Snow Plow?
#16
06-08-2010, 09:38 PM
Your question is a loaded one, and while I could spend the next 4 hours typing an essay, I'm still not going to be able to instill all the knowledge you would need, but I'll list a few points.
Best advice, work for someone else for a year to see if you like it. I know it seems easy to hang a plow on a truck, but that's an extremely small piece of the winter services puzzle. You need hands on experience to learn the ropes, there's no substitute for experience.
Plows killing trucks? Hogwash. We just parted out a 77 chev that plowed and towed bobcats nearly it's whole life. Drivers kill trucks. Yes, hanging a plow on any truck will accelerate front end wear, but not to the point that your truck is "trashed at 50k". If one of my trucks were "trashed at 50k", my driver would be looking for a new job. ChargersFanInCO: I believe that your F150 had issues. 1/2 ton trucks are too light for plowing, and should not be used to plow anything more than a small driveway, they're just not made for it.
2 of my trucks are dedicated plow trucks, they sit in storage all summer. Yes, snow can be lucrative enough in the right market. Its taken me many years to find and retain a customer base that appreciates high quality work and are willing to pay for it. Unfortunately, 75% of customers out there will go with the low price, regardless of contractor reputation. Then of course they're unhappy with the service they receive and end up playing musical contractors every year. The Walmart mentality is very promininant in the snow business, and it's extremely difficult to break customers of it.
Spreading salt kills trucks? Again, hogwash. Driving around early in the morning in the crap is what does them in. Any plow truck that spends time on the roads early in the day when road crews are dumping excessive chemicals are going to have corrosion issues. My trucks that spread salt look no different than those that don't. Those that have posted they hate salting are either lacking experience, are in the wrong market, or haven't properly sold the service. I make more on salt, with 1/2 the manpower and equipment than I do plowing. Not to mention, car washes are way cheaper than front end components. I'll take an ice event over a plowable event any day of the week!
As for your front suspension if you do decide to put a plow on it; I'm a huge proponent of air bags. Spend the money and do it right. Timbrens result in a horendous ride on a Ford. Timbrens make Chevy's ride like Fords, and Fords ride like lumber wagons. Problem is they result in premature rebound unloaded, which makes the ride very harsh and unpredictable on rough roads. I've only upgraded the springs on my 05, simply because the air bags for 05 and up Fords only add 1k lbs capacity, and it runs a larger plow than it should (8611lp with some upgrades resulting in about 1200lbs hanging off the front). The 01 and 03 trucks have front air bags with no other spring upgrades, but the air bags on those trucks are 3k bags, and they're never run all the way full, they add way more capacity than whats needed on those 2.
BigRuth, I'm going to try to be gentle... Ok, no I'm not, your advice is assinine at best. Flag-downs and door knocking is a huge liability, and $300 a snowstorm won't pay for the equipment, much less the proper insurance.
Jrfish007: You have to spend it to make it. I spend an average of $6000 per plow, per truck, purchased new. I'm running blizzard plows with are the most efficient and reliable plows I've ever used. Efficiency is the biggest thing in commercial work. You simply cannot charge more money than what the customer is will to pay, so in order to make more money, you have to be more efficient. If a guy is subbing and getting paid by the hour, a Meyers is a good investment.
smlford: You forgot the standard warning with the link. There's a lot of morons on plowsite, you have to be smart enough over there to pull the good info out from within all the immature and bad advice given there.
This is a tough business with a high failure rate. It's also not as lucrative as it should be, because so many "plowers" treat it as a "side business" and aren't charging the rates they should. Very common amongst landscapers to charge only enough to cover their expenses through the winter, they do poor quality work, and are hard to compete with because we're not on an even playing field. Alot of these idiots are charging $40-$50/hour, where the professionals are up in the $150-$200 range.
Best advice, work for someone else for a year to see if you like it. I know it seems easy to hang a plow on a truck, but that's an extremely small piece of the winter services puzzle. You need hands on experience to learn the ropes, there's no substitute for experience.
Plows killing trucks? Hogwash. We just parted out a 77 chev that plowed and towed bobcats nearly it's whole life. Drivers kill trucks. Yes, hanging a plow on any truck will accelerate front end wear, but not to the point that your truck is "trashed at 50k". If one of my trucks were "trashed at 50k", my driver would be looking for a new job. ChargersFanInCO: I believe that your F150 had issues. 1/2 ton trucks are too light for plowing, and should not be used to plow anything more than a small driveway, they're just not made for it.
2 of my trucks are dedicated plow trucks, they sit in storage all summer. Yes, snow can be lucrative enough in the right market. Its taken me many years to find and retain a customer base that appreciates high quality work and are willing to pay for it. Unfortunately, 75% of customers out there will go with the low price, regardless of contractor reputation. Then of course they're unhappy with the service they receive and end up playing musical contractors every year. The Walmart mentality is very promininant in the snow business, and it's extremely difficult to break customers of it.
Spreading salt kills trucks? Again, hogwash. Driving around early in the morning in the crap is what does them in. Any plow truck that spends time on the roads early in the day when road crews are dumping excessive chemicals are going to have corrosion issues. My trucks that spread salt look no different than those that don't. Those that have posted they hate salting are either lacking experience, are in the wrong market, or haven't properly sold the service. I make more on salt, with 1/2 the manpower and equipment than I do plowing. Not to mention, car washes are way cheaper than front end components. I'll take an ice event over a plowable event any day of the week!
As for your front suspension if you do decide to put a plow on it; I'm a huge proponent of air bags. Spend the money and do it right. Timbrens result in a horendous ride on a Ford. Timbrens make Chevy's ride like Fords, and Fords ride like lumber wagons. Problem is they result in premature rebound unloaded, which makes the ride very harsh and unpredictable on rough roads. I've only upgraded the springs on my 05, simply because the air bags for 05 and up Fords only add 1k lbs capacity, and it runs a larger plow than it should (8611lp with some upgrades resulting in about 1200lbs hanging off the front). The 01 and 03 trucks have front air bags with no other spring upgrades, but the air bags on those trucks are 3k bags, and they're never run all the way full, they add way more capacity than whats needed on those 2.
BigRuth, I'm going to try to be gentle... Ok, no I'm not, your advice is assinine at best. Flag-downs and door knocking is a huge liability, and $300 a snowstorm won't pay for the equipment, much less the proper insurance.
Jrfish007: You have to spend it to make it. I spend an average of $6000 per plow, per truck, purchased new. I'm running blizzard plows with are the most efficient and reliable plows I've ever used. Efficiency is the biggest thing in commercial work. You simply cannot charge more money than what the customer is will to pay, so in order to make more money, you have to be more efficient. If a guy is subbing and getting paid by the hour, a Meyers is a good investment.
smlford: You forgot the standard warning with the link. There's a lot of morons on plowsite, you have to be smart enough over there to pull the good info out from within all the immature and bad advice given there.
This is a tough business with a high failure rate. It's also not as lucrative as it should be, because so many "plowers" treat it as a "side business" and aren't charging the rates they should. Very common amongst landscapers to charge only enough to cover their expenses through the winter, they do poor quality work, and are hard to compete with because we're not on an even playing field. Alot of these idiots are charging $40-$50/hour, where the professionals are up in the $150-$200 range.
#17
06-08-2010, 09:49 PM
Thanks for the replies everyone!
As I figured there is a LOT involved in something like this. I think I'm pretty well aware of what plowing does to a truck. I expect that if I were to hang a plow on it I could see suspension and driveline component failure sooner than usual, and as such I would have to charge enough to cover depreciation as well as the increased wear and tear on the equipment.
What I'm looking for is for a small side business, preferably as a sub contractor for someone who knows the business well. I'd like to be able to learn to do the job well, pay off the equipment purchase in a couple years, and maybe make a few bucks in the process.
I have very limited plowing experience and admit that I have LOTS to learn. Anyone know where I could find someone in the area to talk to?
Again, thanks for all the replies!
As I figured there is a LOT involved in something like this. I think I'm pretty well aware of what plowing does to a truck. I expect that if I were to hang a plow on it I could see suspension and driveline component failure sooner than usual, and as such I would have to charge enough to cover depreciation as well as the increased wear and tear on the equipment.
What I'm looking for is for a small side business, preferably as a sub contractor for someone who knows the business well. I'd like to be able to learn to do the job well, pay off the equipment purchase in a couple years, and maybe make a few bucks in the process.
I have very limited plowing experience and admit that I have LOTS to learn. Anyone know where I could find someone in the area to talk to?
Again, thanks for all the replies!
#18
06-09-2010, 08:07 AM
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Jrfish007: You have to spend it to make it. I spend an average of $6000 per plow, per truck, purchased new. I'm running blizzard plows with are the most efficient and reliable plows I've ever used. Efficiency is the biggest thing in commercial work. You simply cannot charge more money than what the customer is will to pay, so in order to make more money, you have to be more efficient. If a guy is subbing and getting paid by the hour, a Meyers is a good investment.
That being said, I did have 1 "client" who would called me at 3am to plow, I did it once and told her to find some else. After that I had no desire to get into that industry, leave it to the pros.
Besides, my new moto is: "Why do I need to plow, my truck makes it through the snow?"
#19
06-09-2010, 10:18 AM
Senior User
Up here, seems like every block has at least one house with an old, junky snow plow sitting in the driveway. So it almost becomes natural to associate snow plowing with junk trucks. However, its probably more of a cause and effect thing at work. Most of these are part time, second or third vehicle, residential plows - and they were purchased specifically for that purpose. The owners intentionally went out and found the junkiest, cheapest truck available, and after hanging a plow on the front continue to treat the truck that way. Any truck treated like a beater will end up looking like one - plow or not!
I just purchased a decent (not junk) used F250 for a plow, but I intend to take care of it. My wife jokes that I have the nicest looking plow truck in Anchorage! There is some truth to that because all of the neighbor's plow trucks look like rust buckets. But this is intentional due to neglect, not an inherent result of plowing.
Pros tend to treat their equipment differently. Up here, a good, used snow plow fetches a high premium.
I just purchased a decent (not junk) used F250 for a plow, but I intend to take care of it. My wife jokes that I have the nicest looking plow truck in Anchorage! There is some truth to that because all of the neighbor's plow trucks look like rust buckets. But this is intentional due to neglect, not an inherent result of plowing.
Pros tend to treat their equipment differently. Up here, a good, used snow plow fetches a high premium.
#20
06-09-2010, 10:45 AM
Have you tried the Timbrens on a leaf spring set up? I'm looking to run the snow plow prep springs on my 250 V10 to go along with my new Boss 9' 2" VX-T, and I was also going to add in Timbrens. What are your thoughts. Honestly, don't want to spend the money on air bags. Just not worth it in my case in the long run.
#21
06-09-2010, 11:53 AM
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"Myers I don't like, good for a guy who just does his house, they flip the mold board forward when they catch and that makes for poor ability to stack."
Depends on the Meyers mold board. The Diamond Series has an edge trip. I've used a Meyers for the past 2 New Hampshire winters. I don't do it as a business, just my 20,000 sq ft driveway/parking area and a few neighbors. I only have the plow on when plowing. The EZ Mount makes on and off a 5 minute proposition.
Make sure you counterweight the back of the truck, behind the rear axle, with the same amount of weight as your blade/hydraulics. Helps ensure proper brake performance. I put 400lbs of tube sand in the bed when I plow. Yes, it's work to load and unload, but I count that as a gym visit.
Depends on the Meyers mold board. The Diamond Series has an edge trip. I've used a Meyers for the past 2 New Hampshire winters. I don't do it as a business, just my 20,000 sq ft driveway/parking area and a few neighbors. I only have the plow on when plowing. The EZ Mount makes on and off a 5 minute proposition.
Make sure you counterweight the back of the truck, behind the rear axle, with the same amount of weight as your blade/hydraulics. Helps ensure proper brake performance. I put 400lbs of tube sand in the bed when I plow. Yes, it's work to load and unload, but I count that as a gym visit.
#22
06-09-2010, 01:14 PM
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Join Date: May 2010
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Up here, seems like every block has at least one house with an old, junky snow plow sitting in the driveway. So it almost becomes natural to associate snow plowing with junk trucks. However, its probably more of a cause and effect thing at work. Most of these are part time, second or third vehicle, residential plows - and they were purchased specifically for that purpose. The owners intentionally went out and found the junkiest, cheapest truck available, and after hanging a plow on the front continue to treat the truck that way. Any truck treated like a beater will end up looking like one - plow or not!
I just purchased a decent (not junk) used F250 for a plow, but I intend to take care of it. My wife jokes that I have the nicest looking plow truck in Anchorage! There is some truth to that because all of the neighbor's plow trucks look like rust buckets. But this is intentional due to neglect, not an inherent result of plowing.
Pros tend to treat their equipment differently. Up here, a good, used snow plow fetches a high premium.
I just purchased a decent (not junk) used F250 for a plow, but I intend to take care of it. My wife jokes that I have the nicest looking plow truck in Anchorage! There is some truth to that because all of the neighbor's plow trucks look like rust buckets. But this is intentional due to neglect, not an inherent result of plowing.
Pros tend to treat their equipment differently. Up here, a good, used snow plow fetches a high premium.
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