15 sec. crank after sitting

RynL88 · #1 (**permalink**) 10-20-2009, 12:17 PM

Hey guys.. got a couple questions here

our 04 developed a very long crank time yesterday.. 15 sec of continuos cranking after sitting 15 min or longer... less than that.. starts right up.
while on a delivery yesterday while enroute i got a "check guages" warning
looked around and found no oil pressure on the "guage".. this while at idle going down hill
step on accelerator and get above 1000 rpms.. oil press shows normal

while truck sat during delivery, very hard to get started.. all of the sudden.. never had this problem before?

hasnt' fixed itself yet...

changed both fuel filters, and looked for crud in hfcm... all looks good

thinkin its an oil problem..

can the low pressure system cause problems in hpop system?

i pulled oil filter out this morning and it was dry... i mean not dripping a drop of oil after it sat overnight.

i played with drain valve...in filter housing.. dunno how to tell if it is working
right or not?

could these two probs be related.. or is it most likely a coincidence and i have hpop leak somwhere

oh and it starts the same whether it sits for 15min or 2hours or overnight
only starts normally if sitting for less than 15 min- hot or cold

fordboy2 · #2 (**permalink**) 10-20-2009, 01:00 PM

this is a guess I wonder if the oil is draining back out of the housing

Toreador_Diesel · #3 (**permalink**) 10-20-2009, 01:54 PM

Sounds like one of your HPOP branch tube developed a leak. Low or no oil pressure point directly to that.

BPofMD · #4 (**permalink**) 10-20-2009, 02:43 PM

What brand oil filter are you using?

RynL88 · #5 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 07:59 AM

truck came with oil filter that is attached to lid. Replaced with another like that from napa.. I have read about why motorcraft filters should be used and am going to switch out the cap from my 06 w/ a new filter and see what happens.
then will pressure test hpop system
just wierd how these two seperate issues occurred at exactly same time

anyone heard of a "plug" inside hpop dislodging that seperates low pressure system from high pressure resevoir? Heard this was fairly common on 03-04 model years

l-m tech · #6 (**permalink**) 10-21-2009, 08:04 AM

it could be a sticking ipr valve.the low oil pressure pump could be sticking in the housing or you could had a high pressure pump thats going out.if your hpop has a aluminum cover then you have a stc fitting that could be blown out.if its a cast steel then it would be the pump.need to get a scanner on the truck and see what codes you have and see what the actual icp pressure is.

RynL88 · #7 (**permalink**) 10-28-2009, 09:46 PM

just wanted to finish the thread
truck is all fixed

cause of long crank.. the bb in the dr. side of the hpop blew out causing open low pressure oil system..this also drained the entire low pressure oil galley on top the motor including oil filter housing when engine off.
pulled hpop, tapped the open hole with 1/8npt and plugged it

restart.. truck runs good.. good oil pressure at idle.. seemed low on power
take it out for a spin... steadily loses power unitl dead..about 20 min of driving

checked hpop pressure with autoenginuity... wont build over 350 cranking

check hpop system behind hpop with 150psi air.. no leaks

replace ipr.. no change

replace hpop.. problem solved.. however it has that darn bb in the side that blew out in the old one.. wonder how long it will last

after all this.. thinking maybe high pressure pump started to fail and caused an excess of pressure in low pressure system? causing that bb to blow out.

or the 30 miles it got driven back home after bb blew out ate up the hpop

or... just a neat little coincidence.

hope this helps someone in the future
thanks to all who replied!

bismic · #8 (**permalink**) 10-28-2009, 10:08 PM

Glad you found the "root" of the problem.

Many aftermarket filters will not be long enough to keep the oil drain valve from allowing oil in the filter housing to drain back to the pan.

It is always possible that these aftermarket filters will allow oil to flow back to the pan and could prevent oil pressure from building. But mostly it is a cause of poor filtration.

Good idea to switch back to Ford, Racor, or International brand oil filter.

Toreador_Diesel · #9 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bismic

Good idea to switch back to Ford, Racor, or International brand oil filter.

What he said....

gearloose1 · #10 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 10:09 AM

Any thoughts on the FRAM oil filter?

bismic · #11 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 10:17 AM

The Frams now seem to have the felt on the bottom and have all the patent numbers. They should be the same. I have read more than one post where they were found to be different though. Some people speculate that people switched them in the store. The main thing is to be sure you are getting the correct ones:

1. felt on the bottom
2. U.S. Patent 6.554.139 describes the filter components (the good stuff, made by the Parker-Hannifin Corporation).
3. U.S. Patent 6.086.763 refers to the front disk assembly (not quite as important - made by Ing. Walter Hengst GmbH & Co.).

Make sure Oil filters are OEM style. Check:
1. One piece top (NO plastic cap adaptor)
2.Top is glued to the filter media
3. Patent numbers (above)
4. Felt gasket on bottom
5. Diameter - exactly 1.5"
6. Length - exactly 6.5" (excluding the 4 snap tabs on top)
7. Filters are stiff and resist any twisting motion
8. 52 or 53 pleats
9. Pleats are 11/16" wide and 6 3/8" tall

69cj · #12 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bismic

The Frams now seem to have the felt on the bottom and have all the patent numbers. They should be the same. I have read more than one post where they were found to be different though. Some people speculate that people switched them in the store. The main thing is to be sure you are getting the correct ones:

1. felt on the bottom
2. U.S. Patent 6.554.139 describes the filter components (the good stuff, made by the Parker-Hannifin Corporation).
3. U.S. Patent 6.086.763 refers to the front disk assembly (not quite as important - made by Ing. Walter Hengst GmbH & Co.).

Make sure Oil filters are OEM style. Check:
1. One piece top (NO plastic cap adaptor)
2.Top is glued to the filter media
3. Patent numbers (above)
4. Felt gasket on bottom
5. Diameter - exactly 1.5"
6. Length - exactly 6.5" (excluding the 4 snap tabs on top)
7. Filters are stiff and resist any twisting motion
8. 52 or 53 pleats
9. Pleats are 11/16" wide and 6 3/8" tall

Mark, You really need to get a hobby!!

cheezit · #13 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 07:38 PM

take the time and check base oil pressure. the bb bing shot out has a tendancy to stick the regulator at 70 psi. the regulator is located in the bottom of the front cover

RynL88 · #14 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 10:35 PM

will do.. thanks

RynL88 · #15 (**permalink**) 10-29-2009, 10:44 PM

will do.. thanks

Isn't there a fitting someone sells that I can use? I remember reading it in a thread somewhere recently but can't find it through the search now

just point me in the right direction if you could