I agree about kicking people when there down FTE KEN but the bottom line is
FORD=Broke
TOYOTA= $bags
They have a lot more money than ford to through around and can afford to pay 1.5 the resale value and to me it is very commendable on there part, When it seems like when you have a problem with a ford they seem to say "what do you want us to do about it"
The dealer? The dealer's only involvement with this "issue" (in my case) is they inspect, give the customer a 30 day loaner, and submit the registration paperwork to Toyota/ISG...
If I bought a Tacoma after March 7th from a private seller, or a dealer, Toyota would only pay me back 100% of what I paid... Anything prior to March 7th would be 1.5x KBB Excellent Value, regardless of its condition...
Last Saturday, I walked in, met the ISG rep, signed the title over, a couple of other docs, and he gave me my check, plus a certificate for either 1000 off a new truck, or 500 off a car... I walked out of the dealer, and not one salesperson bothered approaching me in regards to the replacement of my Tacoma...
As far as Brand Bashing, I won't play that game... I can only hope my new-to-me F350 will give me the same 9 years of great service my Tacoma did... Not once did I find myself stranded because of a mechanical failure (and I beat the hell out of that thing), and the only repair I ever had to do was on a axle seal from playing in muddy water too much...
I read your .pdf attachements mutiple times and there is nothing that states the buy-back of 1.5 x KBB is limited to vehicles purchased prior to 3/7/08. In Section 8 of your first attachment, it does state that the "Dealer" is not subject to the 1.5 x KBB because it is implied that the "Dealer" should not experience profit from the recall. If a Dealer has a qualifying vehicle, they should not sell that vehicle to the public. It's just common sense.
Attachment: Warranty - Dealer Communiation
Section: 8 labeled "Vehicle Repurchasing Process" on Page 3
"Please note that in the event a vehicle exibiting corrosion perforation was purchased by a Toyota dealer after the announcement of this Program, the dealer will not be eligible for repurchase at 1.5 times Kelley Blue Book; instead, TMS (i) will repurchase that vehicle at the documented cost of the dealer and (ii) request contact information for the person who sold the vehicle to the dealer ao that TMS may contact that customer."
Before responding to my post, I respectfully request that you fully read your attachments. If you find anything in those documents that validate your statement that only those vehicles purchased prior to 3/7/08 are subject to the 1.5 x KBB, then site the attachment name and section/page #.
has anyone thought of this... ok i know that some farmers do this sometimes.. if a crop is bad they can count it as a loss.. right? what if toyota had some kinda insurance on their production they could probally count this ordeal as a loss or some other kinda bs. i mean big companies like that can count a bunch of stuff and you know they prolly got insurance on everything with that lilttle logo on it.. (maybe even the chopsticks too) just a thought of mine prolly totally wrong but no1 ever really knows but that may be how they can pay the 1.5 times...
__________________ Steve
PAA #27
1999 F-250 Superduty 7.3 (really all that matters) CC SRW 4x4
Diablo Predator,Straight exhaust,6637 filter w/ Pete's Cover, Foil Delete, CCV mod, Cobra 29 w/echo, super swing kit, and talk back,Sportsman Camo Covers.
" If guns kill people, forks make people fat and cars make people drive drunk"
Think about supply and demand... now there are fewer Toyota trucks on the market so if you own one of the surviving trucks, your resell value just went up. Also, I would think that a lot of customer's will take that 1.5 and use it as a down payment on a new truck, which promotes current sales goals.
Fords in the snowbelt have never rusted, have they?
Of course they rust.... on the body panels. I've lived in salty road country (usually from Oct to May) all my life and I've never seen any 13 year old vehicle's frame rust in half!
Quote:
Originally Posted by supeRobertduty
I Bet Toyota is sorry it bought AMERICAN Frames from dana, The joke is on us guys.
Did Toyota not specify, inspect, and accept these frames before using them? If we place the blame on Dana for Toy's frames then we all need to place the blame on Firestone for Ford's tire problems. Ford seems to catch all the flack on that issue so Toy needs to catch all the flack on these frames.
__________________
2004 F250 XLT Sport CC, 5.4L, 4.10LS
"Did Toyota not specify, inspect, and accept these frames before using them? If we place the blame on Dana for Toy's frames then we all need to place the blame on Firestone for Ford's tire problems. Ford seems to catch all the flack on that issue so Toy needs to catch all the flack on these frames.[/quote]
Duh,
Ford Blamed firestone , FORD Blames Navistar, Ford Blames paint maker's, FORD blames the EPA,FORD Blames dealers, FORD Blames Cutomers. FORD Blames venders EVERY TIME .FORD is King of the Blame game . Did FORD not specify and inspect anything ?
Toyota is a top notch company and is doing the right thing,above and beyond.
Besides what other mid size truck is better. A Ranger or a S-10 (lol) yea right
Duh,
Ford Blamed firestone , FORD Blames Navistar, Ford Blames paint maker's, FORD blames the EPA,FORD Blames dealers, FORD Blames Cutomers. FORD Blames venders EVERY TIME .FORD is King of the Blame game . Did FORD not specify and inspect anything ?
Toyota is a top notch company and is doing the right thing,above and beyond.
Besides what other mid size truck is better. A Ranger or a S-10 (lol) yea right
I did not say that Ford shouldn't be to blame for their problems. I'm saying what's fair for one is fair for the other. Everyone seems to place the blame on Ford's shoulders for the Firestone problem. Now you're saying we should let Toy pass the buck to Dana on this one?
Oh... as for the Ranger/S-10 question. I'd say the Ranger or S-10 is best... at least when it comes to the frames
__________________
2004 F250 XLT Sport CC, 5.4L, 4.10LS
My Point is: TOYOTA is not blamming anyone but themselves .Even though evidence shows it was a Dana screw up. Toyota takes this stuff personal and heads rolled at both companys,but in private.
That's what good responsible companys do. If this was a ford thing the reason you would hear so much about it is FORD would be in Lawsuits to try and get out of it and blame someone else as in the past.
As far as the best small truck goes:
If we use the f150's # 1 sales as a badge of greatness, Then the Tacoma is 10 times greater than any S-10 or nearly discontinued Ranger.
Toyota takes the problem face first , while ford just looks the other way on the spark plug thread issue and others, putting customers last. Guess who has made themselves some loyal customers for life, and guess who will eventually collapse?
Ok, ok, ok, I agree with all you guys. But here is the fact:
The Toyota Tacoma pickup trucks break in half. Wonderful that Toyota stands behind their product, years later, but how many died, how many were mangled? Why did it take 8 or 9 years. No different than FORD. How much honor is left in honorable?
__________________
2001 Excursion Ltd. V-10 (the GOOD)
2003 Excursion Ltd. 6.0 (the BAD)
2005 F-350 6.0, KR, long bed, 4x4 (the UGLY)
2008 F-350, 6.4, KR, long bed, 4x4 (LEAN, MEAN & BEAUTIFUL)
No doubt about it, I'm a true blue all American Ford loyalist, but please........toyota's frame rust in half......I don't really care if toyta's president comes over to each and every owners house and kisses his ..., the frames rust in half.
Do you expect me to believe it took the toyota 9 years to notice a that there is a rusting problem with a truck's frame??
Does steel go from perfect condition to completley rusted through overnight?? Not in Japan, not in the U.S.,not on this planet.
Where do a heck of a lot of people take thier toyotas to get serviced or repaired ?? The toyota Dealer which according to the toyota fans are the Holy Grail of Dealerships, that's where....
Didn't any of the dealers put any of these rust buckets on rack to service or repair them??
Did the Techs notice extra holes in the frame? I'm betting they did.
Did the Dealers pass the info on to corprate? I'm betting they did.
Bottom line is toyota has had a problem with frames rusting for quite sometime and has done nothing, except delaying doing the "honorable" thing.
I'm guessing that toyota got wind that the Feds had a hold of this and were working on forcing toyota to do the "honorable" thing.
The toyota PR
I have to give them props for trying to spin this whole mess into a positve thing and I also have to give them props for offering more than marlet value for the rusted truck. That is a something Ford should take notice of.
__________________
01' F-350 4X4 SB CC V-10 Driver
76' F-250 4X4 428 Cruiser
68' Bronco Crawler
05' Explorer Wife's Driver
[quote=four4x4fords;6168266]No doubt about it, I'm a true blue all American Ford loyalist, but please........toyota's frame rust in half......I don't really care if toyta's president comes over to each and every owners house and kisses his ..., the frames rust in half.
Do you expect me to believe it took the toyota 9 years to notice a that there is a rusting problem with a truck's frame?? .
The way I read the info It Was Only 1995.5 model year thru 2000 = 4.5 years of trucks aprox
It was a large number of truck's becauce they sell so many.
I find it comical though... there is potential for great loss of life and even still people see no ding in Toyota's reputation. I'm not saying Ford is perfect with their problems either, however, this problem has been going on for some time. I for one will be very interested to see what the media does when they catch wind of this...I realize however that the Ford and Toyota reputation/quality issues are very touchy subjects for some... Just giving my 2 cents. Oh and the comparison of a Tacoma to a Ranger or S-10...this thread is about the tacoma, not the other two trucks. Plus, I don't hear of many frame failures with those trucks rusting out... Back on topic...
Last edited by camodown : 05-18-2008 at 11:52 PM.
Reason: my 2 cents
I find it comical though... there is potential for great loss of life and even still people see no ding in Toyota's reputation. ...
The 7.3 has been out of production how long now? 2003 1/4 MY to 2008 almost 2009 MY. Lets call it 5 years. It was in production since 1994.5, lets call that 14 years ago. A long time to fix the CPS issue that definitely had the potential as well.
Frames don't rust overnight, and yes I'm sure the process you mentioned as far as dealers reporting to TMC etc was part of the solution.
Regardless of whether there was almost a mandate is pointless, they are handling it in a way that makes the customer happy. Which is what they have always done. They don't neccesarily build a better product, but they build a better customer (that at least THINKS it's a better product).
If I owned one, and toyota offered to buy it back because of rust, and made it worth my while, I would surely buy another one! That kind of initiative is worth it!
Just the same reason I WON'T own a 6.0 regardless of the arguments, or the number of people that have a "good" one, or the power or whatever. It isn't worth the potential hassel to get it fixed, and fixed right, or even looked at by Ford in most cases.
Toyota is doing what it does well, as has been mentioned, taking care of their customer. Original owner or not, they view them as their customer. Probably a large part of the reason it was worth it for them to build the cars in U.S. Customer perception. The profits might ultimately go back across the Pacific, but they can say they are built in the USA by Americans.
Unfortunately I just don't believe that Ford can afford to do that.
If it is a ding, it is no worse than anyone else's except they are handling it in a very good manner!
__________________
ASE Certified Master Automotive Technician
Current Vehicles:
2002 F-250 7.3L PSD 4x4 XLT
2002 Sunset Orange Mettalic WS6 Trans Am Convertible
Join Our Site - Its free, quick and easy!
