Speaking of which, how would I confirm what the differential gear ratios are on the donor vehicle, if the owner doesn't know? ...or on my truck, for that matter. I've just been assuming it's 4.10:1, but for all I know it's 3.54:1.

 

No. you can reweld new spring perches on. I dont understand why they used a narrower axle on the c-n-c trucks anyway

 

I'm planing on building my '83 2wd CNC into a Toy Hauler. (4x4, solid front axle, flatbed, etc). I was wondering if there is a way to make my 2wd manual 4 speed trans mate up to a transfercase(swapping tailshafts and housings if possible)? Or do I have to buy another tranny? If I do have to I'd like to get a 5 speed preferably with a mechanical clutch. (my Dad never had too much luck with those slave cylinders on his '88). What would be the make and model of trans/case i'd want? I'd be willing to buy a donor truck for the trans and tcase, what years should I look at? Any help would be great thanks.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebooger13

Ia way to make my 2wd manual 4 speed trans mate up to a transfercase(swapping tailshafts and housings if possible)?

You have to disassemble the transmission and replace the component that
makes up the output shaft.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thebooger13

I'd like to get a 5 speed preferably with a mechanical clutch...What would be the make and model of trans/case i'd want?

I'm not aware of any 5-speed transmissions paired with mechanical clutch
linkages (Ford converted to hydraulics somewhere around 1982-83).

I have a Borg Warner 1345 transfer case in my 1981, another variant is the
New Process 208.

Those are the common ones; Ford may have used a few others, too.

I think what you'd really want is a ZF 5-speed but that'd use a hydraulic clutch.

 

I guess what I should ask is what do I have now and what would be an ideal setup for my truck? The trans I have now is a four speed 2wd and i believe it is a mechanical clutch(I'd have to look again to be 100% sure). I want a heavy duty trans and t-case to haul heavy loads with so the four speed i have now would do, but at times when I dont have a trailer or going on the interstate I would like the extra 5th gear for a better cruising RPM.

 

I just read this post and I also have a 86 F350 cab and chassis that I want to convert to 4wd. My truck has the 460. I have already converted from the C6 to T-19. My next plan was the 4wd conversion. So far I have a D60 from a DRW F350, T-19 with transfer case, front driveshaft from a 1985 F250 4x4 with T-19, and an 85 F250 4x4 frame with spring hangers. I read one of the posts mentions that some of the holes for the leaf spring hangers are in the current 2wd frame. For the two guys that are doing this conversion on this thread, how is your progress? Any tips before I get started? Will the front springs for a SRW F350 4x4 work on this?
Am I missing anything other than rear driveshaft?
Is there any difference in the front crossmember?
I know there are many questions here, but I thank you in advance.
JWR
1986 F350 460 T-19
1985 F250 460 T-19

 

Im just getting started with this project for my '83 C+C and am still attempting to round up parts needed for it. The problem Im having is knowing what parts I need. I have mostly dealt with Chevy/GMC trucks so I dont have a clue what to look for as far as trans, t-case, and axle model numbers. Such as Chevy's turbo 350 trans, it's a three speed auto, and it would mate to a NP205 t-case. What are some examples of 4 or 5 speed manual ford trannies, t-cases and 1 ton axles? I know what I would like it all to be I just need to learn the terms yet. Here's a list of what I'd like:

4 or 5 speed manual trans (5spd prefered)
1 ton HD t-case
1 ton 4x4 front axle

What I have now:
'83 Ford f-350 C+C
351W 4 speed manual

 

The front axle is a Dana 60. It was used on 78-79 F250/350 with the snow plow package, then 85.5-97 on F350's. The early 78-79 front end is not a direct bolt in with leaf springs as the later one is. The later one has two different hubs which will interchange depending on what type of wheel (SRW or DRW). The four speed used with Diesels and 460's is a T-19 and the gear ratios vary whether it is from a diesel or 460. The small blocks and 6 cylinder trucks used a T-18 or NP435. The T-19 has syncros on first gear, the T-18 does not. The 5 speed used was a ZF 5 speed, but it has an intergral bellhousing so each tranny mates to a specific engine. I am not up on all the t-cases, but mine is getting a 1356 Borg-Warner that was in an 85 F250.
JWR

 

That helps alot. Thanks so much. I've been trying to find web sites that I can look up and reasearch the info on but I cant find too many good ones. Do you know of any?

 

great thread!! Watching, because I want to put a straight axle under the front of my 1997 F250...

 

I'm going to take a looong-winded shot at this.
Varqanir-The rear axle will not be a Dana 60, It's a Ford 10.25.
You COULD use a "pickup" rear axle, but you'll need to cut off the existing spring perches and re-weld them in the correct locations. No big deal for a large fabrication 4x4 shop, they do that stuff all the time. You might also have to move your shock absorber mounting locations, not positive. If you're planning on going SRW (Single Rear Wheel) then use both axles from the parts truck if it's a SRW pickup. Have a 4x4 shop do the welding. If you're going to stay DRW (Dual Rear Wheel), then it would be easier to just have an axle differential shop swap in new gears to match the front axle. If your desired rig is like that cool F550 rig, and you plan to spend a lot of time off road...you'll be wanting 4.56 gears probably. If you DO stick SRW, have that 4x4 shop weld in 2.5" wide spring perches to match your leaf springs. OR, do the more complicated approach and put F350 pickup springs into your truck. You would have to grind off all the brackets and bolt on pickup brackets and leaf springs. The pickup leaves are nicer riding and flex more. To handle the weight of the camper, you could have a leaf spring shop build you a helper spring pack. Helped springs WILL NOT sacrafice the nice ride because they will only "kick in" and make the truck rigid when the load eventually hits them. But, that's more expensive...just a thought!
I don't know anything about ABS brakes, sorry!
Transmission Clarification-
All transmission up to 1986 were 4 speeds. 1987 and after is 5 speeds.
The 300 I6, 302, and 351 had either a NP435 or T18, both wide ratio.
T18 Wide Ratio gears: 6.3, 3.1, 1.7, 1:1 Direct, 7.4 Reverse
NP435 Wide Ratio gears: 6.7, 3.4, 1.7, 1:1 Direct, 8.2 Reverse
The 460 and 6.9 Diesels used a T19, both Close and Wide ratio.
T19 Close ratio: 4, 2.4, 1.4, 1:1 Direct, 4.6 (I think?) Reverse
T19 Wide ratio: Same as T18: 6.3, 3.1, 1.7, 1:1 Direct, 7.4 Reverse.
2wd AND 4wd Diesels used a close ratio T19
2wd 460 used a close ratio T19
4wd 460 F250 used a WIDE ratio T19
A diesel engine is BEST suited with a close ratio gearbox due to the low revving nature of the beast.
All the 4 speeds are interchangable, they WILL bolt up because they share the same bellhousing bolt pattern...HOWEVER, the gearing is not well suited for a diesel. Stick with a close ratio T19, they are indestructible!
Find a 1983-1986 F250 4x4 with a diesel for parts, buy the 4 speed and transfer case and they will botl into your F350, so cool! That's what I'll be doing when I eventually get to this point.
5 Speeds...The ZF5 5 speed.
This transmission is not interchangable. The bellhousing is integral to the transmission case. So a 460 ZF5 will only bolt up to a 429 or 460. a 7.3 Diesel ZF5 WILL bolt up to a 6.9.
They're available in close and wide ratios. Diesels had a close ratio while the gassers had a wide ratio...not positive on those ratios though.
The close ratio is similar to the T19 except it has Overdrive.
I will never do a ZF5. They're aluminum so the case lacks in strength. They have no benefit in the gear spread except for Overdrive. Internal slave is not attractive to me, and they have oiling problems as well. I'm not up to snuff on technical aspects of it, but I know as much as I need to...I'm good with my trusty 4 speed!
As far as bolting on the brackets, see post #19 by Diesel Brad.
I believe the fuel tanks between a gas and diesel truck are the same, but the sending units are different because the diesels have a return line. Why? Is your tank rusting out? I don't know about galvanized metal and diesel fuel, is it bad?
Check your axle gear ratios by jacking up the truck. Make a mark on the tire and driveshaft. Watch that mark on the tire! Now turn the driveshaft by hand and count how many revolutions the driveshaft spins to turn the tire once. Most likely 4.1 times which is a 4.10 gear ratio. COULD be a 3.55 as well, 3.5 driveshaft turns.
Common Ford axle gear ratios: 3.08, 3.27, 3.55, 3.73, 4.10, 4.56, 4.88.
Those are just numbers you may come close to.
But as far as I know, Ford used 3.55 in the F250's and 4.10 in the F350's so those are the common numbers you'll find.
The booger...your turn at questions!
Stick with 4 speed, it's a much more durable transmission and will survive better and longer under heavy loads. If you need overdrive, add a Gear Vendors Overdrive unit onto your "Someday Wish List". This unit allows you to split your gears and gives you overdrive.
1980-1986 trucks used a Borg Warner 1345 transfer case.
1987-1997 used a Borg Warner 1356 transfer case, which is supposedly stronger.
For your 460 engine, I'd say a wide ratio box would work for you because of the wide RPM range your big block has. I have one behind my big block gasser and LOVE it.
Grab a NP435 or T18 from ANY 4x4 Ford Truck 1973-1979 and you'll have a NP205. NICE!
Grab a NP435 or T18 from a 1980 and after 300, 302, 351 and you'll have a BW1345.
Grab a T19 from an 83-86 460 and you'll have a BW1345.
The NP205 only has a 2:1 low range, while the Borg Warners boast a 2.6:1. No big deal, just lower range...that's your decision, but the NP205 is definetly a stronger transfer case, even though these BW's are NOT weak.
jwrboss-
I'm pretty sure the SRW and DRW front springs are interchangable because the guys doign SAS (Solid Axlee Swap) never metnion about swapping springs.
Booger, here's a component list-
Transmissions-
NP435, T18, T19 are 4 speeds
ZF5 is a 5 speed with Overdrive
Transfer cases-
BW1345 used from '80-'86
BW1356 used from '87-'97 (last year of OBS (Old Body Style))
Front Axle-
1 Ton Solid Dana 60 with driver's side differential
The F250's used a Dana 44 TTB (Twin Traction Beam) independent front axle.
Rear Axle-
Dana 60's in F250's and Dana 70's in F350's until Ford introduced their Ford 10.25, I think sometime around 1983? Someone might clear me up on that.

I can help in more ways with makign personal preference decisions, but what do you want to know?
Example-
T19 has a synchro first gear and also has PTO ports on both sides of the case. You could run hydraulics on one side and still use your transfer case.
Hope it helps! I'm doing the 4x4 conversion on my '85 F350 Short Wheelbase diesel/4 speed/Cab and Chassis DRW soon. I'm also putting a 1965 body on it. Talk about a cool tow rig during the week, cool truck pulling rig on the weekends!

 

Good post above, he spent a lot of time on it. Few things I would differ with;

True the aluminum case is weaker than the cast iron, and there have been cases where the bellhousing area has been known to crack, but these incidents are rare, the zf 5 is plenty strong. Reverse gear is also a weak point in these trannies. But the overdrive makes up for these shortcomings. I haven't heard of any oiling problems with this tranny, just the two areas(bellhousing cracks and reverse gear). The slave cylinder on the diesel and 460 zf's is the external type, not internal.

Can't really say that. It depends on how the truck was ordered. You might find the 4.10's more common than the 3.55's in the f250's. I have a 89 f250 and a donor f250 and both came with the 4.10's

 

Thanks BlueOvalBud for the info. I found it very helpful! A couple of notes I have found, the ZF 5 speed early ones came with the slave cylinder outside the bellhousing like the T-19. At some point the slave moved inside the bellhousing. I have a ZF from a 460 4x4, I do not know whether I will use it or not for the same reasons you mentioned. The 1356 tranfer case was also avaibable with the electric shift at some point. I too am finishing rounding up the parts to convert an 86 F350 DRW 460 T-19 to 4x4. My latest problem is that the D60 I have has 4.10 gears, but I think the truck rear is 3.55, I must dig into this problem a little deeper.
JWR

 

Thanks for the catches Franklin!
A little more about the reverse gear is that the diesel versions seem to be geared a little too "tall" for backing up a heavy load in reverse. But, if you can just dop the transfer case in low range that would solve the problem. I never knew about the external slave cylinder, learn something new everyday!
I re-read the quote. It didn't type out the way I ment it to, whoops.
I should have said that 4.10's and 3.55's are the two most common ratios found in the trucks of this era. There are certaintly other ratios available, but these two are the ones you'll see most.

I forgot all about the electric shift motors, I just assume stick with the manual shift so that there is one less thing to worry about failing
It might be easier for you to find another rear axle at a junkyard for your truck. An entire axle would be cheaper than doing a gear swap, unless you can do the gears yourself.
Grab a 4.10 axle from the junkyard and clean it up. Install new brakes and wheel bearings, give it some paint, and bolt it under your truck.
Thanks for the catches guys! It's important to catch the false information before other members think it's correct!

 

Thanks a bunch BlueOvalBud. That is the exact info I needed.

On the spring size thing for an axle swap: As far as I know the regular 3/4 and one ton trucks used a 3" wide spring and the Cab n Chassis models used a 2 1/2" spring width. That is for the rear axles im not sure about the front.