I did order the truck built. Personally I really want selectable locker for the front, but thats low on the list and costly. However saving your butt just once is worth alot... If you drive on slippery roads at all you really dont want anything other than open really. The selectable locker lets you run open in 4x4 when you need to steer, and then when your really in the deep stuff and just need to get to the other side, then you can lock it. For a cheaper solution I always wondered about a spool in the front (with manual hubs of course). That way when you need to steer you could just lock one side to let the other side spin. Atleast you would get 100% on one side and know which side it is (you could pick your line better) then if you were going through a mud hole or something you could lock both. I'm sure thats got to be a bad idea but just wondering.

[steve(ill)]

well, if your LS unit craps out then basically you have an open rear end, so there is no way that a LS unit can be worse than open unit. When setup properly, they will not slip. Mine has 200k miles and still works excellent. You need to change the lube every 75K miles and use FUll Synthetic

[cv18sro]

I put a LS in a 76 F100 I had. You know the one with only 4x4 with no hi or low. So I decided to put LS in it to help me offroad. I had to adjust it several times until I had it right and when I did I would out 4x4 other trucks that had the low range. In fact I called it a jeep on steroids because it would go anywhere.

My 01 has LS and it 4x4 almost as good as my 76. My daughter being born made me think more about safety otherwise I would still have that 76.

So to say LS does not work is complete BS. If it is not adjusted right it will not work properly, but as Steve said, when properly adjusted they work just as advertised. The 76 was pretty easy to adjust not sure about the newer ones but I always liked working on 3rd member diff over the others.

[thecardoc]

I have a 79 Bronco I bought new with a factory front LS and a factory rear Traction Lock. I have put it through hell and never been stuck. I am very pleased with LS and Traction Lock units.

[BURNSTOUGHFORD]

I know that LS in the front would work as a cheap option for 4x4 situations. I respectfully disagree with most of the guys here. I think ford offered a LS in the front of the F-250LD with the snow plow package (cannot confirm)

[Big Greenie]

Just a few points...

No domestic manufacturer has ever offered a factory LSD in the front of a modern 4wd truck. Open to seeing proof otherwise. As previously mentioned, it would be dangerous and a huge liability on the road.

I never stated that a LSD doesn't work, just that by nature, the Slip part of LSD makes it a traction device of Limited value.

Your CV joints DO turn in the front of your truck. The disconnect is in the differential. If your CV's aren't turning, your wheels aren't turning because the CV shafts are splined directly to the hubs on these trucks.

Sorry about the tranny mistake back a few posts. I forgot that the Expys and SD trucks were the only ones lucky enough to get the 4r100 behind the 5.4L. The 8.8 in a "truck", well OK, glad you think it is a good choice, the factory clearly didn't because it put 9.75s behind the 5.4L trucks.

The good news is, the LSD up front will probably help get you out of the ditch...right after it understeers you off a slippery road.;-)

It is refreshing to see you willing to go against lots first hand experience. Good Luck

[BURNSTOUGHFORD]

You have stated your opinion. I hear you.


Also if the roads are that slippery then maybe you shouldnt be out on them? And you assume that i will be driving this truck down the highway in the winter why? You assume a lot of things about what im doing with this.

I didnt say that 8.8 was better than a 9.75, its what my truck came with. Someday maybe it will get switched if it ever fails. I dont see why your hung up on it?

Also i understand the cvs turn in the front axle and that is where they disconnect at. Hence the reason i said that i will need to do more research into how they disconnect and if the LS will affect that.

You are also incorrect about the 4r100 only coming in SD and expy. It did find its way into several f-150s. Mostly Roush, harley and lightning trucks as well as F-250Ld and F-7700, but some regular f-150s where lucky enough to get it as well.

I thank you for your opinions. But my question was if it would work, not if it was ethical as i never even said what i was doing with it. But thanks anyways its good to see people dont want others to do stupid things.

[Big Greenie]

Originally Posted by BURNSTOUGHFORD

You have stated your opinion. I hear you.


Also if the roads are that slippery then maybe you shouldnt be out on them? And you assume that i will be driving this truck down the highway in the winter why? You assume a lot of things about what im doing with this.

Dont worry about MY winter driving skills. I lived in MN for 30 years and then moved to the mountains of Colorado. Trust me, you likely have no concept of winter driving if your experiences are limited to the midwest. I never assumed you would drive on the highway. The LSD up front is going to be an issue on any road, at any speed.
[quote]
I didnt say that 8.8 was better than a 9.75, its what my truck came with. Someday maybe it will get switched if it ever fails. I dont see why your hung up on it?
[/qoute]
I'm not hung up on it, I simply find it a little interesting that you have made all of these "upgrades", yet to me you have missed some of the more important ones.

Also i understand the cvs turn in the front axle and that is where they disconnect at. Hence the reason i said that i will need to do more research into how they disconnect and if the LS will affect that.

See post #12 where you said this " I know that my CV's dont turn now.... " Just trying to clarify

You are also incorrect about the 4r100 only coming in SD and expy. It did find its way into several f-150s. Mostly Roush, harley and lightning trucks as well as F-250Ld and F-7700, but some regular f-150s where lucky enough to get it as well.

Well you really got me there, os the specialty versions have it, truely a revelation.

I thank you for your opinions. But my question was if it would work, not if it was ethical as i never even said what i was doing with it. But thanks anyways its good to see people dont want others to do stupid things.

I dont recall ever getting into ethics. "Will it work?" is kind of a loaded question. Will it actually physically fit and function is one question. Not sure, it will be interesting to see what you find out. Will it work with respect to how it will function in practical use would be the other part. The consensus seems to be that it is a poor idea. My opinion on it is based on over a decade of running trucks with front lockers and teaching skills in the off road community. I have seen LSD diffs front and rear. I dont think it is a wise choice.

Certainly you are free to give it a shot yourself. Enjoy

[BURNSTOUGHFORD]

I meant that i knew the cv's didnt turn the center section all the time. Thats my bad. I shoulda re read post 12 and edited it.

The 4r100 comment was just for general knowledge. Didnt mean anything by it.


And i have upgraded my truck in many ways, just not completely done. And the thought process for this is that the I have the LS and its free to put in minus gasket and seal.

I thank you for your input none the less. I really never wanted to get into an argument with you or anyone else.

Also for the driving on wintery roads comment. I meant that as a general thougth for people that are worried about sliding into ditches. I wasnt targeting you with that. Its hard to explain that kind of comment i guess in words on the internet.

We have some pretty nasty winters here in Iowa as well, maybe nothing like you up in MN, but i deal with it every year and have no issues getting around. The only time i use 4wd is when the snow is over 1ft on the roads. Other wise driving 2wd is fine. That is why im not worried about sliding in a ditch. Also if the roads are that slick then driving slower works for me. Also would eliminate the issue with the front end pulling me around at speed.

What i really want the LS for is mud fields and greasy level B roads in iowa. To many times i have had the front end let me down. And i dont do it often enough to justify a locker for the front.

Anyways

But my question still stands as that i would like to know if the LS unit would work in the front axle.

[Big Greenie]

Yes, the question remains! How similar is the front 8.8 housing to the rear? One is an alum housing, which shouldn't be an issue. So will a rear 8.8 carrier and gearset work in a front 8.8 housing?

I would think that it "should". If you have good junkyard access I would pull a front unit, and once you do the rear locker, see if you can do the swap on a donor housing off the truck. That is probably the easiest way to find out. You are probably breaking new ground with this project. I would say that standard 8.8 gearsets will go in front but the carrier design may be a different story.

[Big Greenie]

Originally Posted by BURNSTOUGHFORD

Also would eliminate the issue with the front end pulling me around at speed.

What i really want the LS for is mud fields and greasy level B roads in iowa. To many times i have had the front end let me down. And i dont do it often enough to justify a locker for the front.

Not to belabor the point too much but I think you misunderstand how it is going to work. The LSD will help pull you around when going straight. It is going to cause the front end to run wide on every corner though. If you are moving at more than a crawl it is going to be a dangerous proposition. Steering on any slippery surface is going to be absolutely awful. I know this from a decade of running trucks with front and rear slectable lockers. I have taught off road techniques and seen LSDiffs in the front and rear of vehicles. They are marginal up front. The benefits fall far short of the problems. You will regret it, but warnings only go so far I guess.

This is why the suggestion of a front locker comes up. A selectable locker is the answer. As mentioned by someone else, the absolute best thing you can have at anything above 10 mph is open diffs. Lockers and LSDiffs cause instabilities.

More importantly, these thoughts led me back to your real question. You might want to check with someone like ARB that sells lockers. See if they have one that fits the front of an F150. They for sure have one for a rear 8.8 and should be able to tell you if it would work up front. If the carriers are the same for their conversion, they will be the same for your project as well.

[superrangerman2002]

It looks like if you can find the right spline count, 28 or 31....(I can't remember which it is on the front of a 8.8 IFS F150) the LS out of a 8.8" rear would work in the front.

With that said, as I also had mentioned before, a locker would be a better choice for safety reasons.

Lots of options on this page.

Ford / Lincoln / Mercury F150 Front Differentials Ford 8.8 Lockers Auto Parts: AUBURN,AUBURN GEAR,LIMITED SLIP,PRO,POSI,POSITRACTION,DIFFERENTIAL,AIR LOCKER,ARB,SELECTABLE LOCKER,LOCKER,FORD 8.8,DETROIT,DETROIT LOCKER,EATON,LOCK RIGHT,LOCKRIGHT,POWER

[BURNSTOUGHFORD]

Well if i had all the money in the world i would do a lot of things differently. I agree a locker would be 10x better. But that just aint happeing for several years at best.

I can swap this in a few hours as long as it was possible. If it didnt work, no big deal just put the open back in. As far as time, i have plenty of it for messing around with this thing.

Thats the reason for the entire thing. Who knows might not get around to it. I was just curious of the possibility of it, especially since i dont know how the vacuum operated diff works.

[Big Greenie]

Just another good excuse to go to the junkyard, pull a front axle section and dissect it. There should be lots of vehicles to choose from with the cash for clunkers program filling junkyards with perfectly good cars and trucks.

[BURNSTOUGHFORD]

I actually have a cousin that rebuilds these years of F-150. Over the years hes aquired a lot of parts. And i mean A LOT.... Thats where most of my stuff comes from actually.

So.... who knows. Maybe i will get lucky and get a locker threw there some day. He has a lift kit (6") on a truck right now that hes going to part out that i was looking at. Doubt i will get it though.

I will deff post on my findings.