Uhm... if you hook it like that won't you fry things?... If not synced.... could be very bad news. That is why you can't connect two non-inverter generators together.
The Honda EU 1000i, 2000i, and 3000i series are capable of being run in parallel right out of the box (to a SINGLE 110 volt 30 amp plug) - the only caveat is that you have to run "twin" units - in other words, you cannot hook a 1000 watt unit to a 2000 watt unit to get 3000 watts....two 1000's, two 2000's, and two 3000's are OK to link.
The Yamaha 2000i and 2400i generators are capable of being parallelled also, I do not know about the rest of the Yamaha i series.
It was explained to me that the above mentioned generators produce their prime voltage at about 20,000 hertz, then bring it back to a DC voltage, and, finally, a computer control brings the DC to a pure sine wave 60 cycle 110volt power - don't know just how they make the magic, but I do know that the five above mentioned generators WILL run in parallel (with like sized power and manufacture models).
I know for certain that the output for the Honda 2000i is common for the "factory parallel plugs" and the conventional 110 receptical outlets. As I mentioned in one of the previous posts, the "factory parallel plugs" have internal connections that do not allow a "hot" plug to contact anything if accidently removed while the paired generator is running - the contacts are shrouded by plastic.
Below is a pic of my two 2000's running in parallel powering the AC and refrigerator of a travel trailer.
After I hooked them up in parallel they took on the load of the fridge and a 15K BTU AC with nary a whimper.
I can still easily carry the two of them with full gas at the same time - one in each hand - truthfully could not hear them run inside the trailer (with the AC running).
Each weighs 55 lbs with full fuel.
Remember, I am talking about ADDITIVE 110 volt amperage, not two single "legs" (ie, a 220 volt plug). Most of the "smaller" travel trailers require a full 30 amp plug to operate the AC, 12 volt charger, and a few small appliances at the same time.
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The inverter system utilized by Honda allows the generators to run IN phase (not 180 degrees out), so what honda is doing is allowing the first generator to phase with the second (just like the big industrial jobs) and adding the generating capability to the second -
The plug receptical in my pics is a 110 volt 30 amp - as I referenced earlier, one of the downsides of my home made solution is I actually have the potential of putting 33.4 amps (16.7 amps intermittent rating each) into my single 30 amp plug - even though there are actually 20 amp plugs on each of the Honda's, 16.7 amps is the most that each of the gennys will put out.
You are quite correct about the 110 volts scenario in RV's (50 amp plug). Even though there COULD BE (and usually is) two each 110 legs (220 volts) going to the RV, each individual circuit is only 110 volts.
OK, gotch on the parallel thing. I was thinking of one where the inverters get connected and one genset does run 180 out from the other, thus generating true 220 volts. Skipped my mind the Hondas run in parallel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grafekie
Is that because those models are inverter based? In order to link two generators you have to find a way to syncronize the two alternator's phase, which is near impossible. I guess if it was a computer based inverter you could have better ability to control phase?
Actually you can sync any two generators in parallel - the trick is to vary the speed of one until it is in phase with the other, then connect them.
If they are real close in phase, one will "pull" the other into sync. You need a phase difference indicator, such as a voltmeter from phase to phase. Connect at zero volts difference.
Do not try this at home, kiddies.
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totally off topic. i love your airstream. i can never get tired of them. i'm jealous.
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You guys really like to split hairs with the "construction generator noise" thing. IMO a guy who runs his "loud" constuction gen. for 20 min. is a hell of a lot less offensive than the blasting, thumping stereos, unmuffled 2 stroke dirt bikes and ATVs that seem to be acceptable now in campgrounds. A large segment of the folks with "quiet" hondas, etc...Seem to like to run theirs up until the last possible second at night before finally switching to batt. power..........Believe me, they are not that quiet a 11:00 at night!
Campgrounds have gone to hell anyway, no one respects each other anymore. Thats why for the most part I have switched to unimproved campgrounds to escape the idiots. So if I run my construction gen. for 20 minutes to re-charge my batteries, your just going to have to excuse me, that is if you can hear it over the thumping stereos!.
From what I am seeing in this Thread is that we are talking about 2 totally seperate technologies.
Inverter based gensets are the latest and greatest and more expensive. The older style gensets are getting quieter and more efficient. The inverter based gensets are great economically as it offsets load when needed.
I bought a 4500 watt peak 3500 constant, and it runs at 65 decibels. I use it at races 24 hours a day for 5 days straight and put it at the end of the TT that my bed is on. I bearly hear it. I had a 40 Motorhome with an ONAN and it was a 5500 watt, and it viberated the whole rig. Great generator, just was not technological advanced as todays new gensets.
I also see that the louder contractor gensets are also bigger in wattage. You will seldom see a 10000 watt inverter based genset like a Honda or Yamaha. Someone that needs that kind of wattage will have to use a louder non inverter based genset. Also if you have a generator, use it. You don't buy another if you only use it a few times a year for RVing.
I have been RVing for years, I have had Generac's, Honda's, Briggs, No Name specials. I have wore them all out, I now have a Power Max off Ebay, and I have used it for over 4000 hours at about half load. For $400 bucks, it has performed well and I have never had a complaint from my neighbors. At NASCAR events at Texas Motor Speedway, you have a 20 x 40 space to park your RV and a car or truck. If you do not hear your nieghbors genset, then you are deaf. I don't like hearing the loud gensets, and all I can do is try and cut my noise so that the whole of the noise is less.
The whole noise thing boils down to simple consideration for others. I've camped with folks who had cheap, noisy generators who were a pleasure to camp with, and others who had a 50db built in genny that I'd never camp within a 1/2 mile of. When and how long your genny runs and WHERE you set it up (a long extension cord can help a lot..) make all the difference.
That said, if you can swing the $$ the enclosed Honda/Yamaha generators are very nice.
I have two generators, a Honda 2000w "i" (1500w continuous) and a GenRac 3500w (4500w surge). That being said watch the numbers some are LABELED Surge and some Continuous. With "i" in Honda it works well for electroics, hence the price. You can stand next to the Honda with no problem talking to someone but the GenRac. The other thing to check is the vibration if mounted to the chassis, some will drive you nuts unless you use special mounts. The GenRac will start to move around if sitting on a smooth surface.
That's interesting... I've never seen a generator marketed by its surge capacity. In that case we got a deal! 13,500W for $900, lol. A continuous model with that output would be over $2000.
__________________
Nathan
2002 F150 SuperCab Short Bed FX4 5.4L V8 Firestone Load Level Air Suspension - totalled by Spradley Barr Ford
1995 K3500 Regular cab 8' bed 4x4 6.5L
2007 Featherlite 8413 20x7x7' Stock Trailer
I have seen a lot of generators rated with the "surge" figures at the local box stores. I bought one several years back that was actually continuous rated, not surge. Without going out to the garage, it is 5500 cont. and ~8000 surge. Thats why I started noticing them in the stores, it seemed that the 5500W ones were way cheaper than mine----until I looked at the rating label.
87mh--Wifey and I are looking again. Last one was a used 72 31' land yacht, we both worked, and it did not get used enough, so it went--! We just bought an 07 expy El and would tow with it. The rating is 8900# (provided I change out that class III & tranny cooler). In another thread on this forum, there was a big discussion about ratings (and some pizzing as well). My recollection of my old 31' is that the delivery weight was ~5500" which means loaded it went ~7500#. I have used WD hitches and sway bars for years, so I also am pretty knowledgeable about them. That is in the range for the Expy, however after looking at some of the other brands, even a few supposedly "lightweights", the start at ~7000+ for even a 25-27' trailer. Am I that far off on my recollection of the airstream weights? Sure would appreciate it if you could tell me the weight of yours and if it is a 31' (it appears to be about that) tx
I think that's very deceptive to market solely by surge... all the ones I researched had both ratings on them, but the big numbers were the continueous. We have two (had a third)... one is a 5500/8250, one a 8000/12000 (crap!! died twice), and the new one is a 8000/13500. The Generac blew up on us twice and was returned... so far the two Briggs generators are going strong. Plus they have a very high surge rating... which I hope is accurate!
__________________
Nathan
2002 F150 SuperCab Short Bed FX4 5.4L V8 Firestone Load Level Air Suspension - totalled by Spradley Barr Ford
1995 K3500 Regular cab 8' bed 4x4 6.5L
2007 Featherlite 8413 20x7x7' Stock Trailer
I think that's very deceptive to market solely by surge... all the ones I researched had both ratings on them, but the big numbers were the continueous. We have two (had a third)... one is a 5500/8250, one a 8000/12000 (crap!! died twice), and the new one is a 8000/13500. The Generac blew up on us twice and was returned... so far the two Briggs generators are going strong. Plus they have a very high surge rating... which I hope is accurate!
Around here the box stores post both continuous and surge ratings. The smaller number is the continuous rating, though. And take those ratings with a grain of salt. Most of these "utility" generators run 3600 RPM, and it beats the crap out of them. The "continuous" only means that you can pull that rated power with out slowing down or stalling, and the "surge" rating is just that. Used for motor starting mostly, and means if you pull that power for more than a few seconds the motor will drag down, and perhaps even stall.
The manufacturers are counting on the fact that most people will use these things for a few hours, or perhaps "continuously" for a few days at most, and perhaps a few times a year. Running one 24/7 will eventually kill it. If 24/7 operation is needed for extended periods, the 1800 RPM diesel gensets are the best bet. But, all the above is JMHO, and worth exactly what you paid for it.
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__________________ TRITON V10 - THE BEST KEPT SECRET - (But word is getting out). '08 F350 Scab SRW V10 w/ 4:10
07 Gulfstream Prarie Schooner
'05 Escape
' Passed the exam today! I am now a licensed instigator!
Yep, both ratings are posted as was for mine. However, the big letters, plastered on the units are generally the "surge" ratings, maybe not all of them though. It seems that I notice it more---maybe just me--. Whatever the case, I cant run a home 5T heat pump (air conditioning) when we have short power outages. Does run paddle fans and enough stuff to be fairly comfortable. I am really interested in the 2 small generators if I get another TT.
I agree here that the surge ratings are deceiving and IMHO do not mean much. Marketing plays a big roll with what they put on a genset. Someone see's 15000 watt surge, then all they see is the big number and not comprehending "surge" or not just not doing their homework.
Onan gensets are made to run 24/7 for nearly forever. They "in fact" want you to run rather than "not run" the gensets. On one Motorhome that I have had, the Onan was ran for 2 weeks, 24/7. It was a gasoline based set. In fact, When I traded the RV in, it had over 12,000 hours on the genset. They are quality gensets, but you do pay the price.
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