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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 08-22-2009, 07:57 PM
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in IL you need a special lic. to drive a F550, its called a "non commercial class C" it covers the weight range from 16001 to 25999.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 08-22-2009, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinky Demon View Post
My *** you don't. What the second poster said about the GVWR is true.
No it isn't. You don't need a commercial lisence if you aren't doing commercial hauling! Everybody throws around the term CDL. It is a specific type of lisence for commercial hauling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRebel View Post
Can anyone say Ag. Exemption?

Federal law says, if your tow vehicle has a GVWR of 10,000 or more and the sum of your truck and trailer GVWR is 26,000 or more... a CDL is required...

with some exemptions for recreational vehicles, and ag setups.
Has nothing (law-wise) to do with ag. It has to do with the fact that I don't use the truck to haul things commercially. Hence the exception for Rv's, Ag, etc. Anything non commercial....
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Originally Posted by CampD View Post
You drive that rig on the interstate with your "regular license"and go thru a weigh station shes gona be parked and your gona be walkin
Nope. Done it several times. Been through the weigh station in Valdosta Ga on I-75. We do not have a DOT number, door stickers, plackards or anything. Look at the picture. I do it all the time! I haul my own stuff and I have a class A lisence.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy001 View Post
If I were to tow my trailer with an F550, it'd technically require a CDL unless it met one of the exemptions like Chester pointed out.
Unless you are using your F-550 and trailer for commercial hauling you don't need a CDL. All you need is a class B lisence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RACERX7775 View Post
CDL does mean commercial drivers license but just because you aren't driving a "commercial" vehicle, doesn't mean you don't need a CDL. and i am talking all gvw's.
I wasn't trying to say that you don't need a specific class of lisence (A, B, C etc.) I was just saying that you don't need a CDL. I have a class A non-commercial lisence. I can drive anything built, but not for commercial use. Hauling my stuff around isn't considered commercial, hence I don't need a CDL. And neither does anyone else that pulls their own trailer or camper or excavator, or dirt, or whatever. This is a silly argument from people that don't know what they are talking about. Class A and B lisences are easy to get and require no driving test. It's just another class of lisence: D, C, M etc. Now if you are going to get a job hauling freight for wal-mart, then you need a Class A or B CDL, and that requires a driving test.
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Old 08-22-2009, 11:14 PM
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OK, all this stuff about "this state" and "that state" are false. While the states issue licenses, the federal government mandate the rules now. The feds also keep a database of who has a CDL, so you can't get one revoked from one state and go to another state to get one.

The states do have some discretion under the federal rules. Individual states may waive RVs, military and farm vehicles (when driven within 150 miles of the farm) from CDL rules. Individual states may also waiver fire fighting vehicles, emergency response vehicles and snow removal vehicles. Most states comply with these guidelines.

The below link explains the rules and requirements:

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/registratio...ng/cdl/cdl.htm
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Old 08-22-2009, 11:21 PM
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chester...

what exactly would you be hauling in that that wouldn't fall under "commercial" or "agricultural"

I guess that it is possible to just drive it around town, but ...why?
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Old 08-23-2009, 07:27 AM
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Wow, I feel like an idiot!

TexasRebel, thanks for posting the FMCSA regulation. I should know it by now, but I obviously got a bit screwed up.

You can tow anything up to a 10,000 lb trailer with anything up to a 26,000 lb truck and it's legal without a CDL. Of course, RVs, farm trucks, and some others are exempt from this...
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 08-23-2009, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redford View Post
OK, all this stuff about "this state" and "that state" are false.
not totally. the feds just mandate MINIMUM standards. the states have the right to enforce stricter guidelines. the best bet it to contact your DMV office and explain what exactly it is you would be towing.
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Old 08-23-2009, 12:24 PM
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not totally. the feds just mandate MINIMUM standards. the states have the right to enforce stricter guidelines. the best bet it to contact your DMV office and explain what exactly it is you would be towing.
Exactly my point.
Here in Mass, C is regular License. A & B are considered
a CDL, no regular A, B. Designation for Farm or Commercial is with registration, Insurance and plates.
Back to OP here in MA he would have a hard time insuring the F550 for anything but commercial, but he would not need a comercial license!
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Old 08-23-2009, 04:12 PM
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CampD, I was just about to post the same thing. No NON-commercial class a or b here too. any class a or b IS a CDL.
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Old 08-23-2009, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRebel View Post
My '08 F250 has a GVWR of 8,800#

being a single cab I have a max cargo + passenger weight of 2,918#

I weigh 180#, and allowing for fuel and equpiment I won't drive far without, we'll call it 2,500#

So technically, I can have a pin weight of 2,500# (RAWR is 5,892#)...which puts a properly loaded trailer (15% weight on tounge) at just over 16,500# with 14,000# on the trailer axles

However! I could hitch up a 20,000# GVWR trailer (28,800# combination) and not need a CDL, since the tow vehicle is less than 10,000# GVWR
Not sure you're right about that, depending on who's interpreting the regs. .
With a combination, truck and trailer the regs. say no cdl if towed vehicle (trailer) is under 10K anything towed over 10,001 lbs. triggers a cdl.
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Old 08-23-2009, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasRebel View Post
chester...

what exactly would you be hauling in that that wouldn't fall under "commercial" or "agricultural"

I guess that it is possible to just drive it around town, but ...why?
You can haul equipment, horses, cows, commodities, campers, rocks, logs, Aunt Bertha; anything you own that takes a big truck to move. If you need to drive a big truck you need a class A license. If you are not doing it for profit, then you don't need a commercial license. Firefighters and military also fall in this class.

This link is very vague, but it was the first thing that came up when googled and it proves the point.

http://www.dds.ga.gov/docs/forms/Non...alABManual.pdf

Quote:
Originally Posted by CampD View Post
Exactly my point.
Here in Mass, C is regular License. A & B are considered
a CDL, no regular A, B.
Yes they do. I just can't find it online cause their rmv website sucks. Mass has exceptions for firefighters, active duty military, rv's, and individuals hauling their own stuff non commercially etc.... They are not required to get a CDL.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RACERX7775 View Post
CampD, I was just about to post the same thing. No NON-commercial class a or b here too. any class a or b IS a CDL.
You people will argue with a sign post!!! Your state DOES offer them!
http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/driverLicensePhotoIDCenter/license_classes.shtml
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009, 02:08 AM
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Chester,

I don't have a dog in this fight, and rarely if ever tow anything. I've only looked into this as the subject is somewhat interesting to me. I've reviewed the link you provided and the way I read it is in the state of Georgia, you are technically correct according to the document referenced.

The way I read it though, the Class A & B non-commercial license in Georgia was not created with the intent for people to drive their own Semi-Trucks for non-commercial purposes. (I.E. hauling around an obese mother-in-law just for fun) It appears to be for emergency personnel (Firetrucks) or Military (Duce & 1/2) or some other kind of non-semi vehicle in excess of 26,001 rated GVRW.

If I were a Georgia DPS or Highway Enforcement Officer though, I suppose if I pulled you over in your semi running at 80,000lbs with a trailer full of maize to your grain elevator, that while that haul is not commercial it's in support of a commercial operation. Although laws are never as loosely defined as they appear to be in that Georgia PDF, in my mind that document leaves a lot to be interpreted by the enforcement official conducting the stop.

I've pulled this up on several other state websites and many of them mention the exact same scenario you're mentioning, only you would clearly fall under the Agricultural exemption and would only be CDL exempt (regardless of load or intent) for within 150 miles of your specified Farm/Ranch.

ftp://ftp.txdps.state.tx.us/forms/cdl-2.pdf (Texas Application for non-com A&B license)

http://www.itd.idaho.gov/dmv/DriverServices/CDL.htm (Idaho document addressing the subject, and written in an easy to understand format)

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/cdl_htm/lic_chart.htm (California Classification)

I guess the point I'm trying to make is, In Georgia, depending on the officer's interpretation of the law, you could at the very least be out some time for court appearances'. At the most it could result in substantial fine. It's quite clear after my "google research" that blindly stating that it's possibly, while true in some instances, is negligent. It's clear to me that it varies in each state.

I am sure you've been doing this for a long time and clearly without any issue, but I know that if it were me, I would want something in writing, or at the very least more to go off of than a poorly worded PDF file. Might just be worth it to get a CDL just in case. My point being; Be Careful.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009, 07:50 PM
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The way I see it in Georgia

As long as Chestor isn't going farther than 150 miles and isn't selling whatever he is hauling, he doesn't need a CDL. He could transport feed for his animals within 150 miles and not need a CDL. If he were to sell that feed he is transporting, he would need a CDL even if it is within 150 miles.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 08-25-2009, 01:29 PM
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I've been doing my own research on this over the past few months and wanted to weigh in....

It appears Chester's ability to drive a truck w/o a CDL is due to agricultural excemptions (<150 mi from farm as stated before). In the state of PA you have to prove you are a farm by having a form F filled on your taxes, show farm income, etc.

His link to the GA CDL manual (with very pretty pictures by the way) states "Vehicles which require a Non-Commercial Class A or B License are agricultural vehicles, military vehicles, and firefighter /emergency vehicles." This is pretty standard in every state. However, there is no mention "non-commercial" use for anything outsie of fire/military/ag. In other words, don't drive your friend's tri-axel to hual dirt to your house if you don't have a CDL. I saw no proof showing that you can use a commercial vehicle for personal use.

This pdf seems to be pretty standard state to state in the definition of needing a CDL. It says you need a CDL to drive anything DEFINED AS A COMMERCIAL VEHICLE which is the usual >26k, 26k + >10k, etc. It does not define any differences between commercial and non-commercial use. In PA the A/B non-commercial licenses are written to address drivers of recreational vehciles and possibly the (though I'm not sure if it is necessary) mililtary/fire vehicles. There is one possible final excemption in PA which is registering your truck as a classic vehicle. However, you are not allowed to haul items in your semi/heavy truck once it is classified as a classic.

As a final note, it does look entirely possible that a truck over 26k can tow a trailer w/ a GVW over 10k as long as the trailer & load is less than 10k when you are towing it.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:18 PM
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In ky, if it has a farm tag, you are allowed 80,000lbs on a semi truck assuming you have a tandem axle tractor and tandem axle trailer. A 16 year old kid with a drivers license can legally drive it. CDL not required for farm use. Also no CDL is required for personal use. Simply put a sign on the side of your truck stating Not-For-Hire, and you are legal.

Here's a question for you guys. How many of you tow a trailer without emergency brakes? A semi trailer has air brakes that if the trailer breaks away from the tractor, the spring brakes in the maxi-chambers set up the brakes to try to stop it. It is the law according to a DOT officer I talked to that anything over 3500lb axles are required to have an emergency brake system on them that would apply the brakes should the trailer become seperated form the tow vehicle. Also, it isn't required for the trailer manufacturers to include them when they build the trailer. It's up to the owners to see that their trailers have them.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:40 PM
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I have been watching this post, anbd have to chuckle. It seems a few are recent graduates from truck driving school...LOL

With the analogies posted, on weights ect. It would be like me asking,

Can I travel down a steet marked no trucks, with my F250?

Case in point... UPS package car, FedEx package car drivers do NOT, have CDL's They pull trailers behind those package cars??? Combination vehicle?? Nope...

Race teams, You will often see, Not For Hire on there rigs. Not commercial vehicles...

There are variables... But The simple question is. Is it a comercail Vehicle? if the answere is yes, Then you need the proper registration, insurence, and licensing to operate.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:40 PM
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