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Old 03-10-2010, 02:58 PM
tommy75703 tommy75703 is offline
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Please Read: 2004 Ford F150 Cam Phaser / VCT Solenoid / Sludge?

First off i would like to say hello to everyone reading this i live in a little place called Tyler, TX with a Ford dealership that is named after the city! I just wanted to say that and you might understand why later in this thread. I hope this helps someone!

I have recently have an issue with my 2004 F150 FX4 with the 5.4L just hit 75k miles. I started idleing rough and also on aceleration, check engine light came on and i was right in front of the "City Name Here" Ford Dealership, so i pulled in. First mistake! I left it for the to diag, and recieved a call later that day saying it was the cam phasers and they both needed to be replaced $1300, $300 if i wanted to pick it up now. Needless to say i had to sleep on that so the next morning i called around and after the 300 i would pay them and getting it towed ect it would have cost me more. So i decieded to let them do the work. Second mistake! They removed the valve covers and i recieved another call saying that i needed a new engine because of sludge, or they couldnt waranty any work cause it would happen again! Well after laughing at the $6500 and making a trip to see it myself, I spoke with them and they said the phasers were bad timming chain needed replaced, guides, tensionors, ect. I saw the sludge and took a few pics talked to another mechanic, he said it was more sludge that normal but the galleys should be fine. I am $600 dollars in if I want to pick it up as is, so i make the decision to let them do ther phaser and timing work hoping this just fixes everything for $2200, cause i dont have any money and this was gonna max my credit card. After they replace the parts and got it back together i got a call saying it was throwing the same codes, and ran the exact same! Ok by this time i am freaking out, I just went up there thinking well i should have paid the 600 and sold it at auction. I picked up the truck and paid them the $2200. I was so sure that the sludge wasnt that bad and they had to be wrong! I started calling other auto places and asking questions and searching online for everything i could find ont he 2004 Ford 5.4, dang there are lots of issues with phasers and other timming parts. So just the let everyone know I AM NOT a mechanic I work on software and computers, dont even own a socket set!

I made the decision to call back to the dealer with the information I had learned on the web and asked about those codes it was "throwing". I was told.....

P300 ramdon misfire
P305 Bank 2 cyl5
P306 Bank 2 cyl6
P308 Bank 2 cyl8
and P22??? something to do with the cam phaser position i think???

Armed with this new information i searched all night learning and learning. i came to the conclusion that the "City Name Here" Ford Dealership Service Dept. had been wrong. So in the morning I called to speak with the service manager, told him how unhappy i was and that i think they may have overlooked something and asked if they wanted a chance to make it right. He declined! Told me he was aware of my engine and it was all because of sludge. Moving on i call right back to the "City Name Here" Ford Dealer parts dept and asked if they had a 6M280 "VCT solenoid".

This link explains everything
VCT Solenoid

I was told 1 in stock so I sent my girlfriend on her lunch break to pick it up, while I got some loaner tools from my neigbor. This took me less than 15 min to change and cost $140 with tax. I knew as soon as i pulled the old one out it was bad screens broke ect...

MY TRUCK RUNS PERFECT! Like brand new!!!!!

Needless to say I made my first trip to the "City Name Here" Ford Dealer. After very long talks with the Service Director and Manager..... I got a little progress, and i will update this to let everyone know if they are standing behind there work and employees that made the diag from the start missing the whole problem. It would have been so simple to pop this seal and remove the solenoid to at least check it out, AND would have saved me THOUSANDS. I can only hopes this helps someone, please do your homework on a auto repair shop!!! Also please look for the simple things first, and trust noone!


And it stoped ticking after I replace this solenoid...... LOL.

Tyler, TX Ford, Service, phazer, phaser, cam, sludge, new motor, replace motor, oil, Ford Parts, problems 5.4L, V8, Triton, 3v, 2004, VCT, timming solenoid, timming chain, bad service, tyler texas ford bad service, tyler tx ford bad service
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Old 03-10-2010, 04:37 PM
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1bad67sbf 1bad67sbf is offline
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how many miles were you going on oil changes
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Old 03-10-2010, 05:27 PM
tommy75703 tommy75703 is offline
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about 4-5k, crappy places i will buy motorcraft and do it myself in the future.....just cant see them pulling my truck into there shop ever again.
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Old 03-10-2010, 05:40 PM
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im surprised you had a (major) sludge problem. 04-08 have huge oil pans that hold like 8qts. which makes me feel that 5k oil changes are plenty w/ base grade oils
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Old 03-10-2010, 05:50 PM
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Im glad you mentioned this cause I was wondering about the mine the FX4 and the regular 2WD. i noticed the oil pan has a hump in the bottom for the front right drive and was wondering if that would affect how things drain out of the pan. Just a question dont know there is any difference, where is the screen pump ect in relation to this hump?
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Old 03-10-2010, 06:03 PM
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i dont know where the pick up is i have never had the pan off. it should be at the rear of the pan (my guess) and i would not worry about the hump in the pan for draining.
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Old 03-10-2010, 06:12 PM
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Most of the time sludge issues are caused by the type/weight of the oil,Change interval,but most of all short trips.
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Old 03-10-2010, 06:21 PM
tommy75703 tommy75703 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n5926g View Post
Most of the time sludge issues are caused by the type/weight of the oil,Change interval,but most of all short trips.

Guilty last couple of years i moved and only drive about 5 miles to work, I have another car that i drive night and weekends, but before that it was about 17 to work and i didnt have the other car.
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Old 03-10-2010, 06:29 PM
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You need to remember...Oil is thick when cold..the colder the thicker(to a certain point of course),at any rate that short of a trip doesent give the oil a chance to heat up and flow properly...Thusly the sludge issue.I know with fuel prices the way they are,that this suggestion will hurt,but you need to let the truck run,and warm-up about 10 minutes (at least)prior to driving it.This will give the oil(and engine coolant) ample time to warm up,and pretty much eliminate the sludge problem.
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Old 03-10-2010, 07:04 PM
tommy75703 tommy75703 is offline
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uploaded a few photos would love to see peoples thoughts on the sludge and if they think its bad.

Picture 010 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/48305721@N06/4423079609/
Picture 003 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Picture 004 on Flickr - Photo Sharing!
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Old 03-10-2010, 07:29 PM
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how many miles are on the truck and short drives are bad for a motor thats why oil companys put a milage and time period intervals on oil
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Old 03-10-2010, 07:38 PM
RISUPERCREWMAN RISUPERCREWMAN is offline
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Dude that engine is filthy.....
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Old 03-10-2010, 08:11 PM
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I rest my case.......
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Old 03-10-2010, 09:06 PM
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Indeed, that's quite the dirty motor. But I don't think that the short driving interval is completely to blame. It's gotta be wrong weight oil as well. Do you know which brand and weight the place you get it changed at uses?

You've got Bank 2 codes. The P0022 code is caused by a VCT solenoid stuck in the open position. They had all the info they needed to diag the bad solenoid. And if there where no other codes there was no reason to suspect there was anything wrong with the bank 1 cam phaser. Your paperwork from the dealer should detail the codes they pulled and diagnostic process they went through.

They really went the wrong direction and really don't seem to care. Those codes clearly point to a bank 2 issue that could be COPs, plugs, VCT solenoid. I suggest you file a complaint with local chamber of commerce and BBB. Make sure that you emphasize the fact that they wanted to charge you for a new engine because of a bad VCT solenoid. I would also send Ford Corporate a letter as well. This is why we call them "stealerships"! A lesson in Occam's Razor is definitely needed.
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Old 03-10-2010, 09:42 PM
tommy75703 tommy75703 is offline
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Thanks for the input i have plans to meet with David E* the owner on Monday to get this resolved, a few things you said will come in handy during that meeting. Also i clearly states on the invoice customer declined engine!

This was way outside my releam im not a motor guy and never had been, got lucky and was off work for the last couple of days. If i was the average chump that I might have parked it till i could replace the motor thinking they were right all along and should have listened to what they said. The research paided off and with my brain in "learn mode" and a tech background. Google kicks butt if you can just use it, and Ford parts online pretty much gave me the engine diagrams. Makes you wonder what they are using, i personaly picture big chief tablets and crayons. Im just happy to have everything running, and will stress over the money next week. For the oil i always go to the quick lube places and 5-20 is always on the sticker penzoil filter i assume the oil was also. i changed it every 4-5k miles.

not only tried charge me for a new engine but did $2200 in work the was most likely fine for now and another 75k miles. All because they didnt check it. What tipped me of was unpluging it after my research and had no change, plus oil inside the connect thats all weather proff. Also a tip was after talking to another auto repair place was when they said that should be checked first with those codes. I asked him can i tell if it was remove? He say unless they did it while the covers were off, yes you can look for tool mark on the seals they would have been hard to get out after 75k miles on them. i looked no tool marks, and asked the service manager if they were ever check and he said no, when I was offering to let them make it right. Miss diag'd and then OMG sludge......equaled a snowball effect and i was just in deep on money. thanks again


i got my number and addresses to start complaining and getting this noticed froom every angle. Even picked up docs to start a small claims judgment.

Thanks again
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Old 03-10-2010, 09:42 PM
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