Upgrade '04 6.0, Trade up to '06-'07 6.0 Dually or New F450???
Hey Guys,
I've been lurking here since before I bought my '04 F350 SuperCab SRW 6.0 Shortbed. I was scared to death to buy it after reading the '03 horror stories, but all in all, 136,000 miles later, it's been an ok truck. Not bad, not great, but ok. I've done the obvious maitenance on it. 3 Sets of Ball Joints (finally got the good aftermarket ones), 2 EGR valves, etc, etc. It's in need of tires soon, as well as brakes, and I know it pukes antifreeze (dealer told me it was normal until it was out of warranty).
That said, my wife an I have decided to buy a 5th wheel camping trailer to vacation with (35' Carriage Cameo, dry weight is 12,370# GVWR is 14,999#). I think camping is a great activity for our daughter (2 y.o.). We can travel the country etc. My dilemma is as follows:
Do I sink more money into upgrading my '04 F350? Trade up to a newer (but used 6.0) Dually or suck it up and buy a new F350 or F450 6.4?
I'd rather have a Crew Cab over my existing Super Cab giving the three of us extra room during long trips, as well as the ability to bring another couple with us. So this kinda rules out keeping what I have.
If I'm going to tradeup, I might as well get a 8' bed with the crew cab, since then I won't need a slider 5th wheel (saving me some $$ on the hitch $3,000 for a PullRite Slider), and if I'm going this far, why not just get a dually??
My concerns are:
Is my '04 6.0 a ticking bomb, especially now that I'm going to put a 13,000 - 15,000# load on it? Is it even rate to tow that much?
Rather than spend money on the '04, should I put that money toward a newer '06-'07? Are the newer 6.0's any better than the '03-'04's (head bolts, egr, etc)? Or am I buying the same potential headaches I have now with my '04?
Do I eat cat food for the next 2-3 years and buy a new F350 Dually or F450, and suffer with the mileage, DPF, etc? New '08's a selling anywhere from $11,000 to $15,000 off sticker around here.
If I go for the F450 which only comes with 4:30 gears, will I get croaked on fuel commuting 3-4 days a week 70 miles round trip?
Last option is that for the price of trading in my '04 for a new F350/450, I could probably keep the '04 and buy a used '99-02 and put a few bucks into beefing up an old 7.3 Dually?? Maybe even get a 2wd which would save fuel on the long hauls (I really am a 4wd kinda guy though).
My truck splits daily driver duty with my car. I also use it to plow my driveway (small) in the winter. My wife is already reeling against the idea of a 5th vehicle. Although it makes sense to me.
Sorry about the massive post, but as you can see, I've spent days and days running this through my head, so I figured I'd keep you guys awake at night pondering the dilemma too!!
If I were you I would get a 2007 Crew Cab DRW King Ranch.... I had to add King Ranch the leather is awesome. Your truck is puking?? Dealer says normal?? Sounds like your gaskets are blown and pulling a 5th wheel would really test your patience with blown head gaskets. I have kids too and the Crew Cab is a must. my $.02.
__________________
Jonathan
2004 F250 PSD SB King Ranch 4x4:Build Date: 01/23/2004
Dieselsite Coolant Bypass Filter, High Idle Mod
Fumoto Oil Drain Valve, Harpoon Mod, Zoodad
Isspro 40 PSI Boost, Water Temp, Oil Temp and Trans Temp
Is my '04 6.0 a ticking bomb, especially now that I'm going to put a 13,000 - 15,000# load on it? Is it even rate to tow that much?
Yes, it can handle that load, I haul about 16k with the horses when I'm pulling to shows, however since your puking coolant, that isn't good in the long run for towing. You could keep it and keep adding coolant to it in order to keep it going, but I would either have that repaired or upgrade.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJr15
Rather than spend money on the '04, should I put that money toward a newer '06-'07? Are the newer 6.0's any better than the '03-'04's (head bolts, egr, etc)? Or am I buying the same potential headaches I have now with my '04?
Well, the design flaw is still there, however, getting the torqing of the bolts to specs might have been done with more frequency and therefore, might hold a little better then they did in 03 and 04. However, don't kid yourself, it is still a design flaw and the risk is still there, just a diminished odd that it might happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJr15
Do I eat cat food for the next 2-3 years and buy a new F350 Dually or F450, and suffer with the mileage, DPF, etc? New '08's a selling anywhere from $11,000 to $15,000 off sticker around here.
Heads have a better design, but it is still an unproven engine although it seems to be off to a better start then the 6.0. The mileage does suck and most are going to deletes and custom tunes and from what they have said are doing much better with mileage improvement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJr15
If I go for the F450 which only comes with 4:30 gears, will I get croaked on fuel commuting 3-4 days a week 70 miles round trip?
I can't say what will happen in your case because there could be other variables then what I deal with, but if I keep it between 65 and 70 I can get about 15 upwards to 16 but that is with quite a few mods as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJr15
Last option is that for the price of trading in my '04 for a new F350/450, I could probably keep the '04 and buy a used '99-02 and put a few bucks into beefing up an old 7.3 Dually?? Maybe even get a 2wd which would save fuel on the long hauls (I really am a 4wd kinda guy though).
My truck splits daily driver duty with my car. I also use it to plow my driveway (small) in the winter. My wife is already reeling against the idea of a 5th vehicle. Although it makes sense to me.
While I think most would say go for this option because of their opinon of the 7.3 and it will do what you want it to do, but you will notice a power difference and have to compensate for that accordingly. It will pull it don't get me wrong, but I think you'll be surprised at the difference stock for stock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimJr15
Sorry about the massive post, but as you can see, I've spent days and days running this through my head, so I figured I'd keep you guys awake at night pondering the dilemma too!!
No apologizing necessary, in my opinion this is why forums like this are around.
Bottomline: I will say this, I am partial to the newer 6.0s(gee I wonder why), however it would either be this option or have the 04 repaired with ARP studs and bypass the EGR valve at the same time and be done with it. No matter what, I think repair the old truck and keep it would probably still be cheaper then upgrading to a new(er) one. I do think you'll be a little disappointed with the power reduction with the 7.3, but I could be wrong(I had a 7.3(2002) and I'm glad I have a 6.0).
Ok....sounds like 2 votes for newer 6.0 and one for fix existing.
I'm figuring on trailering in the neighborhood of 6-10 weekends out of the year as well as one week to two week long trip. The more confidence I have in the tow vehicle, the farther I dare go.
In another forum, I read that the 2006's built after January of '06 have better head bolts since the factory had retooled for the 6.4's at that point, and I also read that F350's built from '05 on are purposely designed to have the cab more easily removed (with a lift obviously) for servicing the diesels, since that is what the tech were doing to service the '03-'04's. Does anyone know if these are accurate??
I also read that F350's built from '05 on are purposely designed to have the cab more easily removed (with a lift obviously) for servicing the diesels, since that is what the tech were doing to service the '03-'04's. Does anyone know if these are accurate??
I don't know how much easier trucks like mine are to remove the cab, but I do know the 6.4s are definately been made to make removal easier especially since alot of work has to be done with the cab off for that engine.
Interesting some would spend the money on the head-studs and gaskets for the old truck.
Well first off, I don't really think that it's an old truck either by year or by mileage, particularly since I have an 06(05 build date) and I'm over the 100k mark myself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dirthawg
Can anyone that's had this done comment on how expensive it is to install the ARP studs?
I can give you an estimate, I can't really say though that what I payed is what you are going to pay or anything like that. However, all said and done it was ~ $1,900. Now I did do some of my other aftermarket stuff at the same time and the labor was just based on the headgaskets, but technically speaking I could allocate that cost over other mods that I had done at the same time. So if your going to be doing other mods, that would be the time to do it as typically the only labor would be for the headgaskets if you were getting those done with other mods, so you would just be out the cost of the other mods and not labor for the installation of those mods.
I would also recommend getting arp studs and doing the egr delete. A friend of mine has a 2006 model in the shop right now as we speak getting arp studs. His egr cooler was also leaking. Ironically my 2003 has more miles and pulls a lot more weight and has no headgasket issues on stock bolts. I must have got true heads and proper torquing off the assembly line.
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03 F250 4x4 CC LB 6.0 XLT Sport
Prodigy brake controller
High Idle Mod
Isspro boost gauge
4" Magnaflow Cat-Back
Ride-Rite Air Springs
Bilstein shocks
I have an F450 crew cab dually. I have to say it is a nice truck. What I did not know when I bought it was how hard it was to find a company to insurance it. Most companies consider it a commercial vehicle and do not handle trucks this size 9600 lbs. So does the dept of motor vehicles they will try to charge you a higher amount then a f350. (California )
They typically come with a 488 or a 430 gears in the rear axle so mpg will be low. But they tow great.
Hope this helps.
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