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  #1  
Old 01-18-2007, 05:52 PM
steve-oh steve-oh is offline
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Now this is funny

I was reading in my Hot Rod this month:

"Displacement limited by it's modular V8s narrow boer spacing, Ford has struggled at times to stay in the horsepower wars, sometimes resorting to blowers to stay in the game. The Hurricane is an all new Ford engine family featuring pushrod technology."

Further:

The Hurricane could be introduced in the next generation F-150 pickups appearing around 2009".

The strange thing is I've read numerous posts from guys here trashing pushrod motors and the competition using this old technology?? I'm guessing that sentiment will oddly turn around and be forgotten when these new marvels arrive. Odd that with this leading edge technology in the current F-150 that Ford would copy the competitions designs? I think this goes to show the promises that the modular motors made have gone unfullfilled and only poor gas mileage and poor acceleration have been delivered.

Thinking about it, OHC motors are high revving motors making peak power at higher RPMs than pushrod motors. Trucks and musclecars need more power down low, not up high. That's the falacy of OHC motors in trucks.
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Old 01-19-2007, 01:16 AM
edgl edgl is offline
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Steve oh, you are so right! I have always been a fan of push rod motors. They are so easy to work on, and do not have miles of timing chains and guides.
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Old 01-19-2007, 02:27 AM
BigF350 BigF350 is offline
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adrian.erks.harris adrianerksharris
Its not funny, its dissapointing - I recall when the Hurricane was going to be an "everything" destroyer, DOHC, direct fuel injection etc.

And the statement regarding power down low is entirely false.
If you can find an engine that has as much torque at such low rpms as the 3V 5.4 with a similar displacement that is pushrod, by all means, be my guest...
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Old 01-19-2007, 02:43 AM
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If I've said ot once, I've said it 100 times...........cam placement has little to do with powerband.
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Old 01-19-2007, 02:48 AM
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Re-Views

I picked up a copy of the February issue of Truck Trends today, the issue the first of several tests of the two double uglies.

Tundra vs Silverado.

Gonna read it later this morning...y'all might want to pick up a copy to see which truck gets the more favorable revues.

Which truck is fuglier? it's a toss up.
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Old 01-23-2007, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve-oh
I think this goes to show the promises that the modular motors made have gone unfullfilled and only poor gas mileage and poor acceleration have been delivered.

Thinking about it, OHC motors are high revving motors making peak power at higher RPMs than pushrod motors. Trucks and musclecars need more power down low, not up high. That's the falacy of OHC motors in trucks.
Have you driven a V10? Comparing my two V10s against my two previous 460s, Im very happy with what Ford has done with its Modular motors. Better economy, towing, and overall performance is very impressive in my book. I cant speak for the other modular motors (except for the 2003 Mach 1 I test drove, WOW) but the V10 has been fantatic.
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Old 01-23-2007, 09:32 PM
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I have a 95 Lincoln Mark Vlll LSC, They come standard with the DOHC 4.6 that the cobras got in 96 and so on, The car does a high 14 and I get around 15-16 city and 30+ highway, 1 time I got 34 mpg at 75 for a steady 10 miles with cruise, Modular motors have proven themselves and I still believe the new hurricanes will be modular, pretty soon we will find out, everyones getting 400+hp motors in there trucks with displacement I doubt the number 1 selling truck will let the competition beat them in that category.
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Old 01-23-2007, 10:03 PM
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If we forget to look at the piston slap issue, lets look at what GM has done with their LS-1 series motors. More horsepower, better mileage. All with a pushrod motor with larger cylinder bores than the modular. Cam placement has nothing to do with power band. Cam timing, acceleration, and lift make the difference. It could be a pushrod motor, DOHC motor, or have little electric solenoids; it wouldn't make any difference. Where OHC motors have an advantage is high rpm's where you want to limit valvetrain mass so you dont break stuff. If GM wanted the low end torque thing, the could have it with a simple cam change.

"Displacement limited by it's modular V8s narrow boer spacing..."

I've been saying this for years! The bore size is too small. The formula for performance motors is large bore small stroke. A truck motor works good with about square dimensions, assuming enough displacement. IMHO 3.55" X 4.16" is just rediculous. Before anyone reminds me of the GT's motor, let me say I could re-cam a dump truck motor and strap a blower on it and make lots of horsepower. It does not make it the optimal solution.

I still think the ideal motor was discontinued 31 years ago.

Sorry for the rant. These are only my opinions and please take them as such.
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Old 01-24-2007, 12:23 AM
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adrian.erks.harris adrianerksharris
The bore size is too small.

For a NA motor, yes.
However I could sit here and argue, for towing purposes its about spot on.
For us loonies that only like positive manifold pressure, the small bore huge stroke of the 5.4l gives fantastic burn characteristics.

And the issue with pushrod motors isn't necessarily the valvetrain mass at higher rpms, but more all the linkages/rockers etc. Each which give a small deflection under a given force. This can allow substantial valve timing issues at higher rpms (to the point where valves and pistons may collide...
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Old 01-25-2007, 10:45 AM
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I never understood why they went with a 4 cylinders bore and a big blocks stroke on the 5.4. and i also agree with the blower statements. you can put a blower on any ls1 and it would blow any cobra off of the road (with the same psi and sorry to talk about cars on a truck forum). i think that the hurricane will need a 4in bore at least.
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Old 01-26-2007, 06:58 AM
steve-oh steve-oh is offline
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I have to admit I'm looking forward to Ford's return to the good old American pushrod V8. The import lovers will blast it but the pushrod designs deliver AT LEAST as much hp and with lower mechanical complexity. What's not to like about that ?
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Old 01-26-2007, 09:53 AM
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Don't count on pushrods..........regardless of the Hot Rod article.


Please explain your "complexity" statement.


And added cam (or 3)and longer chains vs 16 pushrods.

And while the Ford OHC set up does use a follower (rocker) and a tappet for preload (like a pushrod motor) some higher performance OHC motors have the cam right on the valve with a shim/bucket in between for adjustment.
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Last edited by IB Tim; 01-26-2007 at 05:37 PM.
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Old 01-26-2007, 11:01 AM
steve-oh steve-oh is offline
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The arguments here against pushrod motors would be more compelling if even Ford themselves believed in them. Do you find it curious that the implication is that a few guys on an enthusiast website know more about this than FMC does? I'd be more swayed that OHC is the way to go if there weren't examples of normally aspirated pushrod V8s making gobs of torque and 500+ horsepower, all without the use of expensive blowers.
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Old 01-26-2007, 09:02 PM
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I'd like to see a return of the pushrod engine. The GM and chrysler are capable of getting good numbers out of their pushrod motors. If Ford plans on making multivalve headed engines, then OHC is the way to go. But if they don't OHC just makes for a huge heavy engine.
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Old 01-27-2007, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve-oh
The arguments here against pushrod motors would be more compelling if even Ford themselves believed in them. Do you find it curious that the implication is that a few guys on an enthusiast website know more about this than FMC does? I'd be more swayed that OHC is the way to go if there weren't examples of normally aspirated pushrod V8s making gobs of torque and 500+ horsepower, all without the use of expensive blowers.
Not against pushrod motors one bit........in fact the GM LS motors are awesome!!! Even though that 500HP is a 427, the packaging is phenomenal.

And I agree that but for a few examples, Ford doesn't utilize the advantages that a 4 valve DOHC motor could offer.

But I still believe that a Variable valve 4 valve motor will make as much if not more power than a much larger displacement 2 valve motor. Ford's 5.4 Cobra R and Toy's new 5.7 come to mind....(even though the 5.4 doesn't use VVT)


And I will also concede that I don't understand Ford's past thinking concerning retooling for what could have been a killer OHC motor and saddle it with 2 valve wedge type chambers.

I know it was SUPPOSED to be an EPA thang.....

Useless trivia time.........the LS motors are about 10 years old. The NEWEST GM architecture is DOHC multivalve in the inline 5 and 6 cylinder motors.
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Old 01-27-2007, 02:44 AM
 
 
 
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