Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L)
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L) Diesel Topics Only

Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 04:00 PM
FORDF250HDXLT's Avatar
FORDF250HDXLT FORDF250HDXLT is offline
Diesel Junkie
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,877
FORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud of
air conditioning '93 = R12?

oops air conditioning that is.

ok.so with some searching,i have discovered that it looks like i have the old school a/c system correct?
it also looks like the conversion to r134a (to do it correctly) requires some upgrades,and not just seals and o-rings.
doesnt seem worth it to me,not by a long shot.
sooooooo.
i got looking deeper,and in my searches,i found this works just fine,and is 100% compatable to the oil and stuff that may already be in there:
Amazon.com: Freeze-12 Refrigerant R12 AC Replacement 12oz. Cans: Automotive

i also guess id need some of this:
Amazon.com: Freeze-12 AC Oil Charge R12 Refrigerant Replacement: Automotive

and i see a kit:
Amazon.com: Freeze-12 Refrigerant Quick Charge Kit R12 Replacement: Automotive

what i didnt find out,is how much of these things i need to charge my a/c?
to kit,or not to kit? lol.or the kit,and more of one or two of each of the other.
can someone help me determine how much i need of this stuff?
thanks!

a/c doesn't work period.and haven't tested anything.the compressor does spin when a/c is selected.
i guess i should have the system tested for leaks first? can i do this myself somehow without using refrigerant to find out if it leaks or not lol.
__________________
♠ Log Truck: '93 F-Super Duty (F450) XLT 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 5:13, Dually, 16' Dump ♠
♠ Chip Truck: '93 F250HD XLT 4x4 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 3.55, Dually, 9' Dump, & Plow ♠

Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 04:02 PM
oreocreaming's Avatar
oreocreaming oreocreaming is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: madera, ca
Posts: 4,308
oreocreaming is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
you will be fine on the cheap. drain your system.... get the 134 nipples, thread them on. get 2 cans of "first charge" its got the oil in it. then 2 cans of freon.
__________________
1990 F-350 LARIAT 4x4 7.3L IDI diesel ZF5. 1992 front with cowl induction hood, 1997 doors and tailgate. 2004 6.0l intercooler, PSD heated power and signal mirrors. AMSOIL bypass system, full synthetic system. 5.38's, 46" tires, 20" wheels, 12" lift with shackle reversal front, shackle flip rear. Ladder bars in the rear, 2" hydraulic assist steering, hydroboost brakes, onboard dual compressor air system. twin air horns, black interior, 100 gallon in-bed tank. 94 IDI-T motor, SMF conversion.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 04:23 PM
FORDF250HDXLT's Avatar
FORDF250HDXLT FORDF250HDXLT is offline
Diesel Junkie
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,877
FORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud of
Quote:
Originally Posted by oreocreaming View Post
you will be fine on the cheap. drain your system.... get the 134 nipples, thread them on. get 2 cans of "first charge" its got the oil in it. then 2 cans of freon.
im going to avoid that.through my searching the a/c guys claim just swapping in r134a into an r12 system call it the black death conversion lol.turns everything inside black,and eventually just kills the system.
for a full conversion,a lot is need.
if this was an old beater i wouldn't even think twice about it though.but seeing how im pretty much doing a full,not resto really,but a decent "full back to life/almost new" '93 truck repair,that i plan on keeping for 10 yrs or so,that r12 stuff seems like just the ticket to me.
so i take it then based on that amount,would just that kit be enough for everything id need? $45 bucks,and id be keeping my cool.sounds pretty dang reasonable to me.
__________________
♠ Log Truck: '93 F-Super Duty (F450) XLT 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 5:13, Dually, 16' Dump ♠
♠ Chip Truck: '93 F250HD XLT 4x4 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 3.55, Dually, 9' Dump, & Plow ♠

Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 04:31 PM
benbe71 benbe71 is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Tacoma, wa
Posts: 73
benbe71 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Well if you did you a R-134 conversion you would just have to drain the system of the oil and the refrigerant, pull a vaccum for 15-30 mins, this will get boil off whatever's left in the lines. See if it holds a vacuum in case there are any leaks fill it with oil thats R134 Specific ester oil I believe and refrigerant. Put new fittings on as well and you're done.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 08:12 PM
dyoungen dyoungen is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Perry Georgia
Posts: 942
dyoungen is starting off with a positive reputation.
I had my 1987 F250 with the 6.9 n/a converted a few years ago from R12 to R134. James did clean the system with a special cleaner and change out the dryer then completely vacuum the system and then charge the system with R134 and the required amount of oil. He explained that the molecules (sp?) of R134 are smaller than R12 and if the system was leaking with R12 it would leaker much faster with R134. Since he converted it I have had to change one pressure switch and a couple of "O" rings. Also my compressor has had a very small leak which I have to recharge the whole system about every 15 months or so. I asked him about changing the compressor but he said that a new compressor was about $800.00 and it costs less than $50.00 to recharge the system. To the best of my knowledge this was all that was done as I stayed and watched but this was about 5 years ago. Also the fittings for the high and low pressure lines had to be changed.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 08:21 PM
FORDF250HDXLT's Avatar
FORDF250HDXLT FORDF250HDXLT is offline
Diesel Junkie
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,877
FORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud of
yeah,im not really interested in changing it over(since this stuff is on the market.)im just wondering how much of this new r12-freeze id need, oil and refrigerant.
im kinda getting the impression this stuff isn't worth a damn? lol.if its compatible,and under 100 bucks for a total recharge,i guess im not seeing the drawbacks here.
__________________
♠ Log Truck: '93 F-Super Duty (F450) XLT 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 5:13, Dually, 16' Dump ♠
♠ Chip Truck: '93 F250HD XLT 4x4 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 3.55, Dually, 9' Dump, & Plow ♠

Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 09:15 PM
dyoungen dyoungen is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Perry Georgia
Posts: 942
dyoungen is starting off with a positive reputation.
R12 will cost you a small fortune just to recharge. I forget what it cost to change mine over to 134.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 10:16 PM
kenpobuck's Avatar
kenpobuck kenpobuck is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Dry Ridge, KY
Posts: 2,757
kenpobuck is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.kenpobuck is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
I think that what he wants to know is if this stuff works. It seems that it is a replacement for r12 so you don't have to convert the system. It may be worth your while to do a little research on this stuff and see what people have to say about it. This time of year most shops will charge a small fortune just to recharge a r134 system cuase they know people want their ac working.
__________________
DON'T BUY IT ..FAB IT!!!!
81 BRONCO 6.9 IDI, ARP headstuds, 3" dual straight pipes, isspro pyrometer, T18 4 Speed, 10.25 rear, d60 front, 4:10 gears, 37x12.5x16.5 wrangler m/t's (humvee takeoffs), 4" body lift. I am building the Bronco Ford should have!
Kentucky Chapter Member
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 07-11-2010, 10:51 PM
FORDF250HDXLT's Avatar
FORDF250HDXLT FORDF250HDXLT is offline
Diesel Junkie
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 11,877
FORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud ofFORDF250HDXLT has much to be proud of
i found it:
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/97...r-the-a-c.html

but thanks guys.
__________________
♠ Log Truck: '93 F-Super Duty (F450) XLT 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 5:13, Dually, 16' Dump ♠
♠ Chip Truck: '93 F250HD XLT 4x4 1st Gen Navistar 444ci IDI Diesel w/ Intercooled 2nd Gen Banks Sidewinder Turbo, E40D, 3.55, Dually, 9' Dump, & Plow ♠

Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 07-12-2010, 06:40 AM
mistakenID mistakenID is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: West Valley Utah
Posts: 1,627
mistakenID is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.mistakenID is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
I've been using a Freeze 12 type refrigerant the past 5-6 years in my 86 Ford, dads 87 Ford and in my Fiero. It does a very good job. Air at the vents is 36 to 38 degrees.

The Pontiac has a very slow leak in the system and I bought 1 can of the stuff that stopped leaks of that type. I did have to add a bit more last summer.

I did not just add to system though. Evacuated the systems, pulled a vacuum for 30 mins then added the refrigerant. Very satisfied with the result. Both Fords will have my wife either putting on a jacket or pleading to turn it down.

These old trucks really have a good heat and air conditioning system. Seldom have to run heat more than on low.
__________________
86 F-250 4x4
Cummins BT 5.9
GearVendor O/D
Dads 87 F-250
4x4-5sp 6.9 Turbo
73,000 original miles
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 07-12-2010, 09:22 AM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport tjc transport is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital
Posts: 32,195
tjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputation
freeze 12 works just like R-12 freon.
i have been using it for years also.
i put in whatever is called for in R-12. 36 ounces of R-12??
i put in 36 ounces of freeze 12 after pulling vacuum and checking for leaks.
__________________
Tom

rarely in life do you meet a person that will drop everything to help a stranger,
and give the shirt off his back to a friend.
Steve Price was that kind of person.
Godspeed "window licker", the short bus will never be the same with you gone.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 07-12-2010, 11:08 AM
starmilt starmilt is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Faibanks Ak.
Posts: 10,503
starmilt has a very good reputation on FTE.starmilt has a very good reputation on FTE.starmilt has a very good reputation on FTE.
I have used freeze 12 and it works. I have changed all my stuff to 134 though.
If you are going to use freeze 12 clean the system first and don't mix it with r12, I tried this a couple of times and never had any luck. I have had good luck with just cleaning the system and new orings when changing over to 134.
__________________
absolutely no dodges.
to many fords to list.
one town car.sold
If it breaks because of my advice
you can keep both halves
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2010, 11:00 AM
Fordranchero's Avatar
Fordranchero Fordranchero is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Huntsville,Ont.
Posts: 275
Fordranchero is starting off with a positive reputation.
Duracool is a direct replacement, get the gauge with it, it's the sure way to know what you are doing.
it's an idiot proof set up, also they have a sealant you can get to start with.
Unless your system has been empty for a while you can just let the current charge out (oh no! I'm depleting the Ozone!) and recharge.
I have found that with duracool i get better cooling at lower head pressure.
All this business of incompatibility is bull in my opinion, I have checked with the manufacturers and as long as you have'nt lost oil from the system you are good to go.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2010, 11:42 AM
tjc transport's Avatar
tjc transport tjc transport is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Marlboro Mental Hospital
Posts: 32,195
tjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputationtjc transport has a superb reputation
if you do the cheapo box store conversion that adds the fittings and 134-a to a R-12 system , within one year you will get the "black death" and end up spending a few grand to get the system completely flushed and most parts replaced, because the 134-a and R-12 are NOT compatable.
__________________
Tom

rarely in life do you meet a person that will drop everything to help a stranger,
and give the shirt off his back to a friend.
Steve Price was that kind of person.
Godspeed "window licker", the short bus will never be the same with you gone.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 07-14-2010, 01:07 PM
swooshcmk swooshcmk is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: West Bend
Posts: 949
swooshcmk is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjc transport View Post
if you do the cheapo box store conversion that adds the fittings and 134-a to a R-12 system , within one year you will get the "black death" and end up spending a few grand to get the system completely flushed and most parts replaced, because the 134-a and R-12 are NOT compatable.

Well dang, I guess that buick I converted is running on over 4 years of borrowed time then!

Bottom line - you have to use stuff that's compatible. R12 and R134 use different oils. You wouldn't put ATF in your engine and expect it to run just as before would ya? There's a simple fix for that though... drain the oil! I don't really see it as a big deal. Heck if the systems not been changed/charged in it's lifetime it's the original oil yet - how's that for a oil change interval. The oil is cheap, and it's not really that hard to drain it. R12 systems run a mineral oil. R134 systems run an Ester or PAG oil.

Accumulator (receiver dryer) Ok so they're like 50 bucks or so. Yeah it costs enough, but that thing's been zapping moisture out of the a/c system for 20 years How's that 20 year old air filter working out for ya? R134 uses a different dessicant inside than the R12 systems R134 systems use an XH7 or XH9 dessicant and is backwards compatible with R12. R12 systems use an XH5 dessicant and is not R134 compatible.

Those 2 items are darn near just maintenance items on vehicles as old as ours! After you knock out those two issues you're just a few o-rings shy of a full R134 conversion. Likely the "black death" is due to people charging them with R134 without changing to the proper oil or swapping out the accumulator for a compatible model..

And why would an a/c shop ever say "Oh yeah that stuff I charge an arm and a leg for you can do yourself at home in 20 minutes for 30 bucks"
Reply With Quote
Old 07-14-2010, 01:07 PM
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L)

Tags
1992, 92, 93, ac, chart, conversion, diesel, f150, f250, f250r12, ford, pull, r134, refrigerant, vacuum

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:09 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup