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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 10-07-2009, 11:29 PM
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No-Tyme No-Tyme is offline
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Well I am going to chime in here now: My 04 5.4 3V had a new head put on in January of this year at 46, 700 for a P 0308 code. The code was for a misfire at low rpm and I was told that #8 valve seal wore and allowed the valve **** sideways and not seat properly hence my misfire. The truck had a tic then and still does, when warm and low rpm say less than 1100. I have banged my head against the wall for a couple of months trying to figure out the front end problem, and finally today I got rid of the creaking noise, for about $500 and I am not looking forward to spending more money money to fix this dam ticking noise. The head replacement was covered under the extended warranty (certified pre-owned) and now at 53,000 I can still hear the noise driving thru a drive up window.
My kids tell me just turn up the radio but I don’t want another serious engine issue to creep up on me…
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 10-08-2009, 01:13 AM
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Don't feel bad. I've got 30,000km on my truck and it ticks pretty good when warmed up. I guess I can live with it if it’s only an annoyance, but it sure makes it tough for me to convince people how "smooth" running Ford Modular engines are when its hammering away next to them when I say it.
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Old 11-04-2009, 08:53 AM
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ticking sound

Quote:
Originally Posted by lakeforkfisherman View Post
My 04 5.4 ticked from the start. Got tired of it as it got louder toward 55k. Under warranty, Ford replaced the cylinder heads. No more ticking. In fact, it runs better now than ever.

When did you get them replaced? The warranty is only good for 3/36000.
Thanks
Robbie
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Old 11-04-2009, 08:57 AM
shikishabazz shikishabazz is offline
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Ticking 5.4

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Originally Posted by Rickx View Post
I got my cam phasers replaced at 77k and no more ticking. I have an 04 F150 5.4L.

How much did this cost you?
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Old 04-05-2010, 11:06 PM
blackhullpirate blackhullpirate is offline
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Have you changed back to the factory recommended oil yet? If so, did the noise come back?
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Old 04-06-2010, 09:13 AM
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TSB 06-19-8

Go here, in case this didn't copy completly.

http://www.stangnet.com/images/stori...s/06-19-08.pdf






TICKING AND / OR KNOCKING NOISE / STARTUP TSB 06-19-8
RATTLE FROM ENGINE—4.6L / 5.4L 3V
FORD: LINCOLN:
2005 Mustang 2005 Navigator
2004-2005 F-150
2005 Expedition, F-250, F-350

This article supersedes TSB
06-4-7 to update the NOTE
Service Procedure. THE 4.6L 3V AND 5.4L 3V ENGINES ARE
INSTALLED IN SEVERAL VEHICLE PLATFORMS,
ISSUE


WHICH MAY INFLUENCE THE INTENSITY OF
Some vehicles equipped with a 4.6L 3-valve or 5.4L NOISE DUE TO VEHICLE DIFFERENCES IN
3-valve engine may exhibit a ticking and / or SOUND TRANSMISSION PATHS, HOOD AND
knocking noise after reaching normal operating BODY INSULATION PACKAGES, AND ROOT
temperature, or a rattle upon starting. The noise CAUSE OF THE COMPONENT(S) CAUSING THE
may be described as ticks, taps, knocks, or thumps. NOISE.
In some cases the noise may be a normal
characteristic of these engines. In other cases the

PRE-CHECKS
noise may require further investigation. Sorting out
1. Make sure you have a detailed description of
and defining the noise as reported by the customer
the noise the customer is concerned with,
is important to successfully diagnose and / or repair
including whether the noise is occurring at idle
the condition.
or above idle speed (does it disappear above
ACTION


1200 RPM), and if the engine is cold, hot, or
Before starting diagnosis, it is critical to determine both when the noise is occurring. These
the specific engine noise the customer is concerned engines generate a lot of “normal” noises, so it
with. The customer should be interviewed to get is critical to confirm the noise the customer is
their detailed perception and description of the concerned with. Determine what environment
noise, and to determine if the noise occurs at idle the customer is in when the noise is most
or above idle speed, and if the engine is cold, hot, noticeable to them (inside passenger
or both. Attempt to duplicate the noise, and compartment, next to building with / without the
determine the source of the symptom. Refer to the driver and / or passenger window open, or
following Service Procedure to help determine the beside the wheel well). Validate by using your
source of the noise and if a repair is needed. own perception.
SERVICE PROCEDURE


2. Compare the noise generated with a new
vehicle, if available, with an ENGINE build date
NOTE


of 3/30/2005 or later on Mustang and 4/18/2005
READ THIS SECTION IN ITS ENTIRETY BEFORE or later on F-150 to F-350, Expedition and
BEGINNING. Navigator vehicles.
3. Diagnose noise when engine is at normal
operating temperature (Oil at 160

° F (71° C) or
above). Verify oil temperature by using a
diagnostic scan tool and monitoring the engine
oil temperature (EOT) PID. Startup rattle may
only occur with cold oil.
NOTE:


The information in Technical Service Bulletins is intended for use by trained, professional technicians with the knowledge, tools, and equipment to do
the job properly and safely. It informs these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or provides information that could assist in proper
vehicle service. The procedures should not be performed by “do-it-yourselfers”. Do not assume that a condition described affects your car or truck. Contact a
Ford, Lincoln, or Mercury dealership to determine whether the Bulletin applies to your vehicle. Warranty Policy and Extended Service Plan documentation
determine Warranty and/or Extended Service Plan coverage unless stated otherwise in the TSB article.The information in this Technical Service Bulletin
(TSB) was current at the time of printing. Ford Motor Company reserves the right to supercede this information with updates.The most recent information is
available through Ford Motor Company’s on-line technical resources.
Copyright


ã 2006 Ford Motor Company Online Publication Date September 13, 2006 PAGE 1
TSB 06-19-8 (Continued)
4. Check the type of oil filter installed on the VCT phasers may knock at hot idle. It may be
vehicle. A dirty or clogged filter may cause a heard inside the passenger compartment, or the
pressure drop. Look for aftermarket brands not wheel well area. Some light noise is normal. The
recognized in the market or a production filter engine may require a cold soak overnight for a full
that has gone beyond the standard Ford diagnosis to effectively be made at hot idle,
recommended change interval. particularly when a VCT phaser is suspected. The
knock is not prevalent at cold temperature.
5. Check for signs of oil brand used and viscosity
(interview customer if needed). Motorcraft


â To test for VCT noise:
SAE 5W-20 Premium Synthetic Blend Motor Oil
or equivalent is recommended. 1. Place the transmission in park or neutral
Once the above pre-checks are complete, check 2. Bring engine oil temperature to 160


° F (71° C)
for sound level from the following components, in or above as indicated by the scan tool “EOT”
the order listed. Compare the sound from these PID.
components to the noise the customer is concerned 3. Allow engine to idle, and determine if noise is
with, to determine the source of the noise. noticeable.
INJECTION / FUEL SYSTEM


4. Set engine speed to over 1200 RPM (if noise is
Injector noise (ticking) is considered normal. Noise a VCT knock, the noise should disappear).
increases with RPM hot or cold and is recognized 5. Return engine speed to idle (verify knock
at the top of the engine. returns).
VALVE TRAIN


If the noise intensity is more than a lightly audible
Lash adjusters can make a ticking / tapping noise knock at hot idle under 1200 RPM at engine
noticeable at any engine RPM / temperature and is operating temperature, replace the cam phaser
audible through the wheel well or an open hood. using the “In-Vehicle Repair” Camshaft Phaser and
However, with the hood down, lash adjuster noise Sprocket procedure found in the Workshop Manual,
can be heard as a light tapping noise through the Section 303-01
wheel well and is considered normal.

START UP RATTLE
Tracing this noise must be isolated to a cylinder Some 2004 F-150 and 2005 F-150, Expedition,
bank. If one bank is louder than the other bank, Navigator, F-Super Duty, and Mustang vehicles may
focus the diagnostic to the loud bank. If both banks have a rattle on startup that lasts 1 to 3 seconds. If
seem loud with the hood down, compare wheel well initial pre-checks have been completed and the
sound level to another comparable vehicle. noise sounds like it is coming from the front of the
Use a stethoscope on the top of the cam cover bolt engine, replace the VCT Phaser Kit. If the engine
heads to confirm which bank is affected. Move the continues to make the rattle noise after the initial
probe from front to rear if necessary. startup do not exchange VCT.
If isolated, only replace the intake and exhaust


PART NUMBER PART NAME
lifters on the affected cylinder bank.


5L1Z-6500-AA Lash Adjuster (2005 Vehicles)
3L3Z-6500-BA Lash Adjuster (2004 Vehicles)
VARIABLE CAM TIMING


3R2Z-6A257-DA VCT Phaser Kit
The 4.6L 3V and 5.4L 3V variable cam timing
(VCT) feature may emit a light knock in normal


WARRANTY STATUS: Eligible Under Provisions Of
operation and is audible only at idle speed, with a New Vehicle Limited
hot engine (gear selector in park / neutral). Warranty Coverage
However, it may be masked by or mistaken for
other noises generated from either injector firing or
a malfunctioning valve train as described above.
The noise does not affect performance or durability
of the part.
PAGE 2
TSB 06-19-8 (Continued)
OPERATION DESCRIPTION TIME


061908B 2005 Expedition / 2.7 Hrs.
061908A 2005 Expedition / 4.5 Hrs. Navigator 5.4L 3V:
Navigator 5.4L 3V: Replace Left Bank Lash
Replace Right Bank Lash Adjusters And / Or
Adjusters And / Or Camshaft Sprocket /
Camshaft Sprocket / Phaser (6500A, 6256A,
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, 6250A, 6020A, 6268B,
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6266A, 6584A, 9424A)
6266A, 6584A, 9424A) 061908C 2005 Expedition / 6.7 Hrs.
061908A 2005 Mustang 4.6L 3V: 2.2 Hrs. Navigator 5.4L 3V:
Replace Right Bank Lash Replace Both Banks Lash
Adjusters And / Or Adjusters And / Or
Camshaft Sprocket / Camshaft Sprocket /
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, Phaser (6500A, 6256A,
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6250A, 6020A, 6268B,
6266A, 6584A, 9424A) 6266A, 6584A, 9424A)
061908A 2005 Super Duty 5.4L 3V: 3.1 Hrs. 061908C 2005 Mustang 4.6L 3V: 4.2 Hrs.
Replace Right Bank Lash Replace Both Banks Lash
Adjusters And / Or Adjusters And / Or
Camshaft Sprocket / Camshaft Sprocket /
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, Phaser (6500A, 6256A,
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6250A, 6020A, 6268B,
6266A, 6584A, 9424A) 6266A, 6584A, 9424A)
061908A 2004-2005 F-150 5.4L 3V: 3.7 Hrs. 061908C 2005 Super Duty 5.4L 3V: 5.2 Hrs.
Replace Right Bank Lash Replace Both Banks Lash
Adjusters And / Or Adjusters And / Or
Camshaft Sprocket / Camshaft Sprocket /
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, Phaser (6500A, 6256A,
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6250A, 6020A, 6268B,
6266A, 6584A, 9424A) 6266A, 6584A, 9424A)
061908B 2004-2005 F-150 5.4L 3V: 2.5 Hrs. 061908C 2004-2005 F-150 5.4L 3V: 5.5 Hrs.
Replace Left Bank Lash Replace Both Banks Lash
Adjusters And / Or Adjusters And / Or
Camshaft ) Sprocket / Camshaft Sprocket /
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, Phaser (6500A, 6256A,
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6250A, 6020A, 6268B,
6266A, 6584A, 9424A 6266A, 6584A, 9424A)
061908B 2005 Super Duty 5.4L 3V: 2.6 Hrs. MT061908 Claim Additional Labor Actual
Replace Left Bank Lash Required As Actual Time Time
Adjusters And / Or

DEALER CODING
Camshaft Sprocket / CONDITION
Phaser (6500A, 6256A, BASIC PART NO. CODE
6250A, 6020A, 6268B, 6500 (LASH ADJUSTER
6266A, 6584A, 9424A) REPLACEMENT) 42
061908B 2005 Mustang 4.6L 3V: 2.3 Hrs. 6A257 (VCT REPLACEMENT) 42
Replace Left Bank Lash
Adjusters And / Or
Camshaft Sprocket /
Phaser Hrs. (6500A,
6256A, 6250A, 6020A,
6268B, 6266A, 6584A,

9424A)

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Last edited by Rickx; 04-06-2010 at 09:19 AM. Reason: Accuracy
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2010, 09:05 AM
jdyjen jdyjen is offline
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Ford F150 ticking...rocker arm replaced?

I had a bad ticking sound also and people thought I was driving a diesel. It also started idling rough. I took it too my local Ford dealer and he diagnosed it as a bad coil. I told him I smelled an odor and I wanted him to check my cats. He did and decided to replace them both. Then he told me my coil was okay. They took it upon themselves to open valve cover and told me I had a broken "rocker arm" and that my cam shaft was corroded. I told him to replace rocker arm and let me go on home because I couldn't afford much more. They felt like it was fixed. Drove home and next day light came on and engine started driving rough. I went back to dealership with codes 00172 and 00174 and they sold me some fuel injector cleaner. "this should fix it." Took it to a trusted local mechanic and he said it was cam phasers and he feels strongly it should fix my problem. My question is this, can bad cam phasers make your rocker arms break? I am not really mechanically inclined but am trying to research this before he puts on new phasers monday. thanks.
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Old 05-06-2010, 12:00 AM
lx2gt lx2gt is offline
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so this valet at my dealership (not ford) has a 07 fx4 with a 5.4 with 55 thousand, he missed an oil change and went about 20k miles, after the oil change it has had a loud tick from the right valve cover, i pulled the valve cover and found the front lobe is blue, the roller follower is gone along with the valve spring, all of which is in the bottom of the head, the valve is still up but wont move, inspection of the cylinder appears that the valve dropped and got hit by the piston and bent it but it didnt break off, its jammed in the head, piston is not damaged, is it safe to put a head and cam in it? anyone got one laying around? how much of a pain is it?
thanks
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:46 AM
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RSCHAP1 RSCHAP1 is offline
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Well after reading all 5 pages of this stuff, I am left wondering. I am looking at buying an 05 Navigator. Seems like a good deal, but the ticking is pretty bad. Seller/owner says it has an exhaust leak and a $108 manifold is the fix. I did not notice any exhaust leak, but he said yeh all the 5.4s like this make the valve train clattering. I think once I had my head burried near the timing chains he knew I wasn't listening for exhaust. I have a 98 Expedition that had manifold studs fail on and thought it may have been similar. But now it sounds like the common ticky...He said he runs 5-20 Castrol Syntech. Another thread here said something about Mobil One versus conventional 5-20. Synthetic "too" slippery? I have not heard anyone state failures or big trouble from the noise. I caught a couple about pops and figured back fires from the phasers maybe. Any advice PRIOR to my pulling the trigger...or making an offer? Aprreciate it!
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Old 06-25-2010, 03:50 PM
Homiklaus Homiklaus is offline
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Did you have any problems running 15W40 thru the 5.4 engine?
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Old 09-24-2010, 03:54 PM
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Ticking noise from right side-check for exhaust leak first

I have just over 53,000 miles on my 2004 5.4l 3v F150 truck. I noticed a ticking noise about 10,000 miles ago at cold start up. It always went away within 10 seconds so I never worried about it. About 2 weeks ago, the ticking noise is still there on cold start up and goes away. While driving under a load at any rpm(foot on the gas, from about 1000-2000rpm was really noticeable), I heard another ticking noise that does not go away. The noise sounded like it was coming from the right valve cover with the hood up. I work for a fleet and haven't run into the cam phasers on a 5.4 liter yet. I'm usually elbows deep in a 6.0L diesel.
I tried the 15w-40, that didn't work. Tried mavel mystery oil and STP that didn't help. So I dropped the 15w-40, bought 5w-20 and spun a MOTORCRAFT OIL FILTER(if your truck is under extended warranty, you better have a motorcraft oil filter or there going try to say it's not covered under warranty-I use a wix oil filter and 5w-20 mobil one synthetic oil). I took it to ford thinking exhaust leak. A mechanic at ford listen to the noise and said, "yup" cam phaser and followers. Service writer quoted me about $1500-2000 for the repair. Found out my extended warranty just expired in march of this year. I wasn't convinced with the mechanic's "yup" diagnosis. So before I decided to let Ford tear into it, I went home. Later that week, I decided to take the right side inner fender well out and surprisingly I saw a small exhaust leak on the back cylinder at the manifold. Haven't started the truck that day yet, I started the engine and ran to the other side and put my finger by the leak and sound of the ticking noise was muffled with my finger over the leak. Removed the manifold and the rear gasket was blown out. So I replaced the exhaust manifold and gasket for about $120 dollars, and no more noise!! I'm glad I didn't let Ford touch my truck!!!!
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Old 09-24-2010, 06:04 PM
Wilber15 Wilber15 is offline
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Sound like an easier fix then cam phazers...
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Old 09-24-2010, 06:07 PM
Wilber15 Wilber15 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSCHAP1 View Post
Well after reading all 5 pages of this stuff, I am left wondering. I am looking at buying an 05 Navigator. Seems like a good deal, but the ticking is pretty bad. Seller/owner says it has an exhaust leak and a $108 manifold is the fix. I did not notice any exhaust leak, but he said yeh all the 5.4s like this make the valve train clattering. I think once I had my head burried near the timing chains he knew I wasn't listening for exhaust. I have a 98 Expedition that had manifold studs fail on and thought it may have been similar. But now it sounds like the common ticky...He said he runs 5-20 Castrol Syntech. Another thread here said something about Mobil One versus conventional 5-20. Synthetic "too" slippery? I have not heard anyone state failures or big trouble from the noise. I caught a couple about pops and figured back fires from the phasers maybe. Any advice PRIOR to my pulling the trigger...or making an offer? Aprreciate it!
Be careful, is it idling rough? Those Navi's are known for sticking exhaust valves in the Driver's side head. Causing what sounds like an exhaust leak and a rough running engine.
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Old 09-25-2010, 07:44 AM
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from what i have found , the cam phasers in the early build engins have 3 hollow pegs that collaps and allow the phaser to move arond to much causing the rattling noise.the other issue i find is low oil pressure.if you check with a mechanical gause hot versis cold you base pressure falls off to around 10 psi,the cylinder heads get only half of the oil pressure.when you get a code for bank 1 and 2 over/under retarded then you will likly have to cheat and shim the oil pressure releif valve and run a thicker weight oil if the phasers have been replaced.usually the low oil pressure is because the cam journals in the head are worn and dumping oil pressure.
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Old 10-02-2010, 01:00 PM
reel mower reel mower is offline
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noisy valve train on 5.4

let me tell you something about ticking valves on 5.4 engines
first lets hope that every (engineer) that was involved in the design of the 5.4 is now standing on the unemployment line. that being said I had the ticking on mine. seemed to be on the right side (FORD) replaced cam phasers 2 times ticking never did go away. ticking got worse and became rattle under load like engine was out of time. so I decided to tear it down yesterday and found stationary guide on right timing chain shattered chain was about to rub a hole in the timing cover so I replaced everything on the front of the engine chains,tensioners,guides,water pump and cover and now the ticking is gone. (I also used havier oil and it did help for awhile) but now it runs better that when it was new.

now lets talk about a new problem that I am having with this (Fine Product) before I tore it down I had an intermitent problem where after it warmed up like when I got home from work (about 50 miles) I would put it in reverse to back in my driveway as soon as I give it some throttle it would try to stall and cause the engine to rattle until I gave it alot of throttle I think this happened about 2 time before teardown now it seems like when it warms up it is a constant problem (no codes) ford man tells me clutches in converter are bad and has sent metal through trans.
also now when I come to a stop (red light/traffic jam) it will try to stall unless I put it in neutral and come to a stop. any ideas?

JUST HOPING TO HAVE A CHEAP FIX ONE TIME ON THIS TRUCK!

also I want everyone to know I have never owned anything but Fords but this 05 F150 has tried my patience and I don't think I could sign my name on the line to buy another Ford ever again!
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