Bag of marbles in engine
#1
#2
This is from the thread I started about my engine knocking.........
Combustion Chamber Deposit Interference (CCDI) caused by the piston making contact with the head in the "squish zone" through carbon deposits on both the piston crown & head, can make a sound on a cold start called "marble noise", it sorta sounds like marbles clacking together in a sack, & will slowly diminish as the engine warms & things expand to give clearance in the "squish zone".
This noise is sorta a metallic clacking & is loudest mdway on the block, where the head & block meet.
The Techron decarb treatment & use of gas with it, can help this condition.
This noise is sorta a metallic clacking & is loudest mdway on the block, where the head & block meet.
The Techron decarb treatment & use of gas with it, can help this condition.
#4
What octane fuel are you using? Use the grade suggested in your owners manual. Using a decarb treatment is recommended, though you may need something even stronger than the Techron. Running Seafoam or B-12 directly into a vacuum line will work wonders for your engine, though you should change your oil after doing so.
#5
Using one of the above named fuels, along with a 20oz bottle of Techron Concentrate Plus, will raise the treat rate 10X above the pump gas level & is often enough to get the job done in one tank.
However with your mileage, it might require a second treatment, if you've never decarbed the engine.
Run most of the current tank out, add the Techron at the pump before filling up, so you get a thorough mixing as you fill.
Then run most of the treated tank/s out, with some daily spirited accelleations & rpm's above 3500 for 2-4 miles, to help expel any carbon deposits & let us know how it does.
Since your adding the Techron to the gas, no need to change the oil & filter after a treatment.
If you choose to use one of the vacuum line ingested decarb treatments, to get faster results, you should change the oil & filter & maybe the plugs afterward.
So you can maybe get quicker results with a lower cost vacuum line ingested product, but maybe it doesn't make economic sense in the long run, if the oil, filter & plugs need to be changed afterward.
More decarb thoughts for pondering.
Let us know how it goes.
#6
I'd feed the engine a spritz of H2O. With the engine running at a fast idle, spray a bit of water into the intake. Not enough to kill the engine. The water will flash to steam, and can remove carbon deposits from the piston and combustion chamber.
Warning: If you feed it too much, you run the risk of breaking the piston as water is not compressible as a liquid. It would take a LOT of water to do that, but I wanted to make the warning clear.
Are you sure that the timing is set correctly and that your EGR system is functioning? Is it possible it is pre-ignition knock, rather than a mechanical knock?
tom
Warning: If you feed it too much, you run the risk of breaking the piston as water is not compressible as a liquid. It would take a LOT of water to do that, but I wanted to make the warning clear.
Are you sure that the timing is set correctly and that your EGR system is functioning? Is it possible it is pre-ignition knock, rather than a mechanical knock?
tom
#7
Ive fed sea foam into the vacuum line for the evap purge. A whole can. I had my dad rev it up and I fed a crap load into it then shut it off to let it sit in there. Fired it up and smoked out the neighborhood for a while. It continued to smoke for a few miles down the road too. I did it about 4 times with that can. No noticeable difference. You say to change the plugs after this and the oil too? Oops. I know the plenum is really cruddy because I looked at it a few years ago becuase I had to remove it to get to the plugs on that side. What is the actual correct way to use sea foam through a vacuum line? I think what I did was wrong and a waste, cause Ive heard great things about sea foam. I run cheap 87 gas, and I run it wide open on the interstate daily 85+ for an hour and a half at a time. Then another hour and a half when I come home. In town, in high gear it tries to ping a little, but I dont let it, I back off or change gears cause I know it is destructive. I dont know how many miles are on the timing belt or even if that has anything to do with it, I do know it has cracks all over the back of it. Ive never changed it and ive put 100,000 on the truck and it was cracked like that when I got the truck. I know this because I pulled back the timing cover and peeked at it a few times.
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#8
If you don't want to get stuck by the side of the road or in the Wallyworld parking lot, you would be well advised to replace your timing belt. Their life is expected to be about 65,000 miles and you have gotten your $19 worth...
On the other hand, FoMoCo says that having cracks on the inside of a serpentine belt is OK, as long as no pieces are missing. Once chunks start coming out, it's time to replace the belt.
From your reply, I am figuring that you know what ping sounds like. I would remove the marbles from the engine and hope the noise goes away. Ok, I lied. Is it possible that you have cam follower clatter due to low oil pressure? I think your age truck had the cruditis of the oil pan gasket, where the gasket that protruded into the crankcase became dissolved into little chunks or bits that get sucked up by the oil pump, clogging the intake screen, and blocking flow. Lifter supports collapse due to lack of oil pressure and make lots of noise. Possible? You would hear a Lot of clatter.
tom
On the other hand, FoMoCo says that having cracks on the inside of a serpentine belt is OK, as long as no pieces are missing. Once chunks start coming out, it's time to replace the belt.
From your reply, I am figuring that you know what ping sounds like. I would remove the marbles from the engine and hope the noise goes away. Ok, I lied. Is it possible that you have cam follower clatter due to low oil pressure? I think your age truck had the cruditis of the oil pan gasket, where the gasket that protruded into the crankcase became dissolved into little chunks or bits that get sucked up by the oil pump, clogging the intake screen, and blocking flow. Lifter supports collapse due to lack of oil pressure and make lots of noise. Possible? You would hear a Lot of clatter.
tom
Last edited by tomw; 08-11-2009 at 08:19 AM. Reason: thought
#9
#10
The oil pressure has always been slightly above middle ways on the factory gauge. It does tick intermittently when its cold. I change the oil and put A good old motorcraft FL-1A filter back on every 6000 miles. All thats ever been put in it is Castrol 10-40. The pan doesnt leak. The crank seals dribble a little but not enough to have to add between changes. The pcm does have quite a collection of codes in it. One or two is because the gas fill hose is dry rotted and it does not hold pressure, and yeah it pours out if you fill it to the top. I know another one said lean condition, but that was before I put new bolts in my exaust flange and tightened it up. I drove around with the scan tool hooked up and the oxygen sensor was very lazy, It still runs like a scalded dog and gets 18-22 mpg. The other code is cat insufficient.
#11
Oh and Bear, Ive never fooled with any of that stuff, and it has a dry filter in it. Im sure the injectors are not as good as they could be maybe even could be one of them im hearing when the engine is cold and it ticks Intermittenly for the first couple of miles. The truck was an escort for wide loads. I got it and it had 250,000 on it. Only thing ive changed is the IAC and clutch. And of course the oil. Everything else is stock.
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