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Lightning, Harley-Davidson F-150, Roush F-150 & Saleen F-150 SVT Ford F150 Lightning, Roush, Saleen and other performance F150's

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  #1  
Old 02-17-2007, 10:27 PM
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Question HD F150 AWD: some in depth ?'s

I've been doing some research on the newer Harley F150 AWD systems and keep getting slightly conflicting info.

When doing dry street driving and not in locked mode:

Is the system basically the same as the Expedition AWD systems? Does the front axle only engage when rear slip (momentarily locking the T-case, from what I gather) is detected. I hear that some binding can be detected at times with this type of system.

or

Is it a "true" AWD system that allows some slip and all wheels can receive power at all times, even without slip? Can torque split vary between front to rear, not locked when actively being used etc...

Is this system ("TF" case) used on any other models? Don't the Exp. AWD models all have a 4LO option which the HD lacks? I read it is shared w/ the Navigator, but not sure what year models and didn't completely trust the info/source.

Is the front axle and suspension (not necessarily spring rates, just basic design) the standard issue F150 4wd stuff?

Has anyone successfully and properly lowered one of these trucks? Does anyone make a "kit" to do so?

Thanks if you have any definite info.
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'99 F150 Lariat scab 4.6 auto. 2wd
'98 Dakota SLT ext. cab 5.2 5spd 2wd
'83 Rabbit Turbo Diesel 5spd. with SVO conversion

Last edited by tdister; 02-17-2007 at 10:48 PM.
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  #2  
Old 02-18-2007, 05:19 PM
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jvoigt jvoigt is offline
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I only know that when the system detects that the rear wheels are spinning that it can transfer somewhere around 50% of the power to the front wheels. Of coarse you can disable the AWD by pressing the disable button on the dash. I dont think they used anything different in the drive line except the transfer case but thats all I know.
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Old 02-18-2007, 07:51 PM
huitt24 huitt24 is offline
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I do know that you can lower them 2-3" front and 3-4" rear between DJM and Ground Force. I do not know anything about the AWD except that there is suppose to be a disable switch.
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2004 XLT Screw 5.4L 1/4 14.66 @ 95MPH
390 RWHP 446 RWTQ
Ground Force 2/4 drop, Roush IC SC
GMS COP's, Pace Setter LT's
magnaflow cats, x-pipe, DI/DO muffler
Hellwig rear sway bar, Custom Traction Bars

2005 SCAB 5.4L 3.73LS 2wd Roush 20's
magnaflow x-pipe/DI/DO muffler, true dual exhaust
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Old 02-19-2007, 01:40 AM
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Disable function huh? I knew they came with a button to "lock" (4WD HI), not that they had an override to 100% 2WD. I'm beginning to suspect it is a (near) 50/50 temporarily locked or 100% RWD depending on traction, with nothing in between.

It seems that the AWD models sit a bit higher than the 2wd, that leads me to suspect a common F150 4wd suspension. If so, the Roush suspension shouldn't be a problem either.

Thanks for the info. so far.

Huitt24: Both of your trucks are 2wd, correct? Any problems or complaints with the Ground Force kit? Your red one sure sounded good taking off at the Dam, those headers seem to make a good difference compared to other 5.4's I've heard.
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'99 F150 Lariat scab 4.6 auto. 2wd
'98 Dakota SLT ext. cab 5.2 5spd 2wd
'83 Rabbit Turbo Diesel 5spd. with SVO conversion
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  #5  
Old 02-19-2007, 05:46 AM
huitt24 huitt24 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdister
Both of your trucks are 2wd, correct? Any problems or complaints with the Ground Force kit? Your red one sure sounded good taking off at the Dam, those headers seem to make a good difference compared to other 5.4's I've heard.
Yes both trucks are 2wd. I absolutely love the Ground Force kit, I have also added a Hellwig rear swaybar which stiffend up the rear considerably. Later this year I am getting the same Ground Force kit 9944 to lower my wifes truck.

The headers produced 255 rwhp on the dyno after install on a otherwise stock 5.4L. Thanks for the compliment, they are guiet at idle but will deffinetly wake up under full throttle. I am going to the Dyno this morning at Maxwell Dodge on 620 this morning to see what the SC puts out with the lower pully and Troyer tune.

Good luck on your research on the new HD trucks.
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2004 XLT Screw 5.4L 1/4 14.66 @ 95MPH
390 RWHP 446 RWTQ
Ground Force 2/4 drop, Roush IC SC
GMS COP's, Pace Setter LT's
magnaflow cats, x-pipe, DI/DO muffler
Hellwig rear sway bar, Custom Traction Bars

2005 SCAB 5.4L 3.73LS 2wd Roush 20's
magnaflow x-pipe/DI/DO muffler, true dual exhaust

Last edited by huitt24; 02-19-2007 at 05:55 AM.
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  #6  
Old 02-19-2007, 06:53 PM
kscales kscales is offline
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Hi there,

Good thread as I am very interested how the AWD system works as well, although for different reasons, any insigh... please post as I want to purchase or not purchase the truck.

This from another forum I posted on before I found this one:

Looking to purchase one of these any day but can not get a answer to why this truck is only rated at towing 5000LBs?

From what I understand it uses the running gear from the Navigator ( which uses the same engine and is rated @ 8800LBS for towing)

Does anyone know? is the driveline the exact same? is it the 22 inch wheels? and is this really a concern or just Ford being conservative?

I would really like the HD truck over the Lariat but I have to tow my boat with the truck.
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Old 02-20-2007, 03:19 AM
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I did some investigating into the tow/payload ratings. Don't take this as gospel by any means, please.

It seems the AWD is mentioned separately for payload with a slightly lesser overall (but same GVWR, it's just because of the added weight of the AWD components that the payload goes down), the 2wd seems to be included with the other similar 2wd models. That leads me to believe the springs are the same or very similar as the regular models

The tires on them are actually rated for a heavier load than at least some of the "standard" (normal XLT) F150 tires.

The AWD and 2WD HD's seem to have the same tow rating (EDIT: sorry actually 200 lbs less for the AWD model, same principals apply). I was thinking maybe they didn't want the AWD suddenly kicking in with too big of a load, but that kills that theory. I have to assume it would be because of the bigger wheel diameter.

Bigger diameter wheels often means heavier, that multiplies when taking into consideration the bigger diameter has more weight towards the outer edge. That means more leverage against the brakes and more strain on them (even if the wheel and tire are the same weight overall compared to (for instance) an 18" combo, the 22" combo will apply more leverage to the rotor).

Anything at the limit of the HD's should have trailer brakes anyway, but it is still going to apply some of that to the truck. I'm far from a towing expert though. This is also assuming the info on Ford's website is 100% accurate.

I guess I could have just said: Bigger wheels are harder to stop, so they reduced the tow rating...

That's the limit of my reasoning at this point. Anybody else have a theory or know for sure?
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'99 F150 Lariat scab 4.6 auto. 2wd
'98 Dakota SLT ext. cab 5.2 5spd 2wd
'83 Rabbit Turbo Diesel 5spd. with SVO conversion

Last edited by tdister; 02-20-2007 at 03:39 AM.
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  #8  
Old 02-20-2007, 08:24 AM
kscales kscales is offline
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Thanks for the feedback about towing... I kinda feel the same way.

From searching Google, ( search:towing with 2007HD truck) I found some bit and pieces of info with the best info coming from a dealership in one of their one ad's.

-They say, if towing over the rated cap of 5000LBS a tranny cooler is required as it is not standard on the HD truck. ( atleast I can not find it listed anywhere in the specs)

-It would seem the 2006 model is rated to pull and haul more then the crewcab 2007 model...

- Ford also had a guide about wheel size that said to deduct 500LBS per inch of tire size. So if that is true, then the HD would be rated 2000LBS less then the Lariat with the 18 chrome wheel is about 8200LBs- so minus the wheels and the HD should/could be @ 6200LBS.

My new question is:

My main concern is the driveline, ( the AWD system) can it handle or is it built to handle more weight and is it just the wheel size that is holding the truck back?

FYI- my boat is 22 feet long and weights just over 5000LBS, stopping is not a issue as the trailer has disks on all 4 wheels, it's the up-hills I am worried about.

FYI- I even called ford customer service and they reconized my question but did not have a answer? LOL Does anyone from ford ever read this forum?
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Old 02-20-2007, 02:58 PM
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There website says deduct 500 lbs for the 18 or 20 inch combo, but nothing about -500 lbs per inch.

I can't say for sure that the AWD is up to par, but I have a feeling it would be fine. It's pretty flawed reasoning but, since the 2wd version is also reduced fairly significantly in towing ability, I would assume that it could be solely based on the wheel and tire combo.

I won't say you would be 100% OK(just because I am not 100% sure the info is correct) but, if you had the smaller wheels of the other models, you would logically and justifiably be able to increase your trailer weight limit.

The trailer tow package is available on HD models, it includes the tranny cooler. Just to make sure, Fords site lists the AWD HD as having a 5600 lb limit. I wouldn't sweat it personally...

What exactly are you worried about with uphill towing? The tranny or the AWD kicking in?
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'99 F150 Lariat scab 4.6 auto. 2wd
'98 Dakota SLT ext. cab 5.2 5spd 2wd
'83 Rabbit Turbo Diesel 5spd. with SVO conversion
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  #10  
Old 03-23-2007, 10:02 PM
fishnatic fishnatic is offline
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Hello, I've got a 06 f150 HD, It has AWD or 4x4,there is no way to disable AWD that i know of. I traded in a F150 Lariat [loaded]. this truck is nicer in all respects except the gas mileage[13.9] so far. I've got 4500k on it. Mine is loaded w/trailer pac ete.Did'nt like the ride w/22"s. found a set of new 18 ford tires and rims,rides much better.probaly will put 22,s back on for summer. I live in mich. i didnt think 22's would have much traction.Truck seems heavier duty than 01.Hopefully the gas mileage will get better. I got 18 with 01 [5.4],less mileage probaly caused by AWD. Seems like this truck could pull your boat.Good luck
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Old 03-23-2007, 10:02 PM
 
 
 
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