Ok, I am moving forward researching possibilities for the 48 f6 I have fallen in love with. On an earlier post I was given considerable information as to what the truck was originally from serial numbers etc. thanks to all who responded. I have lurked for a couple of weeks reading all I could on AOD swaps, "widow makers", engines, etc.

The real question now is economy of driving. I am looking for an economical set up for a bigger truck. I have to get better gas mileage and lots more comfort out of something that can be showed as a Fire vehicle. I am just a poor boy who has to connive funding from the budget for my toys and the budget gets smaller every year. Before everybody yells there is no such thing as an economical big truck, a quick background history. I have driven over sized trucks since 1975. I currently have 3 fire trucks that on a good day get 4 MPH, (48 Seagrave); 6MPG, (44 Seagrave) and 10 MPG, 1922 Chevy. Dad has a 76 Ford COE that gets 5 MPG. 44seagrave on photobucket should show photos if you like that sort of thing. So I know big trucks are expensive. Try to find a water pump for a 1948 V12 Seagrave motor. The 44 has a 427 TD and Allison automatic behind it that I had put in. I don't do mechanical work normally.

This truck I am looking at was a fire truck, 1948 f-6. The current owner likes to modify things and sell them. He cut out most of the back and using parts of the fire truck made a 7 1/2 ft pick up bed behind the cab. The truck is now 19 ft. long with a wheel base of 126". 8.25 20 tires and original 2 speed rear end. Don't know which one yet. Motor was changed 15 years ago to a 292 y block. Has a 4 speed manual behind it that I don't know if it was original or not.

I intend to tow the 22 Chevy on a flat bed trailer behind the 48 Ford to shows. I need to travel 60 MPH and get the best gas mileage possible. This will be a 3 - 5 year conversion as I save the money but I have to be done before I retire so I can afford it. I need to add power steering and A/C also. I would like to install an AOD transmission and leave the 292. Other Ford motors would be considered but I will only power it with Ford. I will dress up the motor to look cool. I am toying with a 6 pack for the 292 for example. All parts will be from the junk yard unless only available new.

Now here is the bucket of bolts dropped on the floor. What combination of motor, trans and rear end would give me highway speeds, A/C, Power Steering, Cool Looks and sound with 15+ MPG. I would prefer to leave the two speed and 292 there. Can it be done?

All ideas will be considered as I believe discussion leads to knowledge and with knowledge good ideas happen.
Thanks for your knowledge and advice. I plan on picking up the truck in 10 days or walking away from it. Your input and knowledge will be a big help in deciding if it follows me home. Dave

 

Was this truck on Ebay recently?

 

yes it has been listed twice.

 

Hey Dave and welcome, theres alot of smart folks on here who can help ya out. I'm not an expert by any means but with what your looking for and to get out of this. My guess would be maybe you can find you a latemodel 1995 F350 dually and use the drivetrain out of that or something like that. It would have all the stuff your looking for and I'm pretty sure you can find all those parts in the salvage yards pretty easy.

 

Just a note of warning the AOD needs tailshaft lubrication mods for gear ratios 4.10 and lower (numerically higher).

 

The 292 was never known as an economy engine on it's best of days, and towing with it will likely IMHO give worse economy than driving the 22.
I'd suggest biting the bullet and installing a late model diesel and drive train with an OD tranny. You don't say where you live, but if towing over hills is involved good luck with getting 15MPG.
How do you plan on showing this cut up assembly as a fire vehicle since it never existed in this configuration? Or do your shows have a class for "phantom" (vehicles that never actually existed but might have) vehicles?
Old fire vehicles don't seem to be very rare or expensive, why do you want to start with a fire truck that has been chopped up into something else then convert it back to a fire truck? Seems to be a round about route to the end.

 

Didn't know about the tailshaft lub issue. Good to know.

I am in the mid west. The truck will show as a hose wagon with no modifications needed as it sits now. Many departments took old pumpers and changed them to haul hose or other equipment. Big cities ordered new trucks set up to haul hose only so the truck looks like it was built that way originally. The Fire musters I have attended don't have classes like car shows. Car or truck shows don't usually have classes for Fire trucks so they get lumped in with all others.

I have thought about chucking the whole drive train and going with a different engine, trans, and rear axle. I did that with the motor and trans on the 44 because it didn't have the original drive train when I got it. If this had the original flat head I would not change it. But, it is not original so why not consider all options. I am not fond of Diesels. Had one that ran 260,000 miles no issue in a van. But it wasn't the gas engine roar. If I didn't want economy it would have a 460. The diesel is on my possibility list because of its economy and it is available in wrecked Pick-ups.

Thanks for the input so far.

 

I have a '56 with a 272HD and a heavy duty 5-speed transmission... and a 2 speed rear end. Can't tell you what gas mileage is like, I literally just got back on the road today... but I can tell you once you hear a y-block run like it should, it's very very difficult to even think about putting anything else in there, I've never heard anything like it. I was going to put a fuel injected 351w in mine, but I'll probably always keep a Y-block now that I've really heard it run, it's very unique.

Gas mileage is always going to be an issue with it, but I figure insurance for the whole year only costs $140, so I can make some of that up from there, lol

There are a couple of Big Truck guys on here that really know their stuff, if there is a way to get decent gas mileage from a y-block, they'll know. Btw, in your searching it should help to note that the '48 i believe had a Flathead, not a y-block, I thought the y-blocks started popping in around '53, but I could be wrong (someone here will know for sure), it's just helpful to remember that when you're looking for parts or information.

 

It came with a flat head originally but they changed it to a 57 292 y block. Sound is important to me so mileage may go out the window and just set it up for the most efficiency possible. Then I have to come up with another story to tell the wife why I spent all this money to save $200.00 a year in fuel.

 

I like those old y blocks, first learned how to drive in my dads a 64 292 ford pickup. 4.10 gears may not be a problem with your tall tires on that fire truck running the aod. as far as engine efficiency goes, the y block will respond well to higher compression and if you want to go that way, throttle body fuel injection, you can by them from several places or build your own from the junkyard. i have a few friends that have done that with good results on various types of engines. There are sites that go into detail about using junkyard fuel injection parts, may be some threads on fte ?

 

I have 5.83 in my truck for the high gear and 38" tires, drives just fine around town, feels normal. Haven't tried to get it on the freeway though, I imagine I'll max out at 60mph. If you have 4.10s and the same size wheels you should be able to get more speed out of it. You could put in an AOD tranny and probably see even better mileage on the highway.

 

X2, the other side of my car obsession coin is the Cummins engine. I know you said only Ford powerplants were allowed, but Ford runs the Cummins in their medium duty trucks because it's rated as a medium duty engine and the powerstroke is not, does that count?

Seriously though, to answer your question of "can I tow and get 15mpg's?" I would say definitely not with a gasser, maybe with a diesel. Someone suggested swapping parts from a '95 dually, but i'm quite sure that no gas powered dually in '95 ever peaked above 15mpg's very often and that's driving empty and only carrying a pickup body, not a medium duty truck body towing another complete medium duty truck.

 

Cummings count

 

Howdy,


I am doing exactly what you want to do.


I have a 5.83/8.11:1 2 speed axle that's going into my 55 F-600.

There's an automatic trans that's going in it too.

I really don't think you'll get an AOD to survive behind any engine in a big truck unless you spend a lot of money on it (or buy one of the "bullet-proof" ones for racing) [Note that FORD NEVER put an AOD in a big truck F250/350/450/550 etc......that's why they developed the E4OD/4R100]


The F-600 (like the F-6) is rated at about 16,000 GVW and with a trailer and vehicle on the trailer, you're going to be towing a LOT of weight. There's going to be NO "good" gas mileage there!!!


I'm also using a completely rebuilt 292.... I thought about using a Cummins (6BT) engine. I wanted to keep the Y-block sound. I'm not going to be using this truck as a daily drive-to-work truck!!!


The transmission is an E4OD removed from a 1994 F-450 Superduty truck (also rated at about 16,000 LBS GVW) The one that this trans came out of routinely had a GCVW of about 22,000 lbs....Truck/service bed/equipment trailer/mini-excavator

You'll also need something for a parking brake. (none of the F-6/600's have wheel mounted parking brakes.)

Here's what I'm using.




The E4OD has a final ratio of 0.71:1

With the 5.83:1 rear ratio and nearly 40" tires (9.00-20 radials), I'll get 2100 RPM at 60mph(torque converter-locked).

That will be on the flat (empty)...... If I have any weight on the back, I probably will not be able to run in OD. Then my RPM will be around 2900-3000 RPM (at 60.....)


I also have a complete power steering setup from a newer F-600. I'm matching up the pulleys right now and will probably also be using a newer GM type hydraulic powered "power" brake setup too.


Since the E4OD is electronically controlled, I have to have a "BOX" to operate it. I'm using a Baumann controller. The controller MUST know where your foot (throttle) is..... I'm using a new Holley #0-8007 390 CFM 4160 type carburetor and Holley TPS


It's truck, not a hotrod, So I didn't choose biggest baddest carb!


I love pipe-dreams!!


cheers,


Rick


ADDENDUM: My second choice for an engine was a well built 300+ (cu-in) inline 6.

That with a ZF 5 speed trans (and parking brake assy) would also work pretty nice!!

That way you also don't have to mess with an expensive trans adapter/electronic controller and other "stuff"!


///

 

Yes, the 300-6 is a great engine and will pull a house to boot. I guess we need to re-address what you want. How "make or break" is this mileage goal for you? The 300-6 will pull plenty good and get decent mileage, in fact, make that my vote for gas powered engine for your truck, but 15mpg's in a large truck towing a large truck...