The EPA plan over time,"KILL DIESEL PICKUP'S", they would most likely like to kill OTR truck's,heavy equ and farm equ diesel also but the massive size of said equ does not allow for that to happen, This urea system just add's to the original cost of the truck,the upkeep of the truck , the higher day to day cost of keeping the truck on the road with LOWER MPG and adding in the cost of urea and MORE equipment issue's to inject urea into the engine, the list of issue's of keeping the truck out of the shop over smut control item's that "FAIL" get's ever higher,my son just took his 2004 6.0 F350 4 door Dually in JUST before the 5 year/100,000 mile's were up,58,000 miles on the clock, for turbo lag,sticking EGR,turbo vane's STUCK,Down pipe's cracked and other issue's that cost ford over $5,000 not counting labor,His truck is totaly STOCK, bottom line short,once the 5/100,000 is up,you don't want that on "YOUR" nickel ,meanwhile,my 7 year old 7.3 F 350 4 door dually with an Edge set in tow @ 60 HP has "NEVER" been in the shop!!!!! except for tran's oil change's, both truck's bought new, nuff said, http://www.forddoctorsdts.com/articl...icle-07-02.php ,note the graph on the right
SCR equipped engines will get better fuel economy than the previous generation of engines. DEF costs only add a little more than a half cent per mile to the operating cost of the vehicle. You burn more rubber off your tires in one mile than that.
This urea system just add's to the original cost of the truck,the upkeep of the truck , the higher day to day cost of keeping the truck on the road with LOWER MPG and adding in the cost of urea and MORE equipment issue's to inject urea into the engine,
They are not going to "inject urea into the engine". It will be injected into the exhaust stream after the DPF and before the SCR catalyst. The use of urea results in less EGR being needed.
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2004 E-450 6.0 139,000 miles
7,500 mile, 15 quart oil changes, 5W-40 Rotella.
UOAs consist of checking for metal on drain plug magnet. All stock, no mods. Dyed fuel with no additives. Never been reflashed.
Total parts replaced;
one EGR valve.
#1 DEF is the same as ADDBLU for the euro cars and all the heavy truck makers Except NAVASTAR will use SCR
#2 Cal transit operators have used SCR since 06
and the tech is proven in europe in large prime movers and gives 2% - 4% improvement to MPG because of less EGR action and EGR is what KILLED fuel econ in the 07!!
GREAT info provided! Makes all the sense in the world...and IMHO...can give the customer some confidence in the purchase of the 6.7L PSD with the DEF. Especially for folks like me...who have never owned a diesel...and now with another function with the DEF...can make a person shy away.
Man all i have to say is that gauge cluster looks bitchen! sorry about the hijack!
__________________ "Ford, Because Driving A Chevy Will Give You Herpes"
2006 F-250 6.0L powerstroke cc 4X4 amarillo special edition
MBRP 4" T-409 turbo back w/cat delete
autometer Phantom II Pyro, 0-60 boost and tranny temp gauges
SCT Xcal3 w/custom tunes
4 more sensors, an injector, added consumables cost, plus another converter to choke the flow? Since so many others are using this system, how does it affect the total cost of ownership on an older truck? Will the computer shut down the engine if the system is disconnected, bypassed, or run without the fluid?
BTW those dually fenders look like they use less material and are cheaper to make than the older ones. Maybe that's the idea.
4 more sensors, an injector, added consumables cost, plus another converter to choke the flow? Since so many others are using this system, how does it affect the total cost of ownership on an older truck? Will the computer shut down the engine if the system is disconnected, bypassed, or run without the fluid?
BTW those dually fenders look like they use less material and are cheaper to make than the older ones. Maybe that's the idea.
Somebody calculated the consumeable cost at today's price to be less than 1/2 cent per mile. Peanuts compared to the price of diesel at 20 cents or more these days. TCO will probably balance with regards to fuel costs if they achieve their goal of 25% fuel mileage improvement - cost of the DEF will eat away at some of the fuel savings.
I also thought I read that the Scorpion will use an extra injection cycle at the cylinder injectors for the DPF and get rid of the DPF injector, so that's an even trade.
And the engine computer will issue a low DEF warning on the dash at 500 miles to empty, so there will be plenty of time to find a vendor and refill the tank. If you do run the DEF down to empty, it goes into limp home mode and limits speeds to 25 mph.
__________________
Greg & Jo Ann Surratt
Enjoying Champagne on the King Ranch
2006 King Ranch F-350 Tow Boss PSD CC DRW 4x4
2007 Nuwa Champagne 37CKRD 4 slides with TrailAir
Retired member of the US Navy 1% Club
Somebody calculated the consumeable cost at today's price to be less than 1/2 cent per mile. Peanuts compared to the price of diesel at 20 cents or more these days. TCO will probably balance with regards to fuel costs if they achieve their goal of 25% fuel mileage improvement - cost of the DEF will eat away at some of the fuel savings.
I also thought I read that the Scorpion will use an extra injection cycle at the cylinder injectors for the DPF and get rid of the DPF injector, so that's an even trade.
Fuel mileage improvement is boasted as being "double digit percentage", thats code talk for 10%-15% tops. DEF costs might eat up the savings from up to as much as 5% of the fuel mileage increase.
There is no DPF injector on the 6.4, its handled the same way on the 6.4 as the 6.7 will be.
__________________
2004 E-450 6.0 139,000 miles
7,500 mile, 15 quart oil changes, 5W-40 Rotella.
UOAs consist of checking for metal on drain plug magnet. All stock, no mods. Dyed fuel with no additives. Never been reflashed.
Total parts replaced;
one EGR valve.
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