Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L)
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L) Diesel Topics Only

Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #16  
Old 05-03-2007, 09:13 PM
DeepRoots DeepRoots is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Douglas, Georgia
Posts: 795
DeepRoots is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
transmissions aside.
you are taking a 1000lb motor out of a truck (7.3 or 6.9) which is already front end heavy and putting in a 2500-3000lb 6v71?

If I recall from working on them the 6v71's are a good 8-10inches longer than a 7.3
about the same height but that assumes you'll be moving blowers/turbos and stuff off to the side.

best of luck.
drew
__________________
-76 F100 390FE
-63.5 Galaxie 500 -429
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-03-2007, 09:38 PM
Winger235's Avatar
Winger235 Winger235 is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brockport New York
Posts: 344
Winger235 is starting off with a positive reputation.
Why Not? It is the joy of fabrication to build and make something work by your hands. Plus Detroit 2-strokes make great conversational pieces and sound awesome.

They also brought industry and trucking to where they are today. Dirty leaking devils but they worked and continue to work. But it drove someone to design a 4 stroke to perform the same. Just like 2 stroke dirt bikes they drove people to make a complicated 4 stroke perform the same.

My 2 Lincolns.
__________________
1988 F-350 4x4 7.3L IDI C6 3.55LS (Refurbished) Winter Ride

1993 F-250 4x2 7.3L IDI E4OD 4.10LS (Ext Cab Grandpa Truck) Summer Ride
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-03-2007, 09:38 PM
zigzkidz zigzkidz is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Butler, PA
Posts: 98
zigzkidz is starting off with a positive reputation.
i dont want a 6V71, i was thinking of a 6V53, but now im thinking about a 453 or353 or 371, it gives me more room to work with.


ModelHPRPMLength in.Width in.Height in.Weight lb.







3-53
101
2800
33
27
35
965
3-71
113
2100
36
29
41
1525
3-53T
131
2500
33
29
40
1000
4-53
140
2800
39
27
37
1110
4-53T
175
2500
40
32
37
1300
__________________
2012 Jetta tdi
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-03-2007, 10:21 PM
Dave Sponaugle's Avatar
Dave Sponaugle Dave Sponaugle is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Nutter Fort, WV
Posts: 21,266
Dave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to beholdDave Sponaugle is a splendid one to behold
And now the EPA is trying to push all two strokes out the door and into the landfills.

As to the original question, Detroit Diesel, Cummins, Cat or Perkins Diesel all have motors that could be swapped into an F series.
There are several other engines that could also be cantidates for a conversion.

Some will be easier than others to swap in.
Some may even be better than the International motor.

BUT

Since each one will require custom fabrication to install it with custom wiring to make it work I do not see any of them as good cantidates for a vehicle that you depend on every day.
There will be parts that may be available, but not common enough that you are going to be able to walk into most part houses or salvage yard and walk out the door with the part in your hand.

Also you have to look at a lot of things when you do a swap like that.

Yep lets drop in a 3406 Cat, 400+ HP torque over 1000 foot pounds max RPM 2100.

So instantly, my top speed is 52 MPH with 3.55 gears on 33" rubber with my 4 speed.
So now I need an overdrive or double overdrive tranny if I even want to think about any kind of MPG while driving at modern speeds since a 3406 is not a very economical engine to run at max RPM.

The next thing that happens will be the drive shaft will turn to limp spagetti at the first steep hill when all the Cat torque turns it into a pretzel.

The upgrades to keep from breaking parts will cost more than a new truck after a few years.

I had a friend here that had a 3406 in his F350 15 years ago.
He finally took it out because he was tired of getting his truck towed home every time he drove it.
Every time he mashed the throttle it was a twisted drive shaft, broken axle, clutch or U joint.
Fabrication....I bet he had 200 hours in making parts to mount the engine, tranny and transfer case as well as the linkages to make the throttle, clutch and shifters all work.

Yes it was very impressive to look at, even more impressive to hear running.
But parts falling on the ground when he mashed the throttle took a lot away for the overall impression the truck made on you.

If your goal is car shows and Sunday cruising that is one thing.
But if you are looking for dependable transportation that can be used for work, find something that has an established parts base all over the country.

If I bust my transmission tomorrow, I can have a four, five or six speed out of a salvage yard back in it Saturday.
With custom fabrication of something like a Cat motor would require, I could probably have somthing back in in two or three weeks.
__________________
86 F250 HD 6.9 IDI ATS turbo "not exactly" stock 4x4 T19 BW1345 3.55LS both ends D60 front, 10.25" Sterling rear, ram air, dual stacks.

"I dig dirt"

FTE Guidelines

FTE Moderator IDI diesel forum

WV Chapter Member
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-04-2007, 03:32 AM
TomA92 TomA92 is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 71
TomA92 is starting off with a positive reputation.
When I was a kid I remember riding in the old Greyhound buses, the smaller city busses that had detroits in them. I don't know if they had 3-71's or 4-71's in them but they only had a 4 speed transmission and used to get along pretty well. The shifts remind me of the T-19.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 07-03-2007, 11:28 PM
Grigg Grigg is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lexington, VA
Posts: 52
Grigg is starting off with a positive reputation.
I have a 6V53TT in a 65 F350.

I have had the truck a few months, and have upgraded the axles, brakes, and power steering.

It is now a very capable, strong, reliable, and unique truck. I just got back two weeks ago from a 7,000 mile road trip in it, absolutely no problems, in 7.5 total days of driving. I even hauled a 6-7 thousand pound truck from Washington state to NY.

My truck has a RTO610 Roadranger 10 speed overdrive, and I would not be happy with any fewer gears. It is geared for 75mph at 2,100 RPM, I start out in 3rd, 4th, or 5th most times, but the lower gears are handy for hills and when loaded.

if you are still considering a swap like this I think you should plan on axles that are up to the task, and brakes too.

I am building a 48 Chevy 2 ton with a 4-53TI to be my daily driver, it has an RTO6610 and 13" disc brakes.

My ford is for sale, I bought it to play with, I am done playing now and ready to continue work on my Chevy. so if anyone is interested in the Detroit powered Ford make me an offer. Pictures http://community.webshots.com/user/Grigg3

Grigg

Last edited by Grigg; 07-04-2007 at 12:07 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 07-04-2007, 12:55 AM
typefour typefour is offline
Elder User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Newberg Oregon
Posts: 748
typefour is starting off with a positive reputation.
You dont want a 4-53, heads are getting impossible to find. 6v-53 too much of a screamer. A balanced and turboed 3 or 4-71 would be ok, lighter too. Look in old airport ground power generators, lots of 3 cylinders being thrown away. we scrapped 10 at work not 2 months ago. I can give you some tips to turn them up pretty good too, as others on here can too
__________________
91 f 350 cc 4x4, 3:55 gears. zf 5, 7.3 ATS 093 with bigger comp wheel, intercooled with cutdown 7,3 ps IC all gauges ignored with good aftermarket ones. Head studs, balanced . 12 psi 1k pyro under load way better mileage than the 460.

218/461 on the dyno. after 80k miles, wanted to make sure she was broke in.
sandeater1@gmail.com
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 07-04-2007, 01:26 PM
shorthair shorthair is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 344
shorthair is starting off with a positive reputation.
for around 3-6 grand you could pick up a crown school bus with a 6 53 or 71 detroit & an allision tranny which is what a buddy did to convert to a pretty nice MH then you would at least have part of what you need heap cheap
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:04 AM
IHWillys IHWillys is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 42
IHWillys is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grigg
...Detroit powered Ford...
Hello Grigg

May I post the pic of your 6v53TT on the DetroitDiesel site?

Looks good with the late model center bolt Al rocker covers and the twins.

Ken
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 07-05-2007, 11:14 AM
16diesel 16diesel is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 147
16diesel is starting off with a positive reputation.
i was thinking about doing the same thing. but using a 6V92
__________________
If it aint smokin its broken
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 07-05-2007, 11:52 AM
Grigg Grigg is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lexington, VA
Posts: 52
Grigg is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IHWillys
Hello Grigg

May I post the pic of your 6v53TT on the DetroitDiesel site?

Looks good with the late model center bolt Al rocker covers and the twins.

Ken
Sure, Please do.
I'll see if I can find my way over there again. Last time I thought the threads were hard to follow or understand, at least they were not in order and viewable all at once like these threads are.

Grigg
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 07-05-2007, 12:35 PM
Grigg Grigg is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lexington, VA
Posts: 52
Grigg is starting off with a positive reputation.
I have seen over a dozen Detroit conversions in pickup size trucks. I have owned a 73 1 ton Chevy with a 4-35T, drove it home from CO to VA. I presently own a 6V53TT in a 61 F350, and have put over 11,000 miles on it in less than 4 months.
I am presently building a 48 Chevy 2 ton with a 4-53T with Jakes and a Roadranger RTO6610. This truck will be my daily driver when done, and absolutely no corners are being cut in the construction of it.

So, after working on these trucks, owning several other Detroit engines, seeing countless others form of all series, 53, 71, 92, 110, a few 149, and a pair of 51 series, I have a pretty good idea of what will fit and work in a pickup sized truck.

First, the 92 series are much to big and heavy to fit. I suppose it could be done with allot of work with a torch and welder, but I don't think it is a wise idea. You would need a substantially heavier front axle, and brakes. I have never seen or heard of even the smallest 92 , a 6V92 in a pickup.

A 3-71 or a 4-71 will fit, and work, and I have seen a few.
I think to be useful you will want a turbo on either, and plenty of overdrive and or tall tires to give a reasonable road speed.
In my opinion a 4-71 is just a bit to big to work nicely in a pickup. A 3-71 is still a little tall and heavy for the power it produces, so not on my list of good swap ideas.

53 series, I think the ideal engines for pickup truck swaps.
Starting at the bottom, 2-53 is probably only good for the smallest trucks, like a Toyota looking for mileage and not performance. I have never seen a swap with a 2-53.

3-53 with no turbo is acceptable for a practical work truck, not very strong, and therefore best for local driving. Easy to fit in most any truck.
The aluminum 3-53's easy to find and reasonably priced would be good for 1/2 ton trucks with out needing a heavier front axle.
3-53 with a turbo is better, but if you want power step up to a 4-53T.

The ideal swap in a 1 ton pickup, in my opinion, is a 4-53T. They fit with minimal hassle, have plenty of power for both interstate driving, and towing. They are just on the limit of what a 3/4 ton front axle wants to carry, and OK with a 1 ton axle. Fuel economy is good, not to heavy, not to big it's hard to work on in a PU engine compartment.

The 6V53 should only be considered for 1 ton trucks after about the mid 50,s as they don't really want to fit in the narrower trucks before that, and less than 1 ton won't carry the weight.
I would not recommend a 6V53 for a truck you use like a car, but if you use a truck like a truck most of the time, it's got the power.
A 6V53 is just big enough and heavy enough to make it a difficult swap, and just more than a 1 ton axle wants to carry.
for a full sized plus work truck with upgraded brakes and axles it makes sense, but anything smaller I don't think is a good idea. Turbos are nice....

I have not seen or heard of a 8v53 swap, but it will require substantial firewall modification, and is probably to heavy to even try with a 1 ton front axle. I don't think it would be a good candidate for swapping in a PU.

Please note, these are just my opinions and thoughts after seeing, driving, owning, and building a few Detroit powered truck conversions. You don't have to agree with me, and if not them please present your argument in a nice fashion, I'll probably even change my mind on some things after seeing more and different conversions.

Grigg
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 07-05-2007, 01:03 PM
HT32BSX115's Avatar
HT32BSX115 HT32BSX115 is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Upper Left Coast
Posts: 2,641
HT32BSX115 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.HT32BSX115 is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Grigg,

Did you add the turbochargers to the 6V-53 (which ones did you use?)


I have toyed with the idea of putting a 6V-53 in my 55 F-600.

With an over drive transmission and the 5.83:1(high range) 2 speed axle I would get around 2000 @ 60mph.

I have thought that the 6V might be a little too wide though. I really like the idea of using a 4-53T. They went all the way up to 200hp if I'm not mistaken.

A good friend of mine in Ca put a 4-53T in a 1 ton IHI truck with a huge service bed on it in the 70's. It had a 4 speed with a separate over drive. He claimed 15 mpg with it. He put over 400,000 miles on that thing!!!




Cheers,


Rick
__________________
1955 F-600/292Y/E4OD // D I S C L A I M E R: No animals were injured while test driving my F-600 except the ones I RAN OVER INTENTIONALLY!!!
2005 6.0L F-350 4x4
I have had my hands on Cessna, Northrup, Lockheed and McDonnell Douglas throttles. I still handle Boeing throttles.

Last edited by HT32BSX115; 07-05-2007 at 01:09 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 07-05-2007, 03:20 PM
IHWillys IHWillys is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 42
IHWillys is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grigg
...Last time I thought the threads were hard to follow or understand, at least they were not in order and viewable all at once like these threads are....
Note that you can "group by topic" when viewing the message list on the DetroitDiesel Yahoo group site. This will list the topics wherein you then click on the topic and the original message and replys to it are grouped all together. It makes it much easier to follow.

We'd like to have you there as swaps are a common topic of interest.

Ken
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 07-05-2007, 03:42 PM
Grigg Grigg is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Lexington, VA
Posts: 52
Grigg is starting off with a positive reputation.
No, I did not add the turbos to my 6V53. I have had the truck about 4 months, and the engine and trans were put in it in the mid 60's. The turbos were added sometime around then or a little later.

This site will help with figuring gears and speed http://www.drivetraindirect.com/t_gear_calculator.htm
You will want the a 53 series to be about 1800 or 1900 rpm at your preferred cruising speed, say 65 mph.

I just rejoined the Yahoo DetroitDiesel group. It had been so long sense I last visited that they kicked me off. Still trying to figure out how to use it, I got the "group by topic" button, but I still don't like it. I want to see what all the available threads are and then choose one and be able to read it from start to finish. Once I figure things out I'll post about my trucks with 53 series.

Grigg

Last edited by Grigg; 07-05-2007 at 04:01 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2007, 03:42 PM
 
 
 
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Pre-Power Stroke Diesel (7.3L IDI & 6.9L)

Tags
1985, 353, 453t, 6v53tt, 6v71, 6v92, 8v53, detroit, diesel, ford, linkage, pick, pickup, sale, setup, speed, throttle, truck

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7 AC1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup