Diesel or Gas
 

So looking for advice from you guys. Im going to trade in my pathetic 2015 1500 silerado that can tow only 6200 lbs because wife and I are going to buy a camper thats about 8000. Anyways Im looking at a 08-10 f250/f350 with a diesel or a 11+ with the gas motor. This truck will also be my daily so Im wondering which would be better on gas mileage. Its a mixture of 50/50 highway and city. I would get a programmer and some bolt ons on the diesel as well as the gas, which normally will get better mileage? Thanks

As a tech working for a Ford dealer since 2000, stay FAR away from the 2008 to 2010 6.4L diesel. They are a "ticking time bomb on wheels". If fuel consumption is a concern to you, than it's questionable whether or not a 3/4 ton pickup is within your budget. That said, with a 6.4L diesel, you will definitely be seeing single digit fuel consumption while towing with it. But the issues the 6.4L along with the astronomical costs for repair when these issues occur is definitely something you want to avoid. A 2011 and up 6.2L equipped truck will more than meet your needs adequately for your intended use. The cost of maintenance or repairs will also be substantially less than that of the 6.4L.

Get a 6.2 gas. you will have a newer more reliable pick up truck then the 6.4 diesel like mentioned. Litterally the worst engine designed. Even if you "bulletproof" them they still arent reliable. I own 2015 F350 with a 6.2 and have gotten great results. I tow my 8,000lb camper with it as well. I usually get 8mpg untuned, and 9.5mpg tuned. It does run high in the rpms at times and doesnt like to lock into 6th for a long time towing heavy either. Empty I have seen 15mpg tuned up. I have a Livewire ts from 5star tuning and have the economy, performance, and tow tune. economy gets me 15mpg mostly hwy, performance gives the truck alot more hp, and tq, as well a throttle response. I highly recommend the gas motor. Any questions and ill help ya out. Good luck

My '16 6.2 can get 16 mpg on the highway if I stay around 70, thats with 3.73s and stock 245s on 17s.

Had a 6.4 company truck about a year ago, it was a giant turd, about 11-12 mpg with just a tool box in the bed, stayed in the shop more than it did on the job. It won't take much research to find the reputations between those two engines are night and day difference

It's a lot nicer towing with a diesel and they can get better mileage than a gasoline engine in some scenarios. Unfortunately, the maintenance on any diesel is expensive. I will go against the grain somewhat and say that a 6.0L or 6.4L diesel isn't as bad as they are made out to be. However, I wouldn't buy a used 6.4L diesel truck because I don't know if the previous owner kept up on the maintenance or put some retarded racing tune on it and wore out the motor. Buying a used 6.4L truck is just too much of a crap shoot as parts / repairs for them are prohibitively expensive.

6.2 or 6.4.... Not even close. 6.2 all the way.

Thanks for the advise on the 6.4 I work in parts at a Lincoln dealer so its nice I have access to factory parts at a discount. Where Im at the cost of gas and diesel is within $.05 of each other. My silverado averages 16-18 mpg so if I can get near that Id be happy. Guess Ill start looking for a 11+ with the 6.7 or at least the gas motor. I just know I wont go with the 6.0 or a 5.4

I am going to second the buy a 6.2 Gas F250 F350 honestly for what your going to be using it for the 6.2 will do just fine. If you were towing a lot heavier or making lots and lots of long trips, I would say a diesel, but your not going to be doing that it would seem so a 6.2 will do fine, and the 6.2 has a good amount of power behind it

The other advantage to a 6.2 is your maintenance costs for oil and fuel filter changes will be lower and your repair costs versus diesel should also be lower.

Dont get me wrong the 6.7''s are great trucks, If you were towing heavier, I would say grab a 6.7 but with a diesel your oil and filter changes are more than a 6.2 would be and your repair costs would be higher engine and emissions wise I would believe.

As for a 6.4 they can be good engines if they are deleted and studded but the parts are expensive as are the repair costs ( you have to remember that Navistar is involved parts wise for the 6.0 and 6.4 to an extent ) Honestly if you really needed a diesel, I would move up to a 6.7, but really you ought to be fine with a 6.2

What ever chose you make just do your homework an get maintenance records and the vin and go to ford an get an oasis report and a carfax done and crawl all over and under the trucks you look at

You will have to update us when you get your new to you ride and of course pics or it didnt happen :-X22

I'd go with the 6.2. I've gotten 15 bone stock cruising hwy. I have a 2012 CC 4x4 with the 3.73 gears. With our 27 ft trailer I've gotten almost 10 overall on our maiden voyage to Lake Tahoe. GO GAS!

Buy a new 6.2 you'll love it mine does a fine job towing what ever I hook to it. I'm an old diesel 7.3 guy no way would I touch a new diesel truck. Especially after owning and working my 6.2

Its nice I can run an Oasis report at work anytime

Like others have said. Get the 6.2 gasser. I get 16.5mpg on the highway with the 3.73 gears. I'm averaging 14.4mpg combined highway/city for the summer hauling about 800 to 1000lbs of tools. No problems with 21k miles.

Diesel owners fall into two categories. There are the people who need it, and those who want it. There are times where the torque offered by the diesel is truly worth it. It all depends on what you are doing with the truck. The maintenance costs just hit your wallet a lot harder with the diesel as would any repairs outside of warranty. The diesel will also never save you enough on fuel economy to justify the price increase of the truck, or its maintenance. The diesel option in the newer trucks is an $8,640 price increase on the 2011+ trucks. That price increase does filter down to the used market. If you want a diesel and can afford all that goes with it, there is nothing wrong with getting one even if your needs don't necessarily justify it.

Guess I should of specified we plan on taking the camper out every weekend or so throughout the spring-fall. We live in Ohio and plan on driving up to 3-4 hours away which means driving through the mountains in SE ohio into west virginia and sometimes down to Tennessee. Would a gas engine still work with where Id be towing or will the extra torque of the diesel help? How do you guys do with the open diffs in these trucks since they only have the electronic locking diff in 4x4?

An F150 would tow that weight just fine & get you the gas mileage you are looking for. If you want an F250 the gasser will work well for you. The F250 at best will get you around 16 mpgs most likely less. I'm happy when I get 14 commuting.

That 8,000 is dry weight and some we looked at were heavier, didnt think the F150s would be rated that high

Another vote here for a 6.2 gas engine, but I would also tell you to look for one with the 4.30 gear option. The 6.2 has plenty of power for what you want to do, even with 3.73 gears, but the 4.30s will make towing much more pleasant.

X2 ^^^
I would do whatever I could to get the 4.30's. Knowing this will be a truck for towing, the 4.30 gears are far and away superior to the common 3.73.

It varies from year to year & model to model. An F150 with the Max Tow package would be around 12,000lbs give or take.

A 3.5L EcoBoost is rated to tow more than 10,000lbs. in any configuration. In some specific configurations I believe they can tow up to 12,600lbs.

THAT just about sums it up PERFECTLY. As a tech wrenching for a Ford store, who has wrenched on his fair share of diesels, as well as the former owner of a 2007 6.0L 4x4 CCSB XLT truck (the last year of the 6.0L by the way), and now the current owner of a 2016 6.7L 4x4 CCSB XLT truck, I can speak first hand on what the costs are. Both my 2007 and my current 2016 saw/see oil changes every 5000 kms. (3000 miles) RELIGIOUSLY. Fuel filters were/are changed every other oil change. I keep track of my oil changes by mileage, date and engine hour count. With my usage, it seems I am doing my oil changes about every 120 hours, WELL sooner than manufacturer recommended intervals. On the 2007, I was doing oil changes using Motorcraft 10W30 diesel oil. On my current 2016, I am using Mobil Delvac 5W40 Synthetic from Ford (a BIG ouchy on the wallet by the way). I am also using the Motorcraft PM-22 and PM-23 additives with EVERY fill up of diesel.

Wow, you guys must get paid pretty generously in your parts department if one of these trucks is within your means. By the way, when I first bought my 2007 used, back in September of 2011 from one of our sister dealers, I had a chance to scoop up a 2008 for about the same money as I ended up paying for the 2007. I said NO WAY to the 2008. Food for thought. That 6.4L was only available from Ford in 2008, 2009 and 2010. There's a reason for that, and in my opinion that's three years too many!!! As far as cost of fuel? diesel is always more expensive during the winter months than gas (due to the winter additives), and then vice versa during the summer months, so you can't necessarily compare fueling costs on just that factor alone.

Since you work in a Ford dealer parts department, I'm sure you are well familiar with Ford base part numbers. For starters, lets look the cost of an FL-820S, and a quart of 5W20 (x7) and an FA-1883. Those are part numbers for the oil filter, engine oil and air filter for a 6.2L truck. Now look at the cost of an FL-2051S, gallon jugs of 10W30 diesel oil (x3) or 5W40 Delvac (x3), an FA-1902 and an FD-4615. Those are the numbers for air, fuel and oil filters along with engine oil for a 6.7L truck. You get the picture?

Since we're on the subject of numbers, price out a 9F464, 9D475, 9E461, 9E527, 9A543, along with 5H221 for any 6.4L truck. Last, but not least, go price out a 6006 or 6007 assembly. I'm sure those parts aren't cheap, even at your cost plus 10% discount cost of parts. NOW you really get the picture.

I'd look for a good condition late 6.0L. Parts are relatively inexpensive and if you are mechanically inclined, they're simple to work on. There's a ton of them out there and you can get them cheap with low miles.

Jut as others have said, avoid the 6.4L. Turbo issues, $1500 in parts to replace a radiator and a multitude of other things scared me away from it.

M-chan68 Ill take your advise on that since I already looked up replacement turbos. As for being paid well its alright but our dealership is unique as we run not only Lincoln but out of the same parts department Volvo and Mercedes. Doesnt hurt wife and I have our house paid off and only owe on her Explorer and my truck. Ive found plenty of 6.2 trucks I like, not many of the newer 6.7 in my range yet, maybe Ill look in the spring time

Attachment 156746
This is my 8500 lbs load on our last vacation. 2016 4x4 6.2 3.73 gears. Towing 1600 miles, thru the gap of nc/tn and over black mountain on i40 to the outer banks and back, I averaged 9.5 mpg. No struggles at all. I'm averaging almost 13mpg daily driving, but there is no interstate driving in that. I was able to achieve almost 15 for a couple weeks, but that was hypermileing, and got tired of that. I've also gotten a best of 17mpg empty on the interstate. The 6.2 is great, and for your needs, is all you need. Your wants may be a diesel though, think hard about it, because it's not cheap. FWIW, a 150 would not have made my trip, with the golf cart in the bed, the cargo capacity would have been well exceeded. My dad has a 6.2 with 4.30's, it is definitely an improvement over 3.73's, but at the weight you are saying, you will have 0 issues with a 3.73 truck.

You'd be surprised. An F-150 configured correctly can have around a 2600lbs. payload. That's more than my F-250's got. That said, I feel a lot better about loading my F-250 down to the max or going over than I would about doing the same in an F-150.

My cargo capacity is 3100, and I was pushing it. Tongue weight of @1000lbs, 48v golf cart@800, 4 spare wheel/tires@100, family of 4 @700, plus firewood, a floor jack and some other tools, fuel, it adds up quick.

An F150 could be configured to be rated for that load. But it'll be a lot nicer towing it with an F250. The underpinnings of the Super Duty are just, well, heavier duty and helps you feel a lot more planted with it. Though for some this is a problem because they don't realy notice the trailer behind it and get careless :D

If your choices are between an 11+ 6.2L gasser or a 10- 6.4L diesel, I'd say go for the 11+ gasser, preferably with 4.30 gears if you can be patient enough to find one (or lucky enough to find one right away). For that weight range you'll be just fine, and it's a simpler, easier, lighter, cheaper engine, and you can fill up at any gas station you come across instead of hoping it's one that MIGHT have diesel.

I love my 6.7L diesel. I have no regrets, really, but I've also towed twice that weight on a gooseneck as well as a couple of 5ers. As long as nothing goes wrong, it's really not that big a deal as far as maintenance is concerned. DEF isn't expensive and usually only needs to be topped off around once every oil change (~7,500 miles), and oil changes at the dealership I take it to are still less than $100.

But you'll get the gasser for much cheaper, normally, and it'll be everything you need. You can take all the extra money you save and do stuff to it, if you want, like big full replacement bumpers, auxiliary airbags to control ride height, or whatever else.

F150 would be fine if you weren't doing it all the time. I mean, it would still do the job fine, but you'll feel far more comfortable with the F250 6.2 gasser because of the extra weight of the truck.

No doubt. The Super Duty is a much better tow vehicle. That's one of the main reasons I got one after having had F-150's for so many years.

With the extra tq, the wheels do spin easily empty. Im not sure what you are asking, but the electronic locking axle is available on both 4x4s and 4x2s.

The open diff really isn't an issue. With the traction control, the truck hooks up fine on asphalt in the rain or light snow. The electronic locker was something I thought I had to have, but actually could have gotten by just fine without it. I'm sure I would have used it more 10 years ago when going to muddy job sites, But the locker isn't something you use on the street, even in the snow. It turns the rear end sideways.

I used to have a 2011 F150 with the electronic locker and Id much rather have a regular limited slip. Are the superdutys the same meaning you can only lock it in 4x4?

My 2015 F-150 would let me use the E-Locker without being in 4A or 4WD. I can do the same on my 2016 Super Duty. The E-Locker is also available for 2WD trucks. The difference is that the E-Locker is standard with the FX4 package and costs extra on a 2WD truck.

No, you can lock in the rear locker in just 2wd. With the traction control, the brakes are applied to the tires that starts to slip, engaging the other tire turning the open rear end into a semi sorta limited slip rear end. It's not as seamless as limited slip, but does work and will keep you pointed straight. If you put it in 4wd, you will never need the rear locker on the road. It's nice when you have some really soupy mud.

Yeah, the locker can be engaged or not as desired, 2WD, 4HI, 4LO, whatever. And it is NOT mutually exclusive with LSD. It's also an LSD. No reason not to get it. Please get it.

No reason not to get it in a new truck, I wouldn't pass on a used truck that I liked just because it didn't have it.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong...The electronic locker will disengage once you hit 15-20 mph? Also, the electronic locker is a more rigid lock up than the LSD?

Correct, much more rigid. It is a true locker.

Makes sense...especially in a worst case scenario...one tire on ice and one tire on dry pavement. And the safety override at speed would help keep people from wrecking their driveline if they forgot to unlock it.


Thanks Ron94150.

It's pretty slick feature to have, I was surprised how quickly too it locks up the diff.