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Old 02-07-2008, 10:19 AM
gearheadz80 gearheadz80 is offline
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Pre-ignition Catalytic Converter

Has anyone seen this one yet?

There are two parts of the install. 1- Hydro assist fuel cell install. 2- Another Cat. conv. that changes exhaust gasses into PLASMA........???????


http://www.preignitioncc.com/ps/index.htm


I've seen quite a few hydrogen kits, but this is the first one I see with a Cat. install. What are your thoughts?
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Old 02-07-2008, 10:42 AM
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I wouldn't use it until I actually saw someone with it and if I lived in a emissions state
I would want to see a report from a similar vehicle since a lean running vehicle will send
Nox readings sky high!! Check out the guy welding picture it doesn't look like he has on any eye protection!!
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Old 02-08-2008, 04:27 AM
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They may have mentioned this already here, but in a different section. If I remember correctly, people were scoffing at the 30-degree grade claim.
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Old 02-08-2008, 07:44 AM
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from an energy standpoint, its never going to work. It will always take more energy to do the electrolysis than you will be able to get out of it - its not a perfect system. The extra fuel that might be saved by adding extra H2 and O2 will be negated by the fact that the alternator is going to have to work harder, putting more strain on the engine. Its the same thing as fuel magnets and certain **special** motor oils magically increasing engine performance over other full synthetics **cough cough royal purple and amsoil cough cough** (not that they are bad, but they won't magically increase HP or anything)

First of all, all that catalytic converter business they talk about is Bull S****. Cat's don't break down the fuel so it burns in the tailpipe, they take CO, NO, and unburned hydrocarbons and use a catalyst for a RedOx (not a combustion reaction) to chemically convert all that to CO2 and H20 and even a little 02. The point is that that site can't even get its facts together, never-mind do real science. Its basically a scam.

Oh and if you watch the video it says that the new fuel will burn so clean that you NEVER need to change your oil. Come on. You need to change your oil mainly because it gets hot and breaks down as it goes through the engine, NOT because it gets contaminated (although that is also a factor)

And I'm not exactly sure, but is this thing trying to run *plasma* through your ejectors that are meant for liquid fuel (that is vaporized when injected into the engine)? That can't be good.

Besides, it sounds like this is a 1 size fits all application. I would bet the restriction from the small PICC would do more harm than good.

If you want to try it, be my guest, (who knows maybe you're right and if you are and your X gets 100 mpg let me know, and I'll buy the kit too) but I have a feeling that this is a hoax. If it were really possible to get that kind of mileage, the factories would be doing it too. Look at my sig, if there's a way to get good mileage, I'm all for it, but I don't think that this is it.

sorry about all that ranting

Here's the link to the same discussion in the excursion forum
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/69...hlight=100+MPG
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Old 02-08-2008, 08:59 AM
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**** Scam ****
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Old 02-08-2008, 11:52 AM
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Cat's don't break down the fuel so it burns in the tailpipe, they take CO, NO, and unburned hydrocarbons and use a catalyst for a RedOx (not a combustion reaction) to chemically convert all that to CO2 and H20 and even a little 02. The point is that that site can't even get its facts together, never-mind do real science. Its basically a scam.
http://www.popsci.com/diy/article/20...-without-flame
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxidation Cat cons are a bimetallic catalyst bed the
introduction of heat causes them to expand at different rates the movement between
the two causes friction which makes the temp jump even higher, then the unburnt
particles are burnt (yes burnt flamelessly)
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Old 04-05-2008, 01:50 PM
Tony G Tony G is offline
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Those guys were at the govornment show in D.C. in early March.
It would seem that there needs to be some amount of legitimacy involved for them to risk that degree of mass exposure. The Picc wont' be comign to the US immediately though because EPA says that they can't remove the Cat.

I remember when platinum plugs first came out, everyone was yelling "scam". Now almost every auto maker has them in their vehicles. Sometimes, there are things that come along which may be labeled "Scam" but is perhaps a new scientific discovery or simply a new scientific application.

Gasoline using fuel injection methods burns at about 30% efficiency. Gas vapor would burn at a much higher, close to 100% efficency, but it's difficult to vaporize and meter gasoline.
But, taking a bit of energy from the gas process to fabricate a hydrogen/oxygen vapor fuel capable of burning at close to 100% efficiency in the combustion chamber would greatly increase fuel mileage,.. woudnt' it??
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Old 04-05-2008, 05:10 PM
jimandmandy jimandmandy is offline
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An Otto cycle engine is never going to be 100 percent efficient (or even 50 percent) no matter what. Laws of thermodynamics to not magically disappear because someone comes up with an add-on invention. Yes, EFI and computer ignition systems have resulted in improvements, but the starting point, lets say a Model T was on the order of 10 percent efficient, so the 30 percent range today is the result of almost a century of improvements. The first "scam" in that I ever heard of was the Fish carburator. There were decades of conspiracy theories around that one.

Jim
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Old 04-05-2008, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony G View Post
Gasoline using fuel injection methods burns at about 30% efficiency. Gas vapor would burn at a much higher, close to 100% efficency, but it's difficult to vaporize and meter gasoline.
But, taking a bit of energy from the gas process to fabricate a hydrogen/oxygen vapor fuel capable of burning at close to 100% efficiency in the combustion chamber would greatly increase fuel mileage,.. woudnt' it??
You're wrong. Close to 100% of the gasoline is burned in a properly functioning engine, even if it injected in a liquid form. The 30% is the thermal efficiency, and that doesn't change significantly if you 'gasify' gasoline first.

As for the link in the 1st post, I hardly ever see so much BS and scam on a single page.
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Old 04-05-2008, 09:26 PM
monckywrench monckywrench is offline
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"It would seem that there needs to be some amount of legitimacy involved for them to risk that degree of mass exposure."

So long as the make money either from investors or sales, if they are exposed later it only matters if they do anything illegal. Money is a delightful way to dry the temporary tears of shame.

"But, taking a bit of energy from the gas process to fabricate a hydrogen/oxygen vapor fuel capable of burning at close to 100% efficiency in the combustion chamber would greatly increase fuel mileage,.. woudnt' it??"

Sounds like its well worth someone other than me buying a system and doing repeatable third-party dyno-tests to verify performance.
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Old 08-26-2008, 10:36 PM
HAFCPICC HAFCPICC is offline
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Here are the facts Our Hydro Assist Fuel Cell Kit if installed in all the fleets of America gives a Min of 50% increase in Fuel Mileage and that alone would eliminate Oil Imports. And Sept 15 There will be Big Announcement of who we are join venturing with and launch of the PICC Which is the most important invention since the Internal Combustion Engine according to a Major Auto Maker who is in Beta testing right now with 24 HAFC Kits in their 2008 models. And on July 10th 2009 Energy Independence Day in USA and Canada will be a watershead event in mankinds history . By 2012 or before we will be providing all the electricity that America needs Clean Green Power <>< And our Sundance Generator and Hummingbird motor has a 34 inch by 34 inch footprint and is selfcontained and has no operationl cost and minimal mantinence cost So there is no need for one penny to come from the taxpayers. We have everything handled


08 /1 / 2008 Dutchman Enterprises just finished a 3 Day Meeting with Fortune 100 Companies ( GM , Chysler , Exxon, BP , Huge Oil producing Coumtry and Multi Billionaire ) and is making the Big Announcment around Sept 15 2008 On Who they will JV with . Dutchman has developed both the Hydro Assist Fuel Cell Kit (Global Patents) but the Big Gun is the PICC Pre-Ignition Catalytic Converter is a breakthrough new technology that could get your Vehicle up to Nine times plus the fuel mileage! and No Pollution <>< picctv.com/rockin69 Any Fuel used. Fll out quote after reading site and watching videos.

Dealer # 001100260U Better and Better Technologies 100mpgtoday.com To 2012 and Beyond <><
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Old 08-26-2008, 10:38 PM
HAFCPICC HAFCPICC is offline
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Here are the facts Our Hydro Assist Fuel Cell Kit if installed in all the fleets of America gives a Min of 50% increase in Fuel Mileage and that alone would eliminate Oil Imports. And Sept 15 There will be Big Announcement of who we are joint venturing with and launch of the PICC Which is the most important invention since the Internal Combustion Engine according to a Major Auto Maker who is in Beta testing right now with 24 HAFC Kits in their 2008 models. And on July 10th 2009 Energy Independence Day in USA and Canada will be a watershead event in mankinds history . By 2012 or before we will be providing all the electricity that America needs Clean Green Power <>< And our Sundance Generator and Hummingbird motor has a 34 inch by 34 inch footprint and is selfcontained and has no operationl cost and minimal mantinence cost So there is no need for one penny to come from the taxpayers. We have everything handled


08 /1 / 2008 Dutchman Enterprises just finished a 3 Day Meeting with Fortune 100 Companies ( GM , Chysler , Exxon, BP , Huge Oil producing Coumtry and Multi Billionaire ) and is making the Big Announcment around Sept 15 2008 On Who they will JV with . Dutchman has developed both the Hydro Assist Fuel Cell Kit (Global Patents) but the Big Gun is the PICC Pre-Ignition Catalytic Converter is a breakthrough new technology that could get your Vehicle up to Nine times plus the fuel mileage! and No Pollution <>< picctv.com/rockin69 Any Fuel used. Fll out quote after reading site and watching videos.

Dealer # 001100260U BetterandBetterTechnologies.com 100mpgtoday.com To 2012 and Beyond <><
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Old 08-27-2008, 03:39 AM
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Yeah right, "Our Hydro Assist Fuel Cell Kit" -- while some people may believe many scientifically sounding BS that promises a big gain in mpg, not everyone is in that group.
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Old 08-27-2008, 06:22 AM
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Oh, great, someone presenting themselves as the scammer company (or one of their scamming dealers) learned how to use Google. Now they're busy spamming forums where they find posts referring to their scam.

I can hardly wait until Sep 16th when the world will still be the same. Probably will be another July 10th non-event.
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Old 08-27-2008, 07:19 AM
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Smile You are so right ! You can't fix Stupid

And you are more than stupid , You are Ignorant ! When in doubt , Check it out ! Is one of my 3 Axioms I have lived by since arriving back to the World from Nam in 71 USMC . Now you Ignorant fool There are thousands of people driving around with HAFC Kits . Some getting 100MPG There are ASE certified Installers and Tuners now all over USA and Canada all trained up to Help all the ignorant people like you who don't know squat make life better.
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Old 08-27-2008, 07:19 AM
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