I just bought a '79 Lincoln Mark bah for the engine out of it. I paid $275 for it so its not like I will loose much if it dosnt work. It has..i am told...a 351C and I defiantly know it has a 4 bbl carb. I did go and see it today. Heard its a rare find. I got the whole car with less than 60K on it (grandma and pa car) and the engine runs fine....well the ignition switch is messed up in the collem....But you can jump it at the solenoid and it runs fine. What I am planing on doing is putting it in my '86 F-150 4X4 to replace my 300 I-6. The engine in the car has a c-6/c-4 (not really sure...didn't jack up the car and look at the pan) so I am guessing that it will bolt up to my C-6 in my truck. I have all of the ignition parts to make it work. I just need to get the motor mounts and drop it in. What my question is did Ford run the C in the late 70's? From what I read on some of the other posts I got it was an early 70 engine only. I do know it has 400 valve covers on it. I don't want to modify it heavily but any NONradical ideas are very welcome. What I plan on doing it rebuilding it and milling the heads .03" and boring it over . 03". The idea of a roller RV cam sounds good. Headers, Edelbrock intake and 600 cfm carb and almost certain. Tell me if that is a good combo and if it is worth it. Remember I already have the engine and plan on putting it in regardless....unless I hit some unforeseen prob. that would take way toooo much work to make do. That is why I am asking everyone to see if my boat will float or not. I also saw that I can get 351 W mounts and it will work. Is that true? I have heard good things about this engine and want to make it work. I am eventually planning on running 39" tires on my truck and that is why I am ditching the 300 I-6.....but don't get me wrong.....I LOVE THE 300! Its runs like a bat out of hell with the right Clifford goodies! Well, future thanks for the help!

Dan "Mudinford" MacDonald

 

Unless someone replaced the original motor with a 351 C you probably have a 351M or a 400. Ford quit producing the C in late 73. The M and 400 motors are both derivatives of the C which is where a lot of confusion comes in. The 400 came out about a year after the C. It is from the same family of engines but has a 1.1 inch taller deck height, different motor mounts (same perches in a truck), big block transmission bolt pattern, and larger crank journals. The M is identical to the 400 except it has a shorter stroke and therefore different rods and pistons. There is also a difference in the number of bolts on the valve covers for some. If your valve covers say 400 then you probably have the original engine and it is either a 351M or a 400. Either will work well in your truck but if it is an M or 400 make sure you get the right mounts and have a big block tranny.

Hope this helps some.

Eric B.

 

OK....now i found out that the engine in the car is not the original motor. Which sucks cuz all they ran in the Mark seires was the 400M. So now there is no telling what motor is in there. I am assuming that they went for a direct bolt in with the tranny so if it is a 351 i bet it is the Modified. And i do know that the valve covers are off a 400...as i stated above. MAN this is alot of work just to find out what motor it is! So does this 351M suck or not? I konw you can make any motor work good....but i want the over all truth. I want to do a good job with this but i dont want a clunker that i have to fix all the time.....BC i dont believe in the Found On The Road Dead theroy. Its the owner, not the truck....unless its a Che#y! anyways....by the way...thanks for the useful info above to whoever posted it....cant see who did it right now.....but ok.....the motor is in the car still....i want a sure fire way of telling if this thing is a 351M, 351C, or a (please God!) 400M like it should have. (this is a BIG A car!) So if anyone has any way of knowing with out takeing the engine apart....let me know.....Think something was said above about that too......but agian i can see what its says till i get done! Future thanks for the help!

Dan

 

i have built and hunted many 351c's down to build my projects and i do know fore sure that you will not find a cleveland in any thing later than a 1974 car. a cleveland can be mounted to a c4 c6 and a fmx tranny but only if they are off a small block motor. a 351 cleveland will have no intake cooling this not making it as efficient in cooling
if it is a true 4bbl cleveland it will have the number 4 in the casting on the top corner of the head.351 widsor mounts will fit on the motor and it is the same length from motor mount to tranny.
you may have problems with your oil pans sump being at the wrong end but a 351m 400m oil pan and oil pump from a truck will solve this problem
i hope this info helps....

 

one more thing i have learnd from my experience with clevelands and my projecs is that a 351m and 400 are good boat anchors at best.i have played with many 351-400's and had no luck getting them to perform with out a bundle of money and i still was not happy. i feel you would be better off with a 351w easier to get parts and they can handle rpm alot better i hope this helps once again...

 

huh...good points......hope i have a good one....from what i was told it was a C....so lets hope for the best....its would make my life lots EZer. I dont know what to think.....i jsut need to find out what engine i got....

 

Dan, the easiest way to tell whether it is a Cleveland or a HORRIBLE M is to look at the thermostat housing. If the housing bolts onto the intake then you have the TERRIBLE M motor. If the thermostat housing goes straight into the motor then you have a Cleveland. The Cleveland is an incredible motor. It makes good power, especially if you get a set of 4 barrel heads. They are rare, but can be found. If you do have the 351-M, I would STRONGLY suggest finding something else, the 351 Windosr is a very good motor. Hope this helps.

Rob

 

Foud out that the Thermostat bolts up to the block....and it does have a 4bbl on the motor. I i am guessing that the engine was swapped from an eariler can and i have a 351C. OK that is good. I dont have to swap my tranny out. Now bout lightly building it. Any suggestion? Thanks for all the help!

Dan

 

The Mark`s from `77-`79 either came with a 400 or a 460 and nothing else.

 

Right......i relise that....but the engine is not the orignal engine in the car. They had a 400 but ditched it for the 351C.....BUT as i found out my friend cant tell the difference between a 4 BBL and a 2BBL. SO it has a 2 BBL....is it really worth finding some 4V heads or can i rework the 2V heads and get simalar results...if or better.....HELP!!! thanks!

Dan

 

What do you ultimately want to do with this engine.. the 2bbl heads on the 351C are as good as anything you will ever need for mild street performance.. they have good flow and LARGE valves.. the 4bbl heads are great if you are going to run around at high RPM, planning on doing a lot of racing, etc... For everyday driving and occasional racing activities,the 2bbl heads are much more practical... put a 2bbl 351C with an Edelbrock 4bbl manifold and carb in a friends truck.. fresh rebuild .030 over.. runs GREAT... just my thoughts on the subject.. good luck

 

Well, I am looking for an engine that will turn my (eventually) 39.5 X 12.50 swampers. So low end is one of my priorities. I was told that the 2v heads were better for low end. So i guess i will stick with em. I just get off track and thing that if it dosnt have the 4V heads its not worth it....but the 351C is a good engine regardless as i am finding out. Thanks for all of the help.

Dan

 

Umm, whoever said that the M engines have the thermostat housing bolted to the intake was dead wrong. They never had it. The 351C/M/400 all have a dry intake, the housing bolts to the block regardless of the engine. I know this for a FACT.

 

OK....great...so now i am back to my original problem. SO again...i need a good way to find out how to tell the diff between the engines. i still havnet pulled it yet but i was planning on it sometime next month. SO any help would be appreciated. Thnaks!

Dan "Mudinford" Mac Donald

 

Man, after reding so much mis-information I wondered when you'd be back.

I really doubt you have a Cleveland simply because of the fact that it never came with the car(that was one correct post) and if someone swapped it in they would have also had to have changed transmissions because the bolt patterns are different.

It is hard to tell the difference between the M and C without having one to compare against the other. The external difference is the M block is 1.1" taller then the Cleveland. Again, unless they're side by side it's hard to tell. Internally the M will have 3" main journals on the crank the C is 2.75". As stated before the bolt pattern is different on the bellhousing.

I really believe you have an M motor. Here is my suggestion; The C was not produced past '74 find the numbers on your block. If they have a D5 number or above ie; D6, D7 etc. it is NOT a Cleveland if it has a D0-D4 number You need to check the dimensions the best you can that were given above.

One last suggestion, did you clean the drivers side valve cover? There is a sticker there that gives the engine family. Good luck and let us know.