I am getting a new 390 for my F-250(mine is internally damaged), and I would to know what I should get to add on. I was thinking something along the lines of a Edelbrock Performer RPM package... but it doesn't seem like you guys buy that package. What would I need for my own package type thing. I have a 4 barrel carb (holley 600cfm?) and an intake (edelbrock performer) what else should I get? What kind of cam? It is going to be a daily driver, offroad, whatever kind of rig. Should I look at getting new rods and pistons, new heads, machine work etc etc.? It needs to be daily driveable, not get to bad of gas mileage, and be some what inexpensive. I want to get the most out of it i possibly can for now.

TIA
Jake

 

I am not expert however I can help. The performer rpm i great and well respected here, but it is for midrange 3600+ rpm so many like my self tend to build for lowend torque. The edlebrock performer is great flows a little better thatn the stock intake I understand. However I am looking a porting the stock intake. Factory iron 4 barrel intakes can be great for low range up to 3500 if you know how to use a die grinder and also more importantly know how to do a "good" port job. I will have the help of my uncle who used to build up German HOt Rods in the U.S and is teaching me the art of porting. When you port you are trying to increase air speed not volume. By porting the heads and intake correctly you increase air velocity boosting low end torque. I prefer the keep all my torque down low because I like to use all mly torque all the time and having your torque higher rpms uses more fuel and shortens engine lift but this is such a tough engine that most are happy to get 100,000 miles so they revf motors up.

I'd say put some 2.08/1.65" valves in, a low end stump pulling cam to give you some good torque form 1500-3500 and if you geared it right then 3500 rpm should be enough. If you want more Rpm stretch your torque out; 1500-4500 rpm but you will have less especially when going from the 108/110 LSA to a 114 or 116LSA but still makes an excellent motor and wider LSAs are said to get better gas mileage than narrower LSA. With that said you can just run low gears and the factory Np 435 was pretty low get some 4.11 or 4.56 if you have dana 60s and you have plenty of torque. I am still on your level when it comes to the cam specs seat to seat and .050, but I think you should aim for a cam with a mild 2.5-3.5 lifter accelleration rate( you need desk top dyno or similar to figure that out I think). I think that most cams on the market are very mild for any duturaiton but mild last longer for intance you might build an engine that last 400,000 miles but the very aggressive valve train did not and you replaced cam twice, lifters three times, and springs every three weeks and the valve train was very expensive, mabe the cheaper stuff last longer. I was gong to build a 302 with solid grinds of 6. lifter accelleratin rate but it would cost me probably over $750 and would not last as long as my short block. I might get over 100,000 miles out of a good stock or mild grind made by a reputable name and only spend $230 on the valve train.
This is very long but these are some of my mistakes. I would suggest that if you build a mild motor for any displacement and have low gears in the rear end your engine would cost less and last longer and have enough torque to break anyghing smalller than dana 60s. Have a torque band up to 4500 if you are criusing 3500 rpm because it does not work to cruise outside of your torque. I'd say if it will do 70 mph at 3500 then you will have enough cruising ability and good torque but be sure to get more than my opinion especially on the engine. And have fun with a healthy 390 4 barrel with headers under the hood.
Do not forget to get help on the camshaft...

 

Is this you first engine build?

If you have dana 60s then you will not break them.

I am thinking unless you or someone you know is good with the die grinder find an emgine machine shop to put i the 2.08/1.65 valves in along with a full port job. Compare what they chargh to port the intake to just buying a good performer, I think I say one for $100 on Fort truck enthusiast classifides.

I like stock cast pistons but you are better off with hyperautic aluminum, cast are not good, I just use them because my build buget is at $1200. Clevite 77 barings are good just ask Smokey Yunick. I like to use Molly rings they reduce friction. There are some oiling mods people like to do, I am not up on them at the moment but I understand that the oil flow returning to the oil pump can be more important than the oil pumping out. (Get help on this).

I am investing in a good distributer-you should too. If you like points you can get a great points distributer for $160 I think, I am going with a Unilite magnetic advance for $220 to work with a MSD 6al module. I prefer mechainical advance some prefer vacume advance, but I despise vacume lines.

 

I think the Performer RPM package would be too much for what you're trying to do. It would make good HP, but it would also come with a loss of low end torque and mileage. It would turn it into too much of a "race" motor.

Here's the build I recommend:

1. Some port cleanup on the heads, like smooth things out, clean up the valve pocket, polish the exhaust ports, gasket match the intake, smooth up the short side radius, things like that. Dont "hog them out" though. On these heads it makes a huge difference, and a little work goes a long way. Also, I feel that standard 2.02" x 1.55" valves would be plenty on this motor.

2. Keith Black KB150 hypereutectic pistons in whatever oversize you need.

3. Crane 343902 cam and lifter kit

4. Adjustable rockers and new shafts from Clevite. I prefer to order them through Napa. Even though they're new, be sure to check the rocker to shaft clearance, unless you want an oil burner. This adjustable setup may not be necessary, but I feel it's a lot safer than hoping the non-adjustable setup works correctly after you grind valve seats, put a new cam and lifters in it. This way you can set lifter preload accurately and eliminate the guesswork.

5. Comp #7533-16 pushrods. These will work with your adjustable rockers.

6. Stock 4 barrel intake manifold

7. Holley 600cfm vacuum secondary carburetor

8. Headers. The stock exhaust manifolds do not flow well at all. They are a major restriction. Get a set of headers with a good thick flange. I also recommend matching exhaust pipe size after the headers to the header collector diameter, and placing the muffler as close to the headers as possible, to prevent water from condensing in it.

9. ARP rod bolts. Considering the damage a broken rod bolt can cause, this is a good investment.

10. Some type of aftermarket ignition - see above. Although if you have the duraspark ignition, that should work fine.

Edit: Oh, what year is your F250? If it's before 1972, you need to get hardened exhaust valve seats installed so you can burn unleaded gas.

Re-edit: Get the book "How to Rebuild Big-Block Ford Engines" by Steve Christ, ISBN #0-89586-070-8. This is required reading. You must do it. Do not pick up one tool or even touch the engine until you read this book. Read it cover to cover three times (I'm serious about this) before you even think about starting.

 

how about rods? are stock good? its going to be a brand new crate from Jones Engines in Spokane by the way. What type of aftermarket ignition? What all should I get with the ignition? What oversize should I shoot for for the pistons?

Thanks

 

Stock rods are bulletproof with ARP bolts. The only time you'd replace them is if you're running a stroker crank with BBC rod journals, or you're spinning the thing more than 8500rpm, or in the off-chance that one is damaged beyond repair (like spun bearing or bent).

I'll leave the ignition question to others on here. I will say I've had good luck with Mallory Unilite distrubutors, provided two conditions are met. One, you NEVER hook the thing up backwards, and two, you get their "active power filter" to go with it. Their modules are a bit touchy. Other than that, it's a very good unit.

On the pistons, you should only bore the block as much as is needed to clean up the bores. The piston oversize will follow. For instance, a block that wont clean up at .020" over will need to go to the next size, .030". If .030" doesn't do it, .040" or .060". You should look up what oversizes your selected pistons are available in before you have the block bored so you're not stuck.

Edit: Does "brand new crate engine" mean you get what you get? Do you have any say in what is going into this motor? Do they offer a warranty? If so, what do they cover? Is oil usage covered?

 

EDIT:
Well I think Jones Engines will build engines. I am not 100% sure but I have heard that they do. I am going to call them tomorrow and see if they can build it for me. I beleive its like a 5 year/ 50,000 warranty... can't remember exactly but its close to that. I know that's just for a straight up 390 with like an rv cam.

 

The link to their site is http://www.jonesautoengines.com/

 

Would a .060 bore kill my motor? I have read that that's the most recommended on a street motor.

 

Yeah, if you could take my build recommendations down to them and have them build one just like that, then that would be perfect!

On the overbore: I must ask, why? You dont gain many cubes, you lose cylinder wall strength, the engine runs hotter, and you cut down the number of future rebuilds with that block. Just go far enough to clean up the cylinder walls, and up to the next oversize piston. Example: If your block would clean up at .020" but your selected pistons are only available in .030" oversize, then bore the block .030". If they were available in .020", then do that. Now, a .060" overbore would probably be fine for a 390 block, even more so if it's a mirror 105 block, but just go as far as needed.

 

Alrighty then sounds like a good plan is my edelbrock intake and holley 4 barrel going to cut it? or should i upgrade those?

 

It's the regular Performer right? Yeah, those will work fine.

Oh, and that book I mentioned, have THEM read it!

One more thing before I forget. Make sure their warranty covers oil usage.

 

try to avoid any crate motor or rebuilds with truck pistons, the compression will be high 7's and not worth a damn. Kurt's, recommendation is the best bang for buck. I think the forged trw are like $400 a set. On the other hand, cast pistons are not worth a damn. The skirt's break to easy. I have seen some cast pistons out of a bone stock 302 that had broken rings lands. The motor had some mild racing, 2 man.

I had to go cheap on my last tear down and i regret it, i recommend getting a bank loan if it takes it. Currently I am relying a stock 3/8 rod bolts, cast pistons, stock pushrods. I might be throwing 370-380hp on the rod bolts and they have held up. Ford happened to put 13/32? bolts in the 428cj's, maybe they know something.

I always recommed an arp oil pump driveshaft or anything better than the stock toothpick.

I feel the duraspark can handle 6000+ rpm just fine, a single point setup is around 5000rpm max.


Someday, i will get around to getting new rod bolts, better pistons, shim head gasket, new pushrods, a bigger cam, more porting on the heads. Just takes time and $$$$.

 

The KB150 pistons I recommended are hypereutectic. The forged TRW's (L2291) might make the dynamic compression ratio too high with a Crane 343901 cam. If anyone's tried this, be sure to let us know how it worked!

Ford did put 13/32" rod bolts in the CJ's, but it's been argued that this made the rod around the bolts too thin. I still think ARP bolts are by far the best bet. But the fact that Ford did something here does show the deficiency of their stock 3/8" rod bolts. And plus, after 30+ years, they probably are due for replacement anyway.

Definately agreed on the ARP oil pump drive shaft. Good catch.

I think the single point setup is good far beyond 5000rpm if a good set of points is used. I recommend Blue Streak.

 

Looks like i am going to have some extra money should I look into a set of aluminum heads?