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Problems Running '08 6.4L on Biodiesel???
From an '08 6.4L owner:
The '08 model Ford diesel engines are equipped with some new "clean emissions" system which has a cycle in which there is a "burn off" of some type of filter in the catalytic converter (I think). I noticed the cycle right away during the first week or so I had the truck- it idles much higher (around 1200 rpm) when in neutral or park and all sorts of air sucking and blowing noises can be heard under the hood, plus the exhaust air blows from the tailpipe hotter and stronger. It is only supposed to stay in this cycle for a few minutes, but I began to notice that it was cycling for longer periods and more frequently. During the cycle, the power from the engine is noticeably less and the mileage is terrible (about 8mpg). I brought it into Ford after it was stuck on for 2 days and I was worried that it was going to catch on fire or something. I did not acknowledge use of biodiesel to them until they asked what type of fuel I was putting in, and then I only admitted a blend of B25 (I did not want them to have a scapegoat on warranty repairs). They told me that biodiesel in concentrations of more than B5 will cause the burnoff cycle to stick and told me to put diesel in and it would stop. I ran about 1/2 tank of diesel through the truck and it came off it's cycle. I have not put any biodiesel in since and have not had any problem with the burnoff cycle. I am sure that they would talk to you about it at Ukiah Ford. They seemed real sure that biodiesel would cause this type of issue with the new '08 emissions systems. I am disappointed, and I hope you find something out. I was told that Chevy and Dodge are coming out with similar emissions systems when their '08 models hit the street. |
It would be interesting for him to put it on B5 and see what happens.
I haven't bothered to learn anything about the 6.4, but I hope someone in the know will explain what is going on there. |
This is true, but I don't think he's planning on doing that (it's actually almost a hassle) until he gets some answers on what the engine can really tolerate.
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Got another update. Truck doing the same thing on ULSD. Perhaps not at all connected to biodiesel.
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I was rather expecting that. As soon as he told the service department he was running something more than B5, it became the cause. Doesn't matter what the actual cause is.
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There will be no diffrence between B5 and ULSD, or off-raod diesel or just regular arse diesel. The truck dosnt know the difffrence between the fuels. Its the longevity of the fuel system that has many questioning when these trucks are run on low grade diesel or B5. Performance will be there, some just dont know how long will the fuel system take the abuse. I run off-raod diesel in my 6.4 with no problems yet, and I personally feel that the fuel system is stout enough to handle low grade fuel. The injectors, fuel rails, fuel pump, and lift pumps all were made to handle the abuse. ULSD is just emissions propoganda. Saying the truck will burst into flames and spontaneously combust if you run anything other then ULSD is hogwash. All about protecting the earth by charging everyone more money
Cowboy Steve |
B5 is not a low-grade fuel. Regardless of what you think of biodiesel as a fuel in and of itself, ASTM biodiesel blended at this percentage with LSD or ULSD will make it a much better fuel in a number of ways, most notably in terms of cetane, emission profile and lubricity.
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The only issues we have with biodiesel on the older engines is that it acts as a solvent and cleans out the fuel system of all that parafin gunk. They tell us around here especially if you have your own bulk tank to start out with B5 and paln on changing fuel filters a lot at first. Once the initial cleanout occurs there are no other issue other then in this area you pay extra for the honor of burning biodiesel.
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Dunno about ford, but the Cummins is already 2010 certified, so there won't be any changes there emissions wise, I know Cummins *HAS* approved B20 for use in these engines, but I think Chrysler is still doing some other tests to be sure its okay in the trucks. So we know the burn off style of DPF *CAN* handle B20, maybe its a matter of programming to make it work properly?
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Originally Posted by powerstroked162
There will be no diffrence between B5 and ULSD, or off-raod diesel or just regular arse diesel. The truck dosnt know the difffrence between the fuels. Its the longevity of the fuel system that has many questioning when these trucks are run on low grade diesel or B5. Performance will be there, some just dont know how long will the fuel system take the abuse. I run off-raod diesel in my 6.4 with no problems yet, and I personally feel that the fuel system is stout enough to handle low grade fuel. The injectors, fuel rails, fuel pump, and lift pumps all were made to handle the abuse. ULSD is just emissions propoganda. Saying the truck will burst into flames and spontaneously combust if you run anything other then ULSD is hogwash. All about protecting the earth by charging everyone more money
Cowboy Steve |
The only difference between offroad diesel and regular diesel is the red dye and the fact that if the DOT catches you runing red dyed fuel on the highways you can get fined $25,000.00. Off road isn't taxed and the dye is used to denoted this.
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Originally Posted by stormyrider
The only difference between offroad diesel and regular diesel is the red dye and the fact that if the DOT catches you runing red dyed fuel on the highways you can get fined $25,000.00. Off road isn't taxed and the dye is used to denoted this.
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Originally Posted by kumarp
From an '08 6.4L owner:
Any thoughts? Thanks. That's why I have AE for my Ford and VAG-com for my Audi. Even if under warranty, I like to know what's the problem before I'd take them to even close to any service place. Save easily plenty of time and money and I don't have too much either of those to loose for somebodys stupidity and ignorance. Sorry, little bit :-offtopic... , but I have had some issues in the past with the service even when I told them excatly what's the problem. They just charged extra for the diagnostics what I had done already. The last time I trusted the service guys, even I had earlier good service from them. Still get mad when remembering that... Anyway does somebody know, how could I get BD to McAllen, TX area, is there any distributor who could ship, even 5 gallons BD100 could be nice to get. |
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