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Old 08-02-2006, 08:55 PM
paulc7045 paulc7045 is offline
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Vegtable oil questions

I am considering running vegtable oil in my 2003 f250 7.3. My questions relate to two different setups and if anyone has suggestions.

One setup I am considering is to run off-road diesel combined with vegtable oil on a 50/50 ratio. Will this ratio require additional diesel additive to boost the cetane level or am I ok as it is?

The next set-up is mixing vegtable oil with kerosene, unleaded fuel, diesel additive and running through a filter system. If thinned properly so as to not clog anything, is there any long-term effects to the engine that I should be aware of?

Thanks
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Old 08-02-2006, 11:37 PM
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Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
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If you look thru the multiple threads, on this forum, that address the concept of mixing Veg oil with a fuel oil of any sort, you will soon discover that it is a bad idea.

Veg oil is a very large heavy molecule; whereas, fuel oils are smaller and lighter. The two will not stay mixed.

Once seperation occurs what you are feeding the engine depends on which layer the fuel pickup is located in.

If it is in the fuel oil layer and the fuel is diesel (bio or petro) no problem. By the way running off road diesel may cost you more than your truck is worth if you get caught.

If it is the fuel oil layer and the fuel is kerosene you will not have adequate lubricity in the fuel: engine wear will be accelerated, fuel pumps will fail early, etc.

If it is in the Veg oil layer there are multiple problems that can and will occur including difficult starts, coking of rings and injectors, etc.

This topic is brought up over and over and I always wonder why bother to mix VO with anything.
If you want to run VO do it right spend the bucks to convert your truck and run VO.
The small investment will be recouped because you wont have to buy the offroad diesel or kerosene and you wont have to worry about destroying your $8000 engine.
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Old 08-02-2006, 11:47 PM
willbd willbd is offline
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Never put gasoline in a diesel engine.

The jury is still out on the long-term effects on a good heated WVO system.
On just blending WVO with diesel or gasoline you might get 25 to 50K out of your engine.


If you want to run WVO you need a 2 tank system. One tank with diesel and the other a tank with a heater installed in it. You need to start on diesel and get the engine warmed up before switching to WVO and then switch back to diesel before shutting down the engine.





Quote:
Originally Posted by paulc7045
I am considering running vegtable oil in my 2003 f250 7.3. My questions relate to two different setups and if anyone has suggestions.

One setup I am considering is to run off-road diesel combined with vegtable oil on a 50/50 ratio. Will this ratio require additional diesel additive to boost the cetane level or am I ok as it is?

The next set-up is mixing vegtable oil with kerosene, unleaded fuel, diesel additive and running through a filter system. If thinned properly so as to not clog anything, is there any long-term effects to the engine that I should be aware of?

Thanks
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Old 08-03-2006, 05:41 PM
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danny jones
How do you get "off road" diesel, and why use it? Is the price the only difference? How much kerosene can be SAFELY run with diesel?
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Old 08-03-2006, 07:15 PM
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f250juggernaut
Welcome to Ford Truck Enthusiasts paulc7045.

mongo75- Off road diesel is available through the pump at a lot of fuel stations. The difference between it and regular #2 is off road diesel is not taxed and is dyed red. You do not want to get caught running down the highway with red fuel in the tank.
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Old 08-04-2006, 08:39 AM
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danny jones
Roger that hehe. I think I'll play it safe on that one.
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Old 08-04-2006, 11:32 AM
ToddT ToddT is offline
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I'd suggest steering clear of off-road diesel use. That red dye goes a long way and will remain in your system long after you have quit using it. And the fine is too great.

I know guys who have been using a blend of WVO and diesel for pushing 100,000 miles. I am currently running 50/50 WVO/diesel in my main tank and straight WVO in the heated second tank. It all depends on the ambient temperature. I wouldn't do it in the winter but the summer time is fine. Some guys go up to 85% WVO in diesel though that is a bit much for my taste.

I haven't run the specific gravity tests on each but I've heard you can mix WVO and diesel or you can mix biodiesel and diesel... but you shouldn't mix WVO and biodiesel. I suspect the specific gravity of WVO and diesel are close enough to mix well with the WVO a little heavier. The diesel and biodiesel have close specific gravity numbers and mix well... with the bio a little lighter. But, the difference between WVO and biodiesel is too great and the WVO will drop out overnight.

Mercedes owner's manuals instruct the use of up to 15% gasoline in wintertime. Some gas in diesel is OK, but I'm chicken to experiment with a flammable fuel. The same is true regarding mineral spirits and kerosene.

Todd
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Old 08-04-2006, 01:22 PM
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Cut and pasted.....
From: Bob Falkiner
Newsgroups: alt.autos.macho-trucks,alt.energy.homepower,alt.energy.renewable,
rec.auto,rec.auto.tech,rec.autos.4x4,sci.energy,sc i.engr.heat-vent-ac
Subject: Re: Cetane rating in Diesel Fuel
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 1997 10:58:14 -0500

It is dangerous to mix gasoline into diesel, kerosene, fuel oils etc
because the vapour space above the liquid fuel in the tank becomes
explosive at normal ambient temperature. Normally, the vapour space in
a diesel tank is mostly air, and the mixture is too lean (not enough
fuel) to burn. Gasoline is the other way around. It is very volatile,
and the vapour space is mostly fuel vapour and is too rich to burn or
explode. These are the only two conditions under which it is safe to
handle either fuels. If you mix gasoline and diesel fuels together, the
vapour space becomes explosive, and any ignition source such as static,
wiring etc. could cause the tank to explode.

gasoline, naphtha, solvents etc should never be mixed with diesel fuels,
fuel oils, kerosene etc.
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Old 08-04-2006, 05:48 PM
paulc7045 paulc7045 is offline
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Thank you for the suggestions and I will stay clear of the off-road diesel. With the advice of a 2-tank system, any preference on whose kit would work the best?
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Old 08-04-2006, 11:20 PM
willbd willbd is offline
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Start with one of the sponsors for this website.... Lesk WVO conversions.

Bryan Will

Quote:
Originally Posted by paulc7045
Thank you for the suggestions and I will stay clear of the off-road diesel. With the advice of a 2-tank system, any preference on whose kit would work the best?
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Old 08-05-2006, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulc7045
Thank you for the suggestions and I will stay clear of the off-road diesel. With the advice of a 2-tank system, any preference on whose kit would work the best?
I believe in Plant Drive and the
technology they bring to the table. The Vegtherm alone is just one item
of many that puts Plant Drive ahead of all the rest. More people use
this in other vendors systems, since they all can't get the oil hot
enough fast enough, with coolant only.

The new Overnighter is also a industry leading filter warmer that will
allow you to switch over, far sooner in the winter months, then any
other kit out their.

Plant Drive has been in business for over 5 years most of their
components are warrantied for 5 years (Vegtherm, Vormax, Hotfox) the
rest 1 year.
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Old 08-05-2006, 11:52 PM
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Phydeaux88 Phydeaux88 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddT
I haven't run the specific gravity tests on each but I've heard you can mix WVO and diesel or you can mix biodiesel and diesel... but you shouldn't mix WVO and biodiesel. I suspect the specific gravity of WVO and diesel are close enough to mix well with the WVO a little heavier. The diesel and biodiesel have close specific gravity numbers and mix well... with the bio a little lighter. But, the difference between WVO and biodiesel is too great and the WVO will drop out overnight.Todd
Your assumption is incorrect

BioDiesel and Petro Diesel are almost identical in molecular size and weight and specific gravity.
Each VO molecule yields 3 BioDiesel molecules and 1 Glycerol molecule so its molecular weight is at least 3 times that of either Bio or Petro diesel
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Old 08-05-2006, 11:52 PM
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