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  #1  
Old 02-25-2008, 10:35 AM
Genesis Genesis is offline
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Best weight oil for Modular V-10

I've always been in the habit of using 10W-30 in my vehicles despite manufacturer's wanting 5W-20. I thought the lighter weight was to meet gas milage standards but wasn't as good for lubrication.

I just read that using the heavier weight oil is bad for these modular engines. Any thoughts? By the way I use Mobil 1 full synthetic every 3K or so.
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  #2  
Old 02-25-2008, 11:23 AM
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The best oil for the modular is 5W20. It isn't just for fuel economy, that what these engines were designed to use. That's all I've ever used in my V10's 103,000 miles.
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Old 02-25-2008, 12:19 PM
89Flivver 89Flivver is offline
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Wink Follow Owner's Manual

Except for older vehicles (>15 years old) which is a different discussion, I would ALWAYS use what is the first non-brand specific recommendation in the owner's manual. Luckily, in North America, oil specs are sequential and you are not likely to get into trouble by going from SJ > SL > SM > SN > you get the drift.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Genesis
I've always been in the habit of using 10W-30 in my vehicles despite manufacturer's wanting 5W-20. I thought the lighter weight was to meet gas milage standards but wasn't as good for lubrication.

I just read that using the heavier weight oil is bad for these modular engines. Any thoughts? By the way I use Mobil 1 full synthetic every 3K or so.
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  #4  
Old 02-25-2008, 01:08 PM
YoGeorge YoGeorge is offline
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I'd go with 5W on the low end...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Genesis
I've always been in the habit of using 10W-30 in my vehicles despite manufacturer's wanting 5W-20. I thought the lighter weight was to meet gas milage standards but wasn't as good for lubrication.

I just read that using the heavier weight oil is bad for these modular engines. Any thoughts? By the way I use Mobil 1 full synthetic every 3K or so.
The modulars (and Duratecs) seem to do better with the lighter oils so they get up to the valve train quicker. I've used 5W20 in my 4.6 van since new and it works fine.

My wife had a '98 Duratec Sable, originally specced for 5W30, and when the dealer switched to 5W20 maybe in 2005 ($25 oil changes in half an hour, so I didn't change it myself), it did seem to use a bit more oil, so I would probably have leaned toward 5W30 on that car (which had well over 100k miles on it).

10W30 synthetic is probably pretty decent on your modular, especially if you're doing a lot of heavy work with it, or long road trips, especially in a warm climate, but I'd probably lean toward 5W30 as a compromise or, if it doesn't use any more oil, try 5W20 for a possible (small) gas mileage gain.

Hell, NASCAR cars use weights like 5W20 these days...even 0W20's for qualifying as I recall.

George
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Old 02-25-2008, 01:13 PM
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Ford is not going to warranty hundreds of V-10s if they don't beleive a 5w20 oil (as they recommend) is the best oil for this engine. Think about it? PLUS, they know that many of these V-10s are purchased to tow, hauling campers, trailers, and other commercial applications! That is a much harder, severe service for these engines.

If you did run a 5w30 or a 10w30, then using a quality full synthetic such as Mobil 1, Royal Purple, RED LINE oil, would be the way to go. However, for warranty purposes, I would run strictly a 5w20, as specified.
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Old 02-25-2008, 03:50 PM
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Thanks guys. I'll be using the 5w20 going forward and it will be full synthetic always as I love my truck and have no intention of parting with it.
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Old 02-25-2008, 03:59 PM
YoGeorge YoGeorge is offline
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Couple more things...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Genesis
Thanks guys. I'll be using the 5w20 going forward and it will be full synthetic always as I love my truck and have no intention of parting with it.
One important element for the mods and Duratecs is to use oil filters with a good anti-drainback valve--Motorcraft filters are great in this respect with a silicone anti-drainback valve. There are other good filters out there as well--but my Ford dealer was using some "no name" filters which definitely gave me more start-up noise--I now pay them the extra $5 for a Motorcraft filter gladly.

And, if you're using a full synthetic, I would stretch the oil change intervals to 5 or 6k (have a UOA--used oil analysis--done if you have any concerns). Porsche and BMW use synthetic oils and end up with change intervals of 12k miles--for a while, Porsche used change intervals of 24k miles (!!) but backed down to 12k. I do suspect that Porsches run with much larger crankcase capacities based on engine size.

I do use change intervals of 3-4k myself with Motorcraft semi-syn oil, and when my extended warranty is up (in the next 1000 miles), might well change to full synthetic 5W20 and kick up the intervals to 5-6k, doing changes myself. As a matter of fact, I recently bought 24 quarts of Quaker State Torque Power 5W20 at an Advance Auto closeout for 95 cents a quart...that'll give me just about 4 changes for under $10 each including new FL820S filters.

George
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Old 02-26-2008, 04:15 AM
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[QUOTE=YoGeorge]One important element for the mods and Duratecs is to use oil filters with a good anti-drainback valve--Motorcraft filters are great in this respect with a silicone anti-drainback valve. There are other good filters out there as well--but my Ford dealer was using some "no name" filters which definitely gave me more start-up noise--I now pay them the extra $5 for a Motorcraft filter gladly.

And, if you're using a full synthetic, I would stretch the oil change intervals to 5 or 6k (have a UOA--used oil analysis--done if you have any concerns). Porsche and BMW use synthetic oils and end up with change intervals of 12k miles--for a while, Porsche used change intervals of 24k miles (!!) but backed down to 12k. I do suspect that Porsches run with much larger crankcase capacities based on engine size.

I do use change intervals of 3-4k myself with Motorcraft semi-syn oil, and when my extended warranty is up (in the next 1000 miles), might well change to full synthetic 5W20 and kick up the intervals to 5-6k, doing changes myself. As a matter of fact, I recently bought 24 quarts of Quaker State Torque Power 5W20 at an Advance Auto closeout for 95 cents a quart...that'll give me just about 4 changes for under $10 each including new FL820S filters.

George
-----------------
Nice work and a nice plan there, George. Doing the labor yourself, you'll save a lot of $$, plus you always have the personal satisfaction of knowing the job was done correctly.

Sometimes I feel nobody can do an oil change better than I can on any of my vehicles, I know some punk yahoo with a nose ring is not torquing down the oil pan drain bolt that causes stripped (or loose, = leaks) threads, I know old oil has not run all over the frame and undercarriage, I know my brand new oil filter does not have grimy, greasy, fingerprints on it AND I know when it's time to remove the oil filter, I can get it off without a breaker bar! (and a few cuss words!)

I am sure you feel the same way with your equipment.

I can understand if someone has a physical problem where they can't do their own oil changes, the elderly, ect. However, us DIYers save $ and use quality products, it a win-win situation.

Ed
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Old 02-26-2008, 05:08 PM
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I change oil in my V10 at 3k miles regardless of oil type. I only use 5-20 and a Fl-820s filter.

A lot of the european cars also hold much more oil than the V10 does so thats the main reason why they have such long drain intervals. I read in another forum some small 6cyl BMWs have like a 10qt oil pan. The 2V V10 only holds 6qts. and the 3V V10 only holds 7qts. Thats not a lot of oil.
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Old 02-26-2008, 06:20 PM
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Good point...

Quote:
Originally Posted by dkf
I change oil in my V10 at 3k miles regardless of oil type. I only use 5-20 and a Fl-820s filter.

A lot of the european cars also hold much more oil than the V10 does so thats the main reason why they have such long drain intervals. I read in another forum some small 6cyl BMWs have like a 10qt oil pan. The 2V V10 only holds 6qts. and the 3V V10 only holds 7qts. Thats not a lot of oil.
I am a bit surprised that the V10 only holds 6-7 quarts. Same as my 4.6, essentially.

Most of the BMW 6-cylinder engines hold about 7 quarts--the M3 6 cylinder actually holds only 6 quarts, and has a rev limit of something like 8000 RPM, and the BMW VANOS (variable valve timing) system allegedly shears the hell out of oil. But the factory spec oil is a full syn 10W60($$$) and they have OC indicators that go off only after 10-12k.

...and the newest BMW's OMIT THE FREAKIN' DIPSTICK--shades of the 5R55W transmission. (just go to the dealer if you need oil)....I would not touch one of those cars with a 10-foot pole.

We've got two 4-cylinder BMW's--I have a '91 318is, my son a '97 318ti, and they each take about 5.5 quarts, which is a good amount to be sure...and I have an '03 Mazda Protege5 which I bought last year, similar motor to the BMW's, that holds only 3.7 quarts--that makes me a bit nervous--with an oil filter the size of a thimble. Our BMW's specify a 15W40 oil down to temps below zero fahrenheit but we've been using 10W40 for easier cranking in the winter (I've used Rotella 15W40 for most of the lifetime of my '91, which only sees a couple thou a year now). Even my '91 BMW has an OC indicator and that has gone about 9k miles--I've ignored it and used to change it every 3-4k when driving it daily. And my son is changing his every 3-4k, with 166k on the odo an zero oil consumption.

I guess if I had a V10, I'd be inclined to use a 3-4k interval with Motorcraft 5W20, but would push it to 5-6k with a full synthetic, still within Ford's recommendation.

And I'm still on the fence with my Mazda....I did a change with full synthetic (first time ever using a full syn) and *may* push it to 4 or 5k. But with such a small crankcase, and with buy one/get one free Valvoline full syn at Advance Auto parts, hell, it's only $11 for 4 quarts of full synthetic.

When I swith my 4.6 van to full syn, I'd have no problem with 6k changes, maybe....

George
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Old 03-01-2008, 07:57 PM
10pistonkingranch 10pistonkingranch is offline
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i've used Mobil synthetic 5W-30 for Truck & SUV in my '03 F350 V10 ever since i bought it (now 131,000 miles) and it runs like a swiss watch. also i use the Fram oil filter (whatever the one is that's grey with a black grippy bottom) i think it's a "toughguard," but it's designed for heavy duty use and dusty dirty muddy conditions... it keeps oil in the filter too instead of letting it drain once the engine is cut off.
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Old 03-01-2008, 10:16 PM
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ya know, not to hijack this thread, but I'm trying to start a new movement.
I have a 1992 Galant that has a varied range of viscosities that "can be" used.
BUT, even more importantly, they recommended 7k mile OCI's way back then....and look at how much oil has improved over the years!!! So why do people (other than piece of mind) think they need to stick with 3k mile OCI's? especially synthetic (Sorry Genesis, not digging on you, it's millions of us)? Why not be comfy with the SM oils as long as it's the right viscosity, for 7k???/
I know it boils down to everyone doing what they think is best and makes them comfortable, but thought i'd throw this one out there...
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Old 03-02-2008, 12:53 PM
Genesis Genesis is offline
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Synthetic

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsylvstr
ya know, not to hijack this thread, but I'm trying to start a new movement.
I have a 1992 Galant that has a varied range of viscosities that "can be" used.
BUT, even more importantly, they recommended 7k mile OCI's way back then....and look at how much oil has improved over the years!!! So why do people (other than piece of mind) think they need to stick with 3k mile OCI's? especially synthetic (Sorry Genesis, not digging on you, it's millions of us)? Why not be comfy with the SM oils as long as it's the right viscosity, for 7k???/
I know it boils down to everyone doing what they think is best and makes them comfortable, but thought i'd throw this one out there...
No offense taken. Overkill with maintenance is something I've always been guilty of. It's habit forming. I only put about 6K a year on my van so it's not that costly for me. I know 5 to 7K would be just fine with the synthetic and I like the peace of mind knowing if I don't get to a change I'm more than covered. My V-10 only uses 6 quarts which doesn't thrill me either. This engine should use 7 or 8 then I would feel better about longer OCI's.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:20 PM
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There has been past threads in the V10 forums of guys using heavy 15w-40 and 20w50 in the 6.8l V10s. In the case of the old school auto mechanic that was running his V10 with 20w50 his engine lasted something like 15k or so before it melted down.

There is absolutly no reason to use anything other than what is recommended in the 6.8l, 5w-20 earlier V10s prior to 2000 called for 5w-30. 5w-30 will work good in the V10. Using a heavier oil in the V10 or other mod motor is down right moronic, even if just using 10w-30. 5w-20 is proven to run good in modulars so why not run it?

Mod motors need the lighter oil. The camshafts in Modular motors actually ride on the machined aluminum head surface. There are no bearings that it rides on, just steel to aluminum. Oil needs to get between the cam journals and the head for proper lubrication and thick oils just won't do that.
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Old 03-02-2008, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YoGeorge
I do use change intervals of 3-4k myself with Motorcraft semi-syn oil, and when my extended warranty is up (in the next 1000 miles), might well change to full synthetic 5W20 and kick up the intervals to 5-6k, doing changes myself.
George
For what its worth. I was at a "Lubrication" seminar last week and there was an Engineer there doing the seminar from Lubriplate. He has been the head engineer there for decades.

One thing he brought up was the Synthetic vs Conventional oil debate. He said in automobiles synthetics are absolutly great. What he did recommend though was using 100% synthetic oil from day one. He said using conventional oil will expand the engine seals over time. Then after running conventional oil for several years people will make the switch to synthetics. The synthetics do not make seals expand like the conv. oil and will actually shrink the seals once synthetic is run for a while. When the seals shrink the engine will start leaking or using oil. Thats one of the reason people notice increased oil consumption after switching to synthetic oils.

I've been running my V10 on synthetic since it had 500miles on it. If your vehicles have more than 20k miles on it running conv. or blend oil I would continue to run that. Motorcraft oil is actually top notch oil.

Just some food for thought.
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