GM - A new twist on "Like a Rock"
 

Check this out, I'm sure all of you GM haters will enjoy this one:

http://pistonslap.com/

ya that's old. all motors have piston slap, it is just to what extent. diesels are the worst when they are cold. hense the loud noise or rattle.

[QUOTE=Bob Ayers]Check this out, I'm sure all of you GM haters will enjoy this one:

http://pistonslap.com/[/QUOTE]
I don't hate GM. Some of those who feel the need to wave the GM flag can be irritating at times. :rolleyes:

nobody around here waves a GM flag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is a ford site remember.

who the heck would even think of doing that.

i would ban that troll. :rolleyes:

I think a ban is too harsh. A strict regimen of daily beatings would suffice. :-X19

I thought you did that already? :-X03

I have heard that sound lots, my cousin has a 2000 6.0 GMC that sounds like my 7.3

I'm assuming this is gonna cost GM a lot of money??

ok what the hell is a troll? and if its that comment "waving the gm flag" i dont think it should be "banned", thats just stupid.

Im sure no one waves the gm flag part of this site....but that dosent mean he cant share his opinion

that aside, my dads searra did the same thing, and now i know what the hell the sound was. i remeber like 2 cylinders sounded just like a desel engine, i tthough it was some wierd hybrid of a gas and desel engine but found out it only took gasoline so that was out. Other then that s'was a great truck

A troll is someone who comes on a website and posts messages for the sole reason of pissing people off.

oh ok, well im sure that wasnt that persons intendtion, i really dont know how people would get mad about that.

I've never heard any Fords have any serious internal noise.... Hell my Ranger with the 2.3 and 314,000 miles on it doesn't make any knocking or tapping noise. You put 314,000 on a GM motor and it's done for 3 times over!

Who got mad and who were you talking about? Minimizer? :-fire

I see why people get mad about trolls. They piss me off too! If you still dont understand why people get mad, let me put it into a different, more understandable situation.

It'd be like me walkin into church on Sunday mornin and yellin out "JESUS SUCKS!" Same deal here. Only Ford is our "Jesus".

Does it all make sense now?

Yeh, the 2.9 only taps.....maybe. it depends one how it was treated. But ive have never seen a 314,000 mile chevy in my life.

Take a look in the ranger forum at the thread titled "Miles on your ranger..." Several guys in there with over 250,000, 300,000, and even some over 450,000 mileson their 4 bangers and even the V6's. Dad's Chevy with the 4.3 has 140,000 miles on it, and I just put its 3rd engine in it.

"nobody around here waves a GM flag!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is a ford site remember.

who the heck would even think of doing that.

i would ban that troll."

that duramax guy sed that^


thats seems alittle "pertrubed" to me, and i see people get mad at trolls, i didnt see how this was one is all. All the guy sed was he didnt like people who waves the GM flag, didnt even say it was anyone in this site. As a mater of fact it seemed as though he was on our side. If you dont understand what a troll is go to the Titan vs F-150 tug of war thread.....its a great example.

And "minimizer" if was intended to be an insult to me was the DUMBEST and most non-afflicting thing ive been called in my entire life!. If you have a problem with me atleast put more then 2 seconds of though into what you want to call me. I assume it ment i talk about non related issues that are off topic... well get over it. We all knew chevys knocked, and thats not news so it didnt hurt at all.

duramaximizer was being sarcastic because he is and can be a troll sometimes.

ya what handyman said. it was sarcasm..... it is hard to read sometimes on a forum like this.

ya i know i am a PITA. i just like to keep you guys tuned up.

i can't believe someone used ford and jesus in the same sentence. that is sooooooooo wrong.

That someone was ME! Lol it was just an analogy! I think if Jesus were to come back that he'd be in a Ford!;). Sorry.... I forgot no religious topics need to be brought up!

[SARCASM FONT]this works well sometimes[/SARCASM]

FFS stop labelling people trolls, just because some have there own opinions on GM being a quality truck, doesnt mean they are waving around a GM flag...

I think some people truely dont know what a troll is. Some people here are true Ford fanboys, I tell ya that.

"fanboy" is not a good thing, kinda like proclaiming MTX speakers the best ever made.

ya i know .....;)

Minimizer is making fun of duramaximizer, not you. I felt that would be obvious. I'm just not getting the rest, handyman can you help me out? I guess I'm just tired tonight. :-X20

well ok, it seemed like your were pionting tht my deriction, sorry about that! I hate it whnh people dont take time to actually read what ive posted and just find it as a place to insult me...or try to.

It's amazing how far off topic this got.

To get the thread back on topic: The piston slap issue has not been an indicator of engine performance or longevity. As for the comment of the 6.0 gasser being as loud as a 7.3. I've never had a 6.0 gasser with ps but I did have an 01 5.3 with ps and I also had a 7.3 and it was much louder

piston slap dose hinder an engines longevity. maybe not proformance. Its to what degree the piston slap is. Minor slap is common of an older engine, and most likley dosent affect a new one. But if there is way too much space bettween the cylinder wall and piston and the piston is literaly slamming the sides of the bore, then of course that engine wont last long. As far as im concerned there should be no piston slap in a new engine at all, weather or not its good or bad.

Nope there should be no piston slap at all in any engine. To say its normal which GM says it is is an insult to our intelligence. I hope GM has this problem solved its been a nightmare for them an has resulted in losing market share.

The piston slop is only part of the many Chevy manufacturing problems. Chevy reliability has been going down hill for some time.

While I admit, the piston slap and GM's "fix" for the problem is a joke, I have seen several 5.3's and 6.0's with over 200k on the clock that have worked pretty hard all their lives that start every day, run well and are still performing well. I have been pretty lucky, my 5.3 has a very slight noise upon start up with just under 100k on the clock.

GM as well as Ford had better get things turned around as far as quality of product and customer care in an attempt to slow down the Honda/Toyota steam roller that is headed for Detroit.

Two quick things on piston slap- the reason no lawsuits have gotten any traction is simply because it's next to impossible to prove that it is actually a cause of reduced durability/reliability.

Second- listen to a 5.4 start up. Or most Hondas. And quite a few 'Yotas....

You'll hear the same thing- aluminum pistons are the cause, and it's not unique to GM.

i have a 2000 2500hd 4x4 6.0 that has had that piton slap noise from day 1 and now 80.000 miles and still running i hate to say it but the thing tows awsome. but for how much longer ? time will tell . i love the 7.3 psd in my ramp truck

I dont know about the whole piston slap thing. I did hear an 8.1L running for the first time though and it sounded like my old Isuzu 4abnger that had a timing chain rattling around (whith 150,000miles). It was an 05, i dont think i would buy a GM based just on that. And yes piston slap greatly reduces engine life and can reduce engine performance too...

That is the real debate. From what I understand, the slap occurs BELOW the area where the rings on the pistons travel, so there is no real wear in the seated area. Not 100% sure about this, but I have read that a few times on the net, so take it for what that is worth. They seem to be credible and intelligent sources, but ??????????

I am quite surprised with the Honda thing - because as far as I can recall, all of thier blocks are aluminium.

The issue comes from aluminium pistons have a reduced size, because the expand greater at heat than the cast iron block, so they need to be smaller, and when the pistons are cold they "slap" around in the base of the piston skirt.

As a side note - my 5.4l in my car used to rattle around like a PSD at start up (my other 5.4l is fine), the person that purchased my car has since stripped the engine (he got a little ambitious with boost levels, and turned piston no:7 into a nice aluminium ingot :-fire ) - according to him (haven't seen the car or motor, he just called me with some questions) there was no visible damage on the piston walls or on the bores due to piston slap...

(he got a little ambitious with boost levels, and turned piston no:7 into a nice aluminium ingot )

That's funny stuff right there! We routinely hear piston slap on Hondas and Yotas- especially the 4 cylinders, it seems. No one seems to notice or mind- just not a big deal to most folks.

Well, when GM themselves say that slap (old news, but still eyebrow raising nonetheless...) is "normal", that either tells you not deal with the problem like a loyal buyer or do research and not buy the product line in the first place. Anytime a part of the rotating assembly is traveling in a path that it's not meant to travel, that's not good. Period.

GM's had these issues since the LS1 first came out in the Vette and the F-bodies. LS1's made all sorts of noises and you'd hear of an occasional owner who would be lucky to get to the next 3000 mile oil change with any oil left in the pan.

Yeah, the Gen 2 engines and the LT1 slapped on occasion, but for paying that much more money these days for a vehicle, you should get better quality control than that.

Heck, at least Ford, as I recall, had some idea where their slappers came from. GM? Well, since all the small block engines they use now are very much related and the big block has the same tendencies, do you take that chance on one?

It's not just a GM or Ford thing, but GM sure made a great attempt to handle it, no?

Give me one of those abnormal engines, anyday! Otherwise, if that knock was normal, advertise it as such.

I'll just settle with my old school 2.3L Ranger with 261,000ish miles, no knocks, no oil drinking, no smoking, nada....just smooth driving.

Heck, at least Ford, as I recall, had some idea where their slappers came from. GM? Well, since all the small block engines they use now are very much related and the big block has the same tendencies, do you take that chance on one?

It's not just a GM or Ford thing, but GM sure made a great attempt to handle it, no?

Give me one of those abnormal engines, anyday! Otherwise, if that knock was normal, advertise it as such.

A few thoughts there:
1) Big block has never had piston slap. It just drinks oil like there's no tomorrow- but no slap. I'll take the small block, thanks.
2) Engine failure is so rare anymore, it's barely worth mentioning. I've posted this before- in our two dealership that sell a few hundred new Fords and Chevies a month, both Service managers can count warranty engine replacements on one hand, fingers left over, in the last five years.
3) "Piston Slap" occurs for the first 1-20 seconds after the motors fired cold in the morning. It's a product of thin skirts and aluminum pistons- and is no way confined to GM, or even domestic products.

Why would you advertise the knock as normal, when it isn't a knock? It's a soft tapping that generally disappears immediately after starting a cold engine. Again, a non-issue.

We traded in a 2003 Suburban for our 2001 Expedition last year. One of the reasons was the piston slap. Whenever we cranked it it sounded like a big diesel for about 5 seconds. We took it back to the dealership and they told us it was 100% normal.

When we finally traded our's, we went to a Honda dealer that had an Expedition we liked. When they heard the piston-slap they tried to offer us $5000 less than NADA because of it. We had to trade it at a GM dealer to get full value.

my bro's pont. has the worest piston slap ive ever heard it has the 3.4 i believe and they say its normal but it does it all the time warm cold anytime thing is a pos so many problems for a 00