Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Bio-diesel, Propane & Alternative Diesel Engine Fuels
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007, 08:24 AM
vwbuge vwbuge is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Johnstown, PA
Posts: 52
vwbuge is starting off with a positive reputation.
Blending WVO and Diesel....????

NOT bodiesel. Blending WVO and Diesel. Has anyone ever tried it in their 7.3?

I drive a MB 300SD turbodiesel now. I have had great success blending the two. The car even seems to run better and quieter. I will be in the market for another winter car in the next year or two and I was considering an Excursion with a Diesel. I have heard the horror stories about the 6.0L so I was looking into the 7.3. Has anyone ever blended WVO/Diesel with this motor? What was the outcome? NOT what you heard either, just personal experience.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007, 10:04 AM
Phydeaux88's Avatar
Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: South Texas Coast
Posts: 1,569
Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Folks have been blending VO with #2 for the 7.3.
The problem is that blending is not your best option for any diesel.
There are those that cite sucess stories and that is fine but basic science does not support the practice. The two will eventually seperate into layers burning unheated VO is a recipe for disaster, I have a fairly long paper that discusses it but because of site limits cannot post it here. If you want a copy PM your e-mail addy and I will respond.

If you want to run VO convert the vehicle and do it right. If you dont want to run straight VO learn to make BD. If you dont want to run either then buy #2 but blending can cost you a motor. Blending is a crap shoot and the odds are not in your favor.
__________________
2006 F350 4X4 Crew Cab King Ranch edition strictly factory, for now.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007, 11:27 AM
firemediceric's Avatar
firemediceric firemediceric is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 445
firemediceric is starting off with a positive reputation.
I've been blending for a year and a half in the truck. So far, so good. You should be able to search my screen name and see my previous posts on the subject or look for my comments on the Info-Pop Solvent Blending section or on The Diesel Stop.

If you can't find answers there, feel free to contact me.
__________________
1999 F-350 with Tymar type air filter, Dahl 100 fuel filter, HP oil X-over, bypass oil filter, coolant filter.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007, 09:17 PM
clay01 clay01 is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 79
clay01 is starting off with a positive reputation.
I did a little test back in June. I made a 50/50 mix of waste veggie oil and diesel and put it in a mason jar. I did this test because EVERYONE says that they will separate. I left the mixture on the table in the basement undisturbed. I went downstairs the next day and there was no separation. I went down and looked at it several days after that and there still was no separation. To make a long story short, I just put that mixture in my tank last week and, after more than 2 months, there was no visible separation of the oil and diesel. I also tested this same batch in the refrigerator and it did not gel.
I have been running a 25% blend in my truck all summer with no issues.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007, 09:28 PM
firemediceric's Avatar
firemediceric firemediceric is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 445
firemediceric is starting off with a positive reputation.
I have jars of various mixes from as far back as 4/06. None of the mixes of D2, K1, Jet-A, RUG, naptha, xylene or several other things have seperated.

Some of the other stuff that I played around with like Bar & Chain oil, Gear oil, etc. did seperate, and quickly, but I expected it would.
__________________
1999 F-350 with Tymar type air filter, Dahl 100 fuel filter, HP oil X-over, bypass oil filter, coolant filter.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2007, 11:04 AM
Phydeaux88's Avatar
Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: South Texas Coast
Posts: 1,569
Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Here is the point.
The last two responders have decided to gamble that casual observation is better evidence than scientific fact.
The question you have to ask yourself is are you willing to risk your $10000 engine to avoid the relatively minor expense of doing it a way that is proven.
__________________
2006 F350 4X4 Crew Cab King Ranch edition strictly factory, for now.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2007, 03:17 PM
firemediceric's Avatar
firemediceric firemediceric is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 445
firemediceric is starting off with a positive reputation.
Although Phydeaux88 and I often disagree, I feel he is completely correct with the point he makes; blending is an unknown/unproven risk. There is little R&D that has been done with blending in the mainstream with a controlled setting in modern engines. BD is, more or less, proven.

Blending works for me and for me it's a better option than BD. It is none the less a gamble.
__________________
1999 F-350 with Tymar type air filter, Dahl 100 fuel filter, HP oil X-over, bypass oil filter, coolant filter.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2007, 04:26 PM
Phydeaux88's Avatar
Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: South Texas Coast
Posts: 1,569
Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Fire
Why is blending a better option than BD?
__________________
2006 F350 4X4 Crew Cab King Ranch edition strictly factory, for now.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-20-2007, 07:31 AM
vwbuge vwbuge is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Johnstown, PA
Posts: 52
vwbuge is starting off with a positive reputation.
I did some experiments also before running the stuff in my MB. I also put 3 glass jars with different blends. The highest % I had was 3/4 WVO and 1/4 Diesel. After several hours in the fridge there was no separation. I took them out becuase my wife was coming home and put them in the basement. It started to get cold about a month later so I relocated them outside where they sat for several months when temps dropped to well below freezing. The highest % had a little opaque sediment at the bottom. The 50/50 mix looked good. I was quite surprised. I am not too worried about separation. I was just worried because of the different injection systems. The MB engine is a little more robust so I know I am getting away with it.

About the Excursion in general, anyone have one? The wife has 130,000 on the Expy and I am not a Ford fan but I have to say it treats us well. I have never owned a truck before but the Excursion interest me because of the diesel and size. I carry alot of gear when I go hunting and tow a quad so the Excursion would be a good fit.

Has Ford addressed the problem with the 6.0L? If I find an Excursion with the 6.0L should I run?

Thanks,
Paul
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-20-2007, 10:07 AM
Phydeaux88's Avatar
Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: South Texas Coast
Posts: 1,569
Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Early (2003 and early 2004) 6.0s had problems. Most have been solved.
My personal choice is the 7.3. Prety much a bullet proof engine. It is based on the International T444e which is used in thousands of medium sized trucks: tow trucks, delivery trucks, larger ambulances, school buses, etc. In fact the best source for parts is your local International dealer, parts 1/2 what Ford sells them for.
__________________
2006 F350 4X4 Crew Cab King Ranch edition strictly factory, for now.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-21-2007, 04:26 PM
firemediceric's Avatar
firemediceric firemediceric is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 445
firemediceric is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phydeaux88
Fire

Why is blending a better option than BD?
Here's why blending is better for my circumstances than BD:

1. I do not consider myself a proficent mechanic/fabricator. I have no experience welding. I seldom have luck finding the scrap materials when I need them. I would have to likely pay full price for all of the materials to make a processor and then I would need to find someone and pay them to fabricate the unit. Easily a couple of thousand dollars. I have my WVO filtering station set up for only a couple of hundred including the stuff I use to collect the oil.

2. Although I have been fortunate to have a steady supply of oil, I do not consider my supply to be guarnanteed. I would hate to put the money into a processor and then have my oil supplies dry up. I'm then out the money and stuck with the processor I cannot use.

3. From what I know about it, making BD is a more precise task and easier to screw up. I like things simple, or as we say "Firefighter proof."

4. Getting the supplies, particularly the methanol, required for BD can be a hassle in my area. Last I knew, methanol was over $4/gal. And that's buying it 55 gallons at a time with an extra deposit tacked on for the drum. I have to think that unless you are buying methanol in greater quanities than 55 gal at a time your cost to make BD just in raw materials is at least $1.25 or more. I blend for about 80 cents a gallon and I don't have any glycerin I need to dispose of.

5. I have no desire to store or work with the lye and methanol, both which require careful handling and are very hazardous to your health.

With that said, if I had a processor fall out of the sky for my use I would give BD a try. If I did not find it to be a much greater pain than blending, I would probably stick with it due to it's proven reliablity.

In a nutshell, I feel blending requires less intial investment, fewer hazardous chemicals, is less expensive per gallon, less waste product to manage, and takes up less space.
__________________
1999 F-350 with Tymar type air filter, Dahl 100 fuel filter, HP oil X-over, bypass oil filter, coolant filter.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 09-22-2007, 04:54 PM
vwbuge vwbuge is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Johnstown, PA
Posts: 52
vwbuge is starting off with a positive reputation.
I have a total of $13 in my filtering system.

I got a plastic 55 gallon drum for free. I purchase two pillowcases at a time from the Salvation Army store. ($3) I bought a hand pump off Ebay. ($10)

Don't laugh, it works. I am very picky with my oil. I dump it into a 55 gallon drum and it filters through a pillowcase stuffed into one of the bungs. When I am ready, I hand pump out into a 5 gallon can. I put some cheese cloth over the spout and dump into my tank.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2007, 12:09 AM
bassproguy07 bassproguy07 is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 831
bassproguy07 is starting off with a positive reputation.
JW why are you going to PAY for #2 when in the longrun you could just convert like phydeaux said and sure youll spend a little money but your fuel will be free and it will work
__________________
1983 F-250, 6.9 XLT REAL P.O.S!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2007, 10:28 AM
Phydeaux88's Avatar
Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
Posting Guru
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: South Texas Coast
Posts: 1,569
Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.Phydeaux88 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Fire

I was just curious as to why blending is "the best choice" for you.

Actually an appleseed can be built for around $200 and requires very little mechanical skill other than the ability to screw a pipe into a connector and do some simple wiring.
The ability to weld is nice but not required.

I do understand the reluctance to store hazardous chemicals especially if you have youngsters around.
__________________
2006 F350 4X4 Crew Cab King Ranch edition strictly factory, for now.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 09-24-2007, 05:10 PM
firemediceric's Avatar
firemediceric firemediceric is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 445
firemediceric is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phydeaux88
Actually an appleseed can be built for around $200
That's if you can scrounge many of the parts. Due to not being able to find a used water heater that doesn't leak, I would either need to buy one new, which almost puts me right at that $200 mark on one item, or weld something out of 55 gallon drums.

I'll tell you what, if ever you want to take a working vacation in Florida and build me a reactor and show me all of the ins and outs of BD, I'll be happy to supply the liquid refreshments. It would really be a treat to work on it with you and increase my knowledge in this area.

As I said above, I believe BD is superior to a blend in being more proven if nothing else. If I could choose between running BD, SVO or a WVO blend, I would choose the BD everytime if all costs were equal. The blend I run is working for me, but it really isn't proven. BD is.

Wouldn't the kids love Disney, maybe a little deep sea fishing or some gator hunting?
__________________
1999 F-350 with Tymar type air filter, Dahl 100 fuel filter, HP oil X-over, bypass oil filter, coolant filter.
Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2007, 05:10 PM
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Bio-diesel, Propane & Alternative Diesel Engine Fuels

Tags
1996, 5050, 60, ambulance, blend, blending, diesel, duty, filtering, find, ford, good, material, showme, super, supplies, wvo

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO 3.5.2 ©2010, Crawlability, Inc.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup